The topic of From Relapsing to Helping Others in Recovery at the 2022 Annual National Conference of Drug Addicts Anonymous in Milwaukee, WI

Holiday,

My name is Chris Raymer. Very grateful. Recovered drug addict.

Look at this old crowd. Hey, it's, it's like 10:30 in the morning. Y'all know that right? The only people that show up here are the people that have been up all night long. That's it. That's yeah, God thinks good to see you And, and

God, I'm a little, I'm a little kind of overwhelmed. I need to tell you it's I, I got sober in Alcoholics Anonymous. I'll talk a little bit about that guys. But I mean, I'm, I'm a, I'm a huge fan of drug addicts Anonymous. I have a little Home group in Ingram, TX

for good and for all group and you know, actually kind of belong to a bunch of little DAA groups down there and sitting here watching y'all.

I get to speak a lot guys. I speak around a lot, a lot of a a, you know, you'll do the little talk before.

Just look around and everybody be whispering at each other and you know, this looks like Jerry Springer this morning. You know,

same time here looking in here and everybody's just 10,000 miles an hour. And I know it's, you know,

some of y'all are probably loaded, but I mean, I think it's

no a lot of coffee and energy drinks, but just a lot of excitement, you know, and that's, that's what drew me to Drug Addicts Anonymous. It's just what it's my first drug Addicts Anonymous meeting was in England for heaven sakes. And I was over there doing a talk over there and at that group and it's just, it's just a different bunch of folks. And I knew a bunch of people there that had started it and got excited about it there in England. And, and God, I've been excited about it ever since. We're finally getting organized in this country. It's taking us some years

guys, but here we are so I God bless y'all. I where can I start with this? As always, I want to mention,

I

thank the committee, bless you guys for asking God. It's all of you guys that paid for admissions to come and donated for this, that and the other. Thank you for doing it. It's because it's travel is a, is a bear cause a lot of y'all know that. But I mean, the cost of the ticket to get me from Texas, I could have fly to Europe, you know, two years ago and then today it's, you know, it's, it's just nuts. It's brutal. So anybody that can help participate in that way financially, I thank you very much. If you go to the hospitality room, drop a dollar in the little bucket. You, you little knucklehead.

OK, but I sure appreciate my host. Pick me up and I got here in one piece and and the trick will be in the morning to see if they get me back. That'll be to the airport.

That's always that. Yeah. I've never been not picked up, but I have. I've had several situations where I didn't get taken back.

Folks in recovery, folks, we are a sensitive bunch.

You know, I'll say this going in the door, guys going please. As always, when I share, I'm going to share. This morning I'm watching the clock. It's on the side. I can see it's right here.

I'm watching at 10:30. I'll be done before. OK? Yeah, yeah. I'm going to share my experience, guys. My experience is all maybe completely different than your experience, and that's perfectly OK. Doesn't have to be my way guys. If what you're doing is working

high 5, buddy. I mean,

yeah, have a just a wonderful life. I just think that's the best. And I, I get emails from people all over the world, folks that can identify with what I'm talking about. There's a lot of us that struggle with this. And it's, it's not near as complicated as people want to make it. But I want to share some of that. And this is part of my story. And if it makes you uncomfortable, I'm sorry. I'm not taking anybody's inventory. And just, you know, if you're doing 90 meetings and 90 days and that's keeping you sober, just rock on. That's that's that's the coolest.

No, I'm just joking.

It is.

It is

maybe

it's been so good. See some of you guys I haven't seen in years. I got some cats that I've seen it and I mean, God's all over this. I need to tell you it started Friday. I had to I had to do a little workshop on Thursday and in town and before I work, I work at the treatment center and I've been there for guys forever and and I do clerical work for this place and and we had this long drawn out deal and it was it was nice and but drawn drawn out it was took forever. And I'm in San Antonio. We got a little condo downtown San Antonio and I

there because I'm flying out at the butt crack yesterday. You know, I had to be at the airport at 4:00 in the morning and, and I just, you know, so I spend the night there. So it's just a 15 minute drive instead of a 60. Ingram's like 65 miles West of San Antonio. I'm up in the hills and I'm walking down the street because that's what I do to, you know, I'm walking, I'm looking at the architecture, all the little homeless guys downtown and, and it's just, we're just a few blocks from a homeless shelter and down there with a pocket full of ones. And I'm just, you know, just visiting, you know, walking down the deal and I see this guy coming at me and he goes

and I look at him and recognize him. He's been to treatment the place I'd worked for a while back and, and was doing pretty good until he wasn't. Yeah, it got loaded and they kicked him out of the halfway house and he's heading back. What are the odds that I'm walking down this street and I walk into this guy in downtown San Antonio

and I've seen that several times here. What are the odds? All of a sudden I hadn't seen you and all of a sudden we're getting the hook up for people that have been. That's what this whole thing is about. If you don't hear anything else I'm saying during this little hour, guys, please hear this. That's exactly what this is about. If you stay around long enough,

and I don't mean sit in the corner and not say anything, but I mean actually push yourself to be a part of this a little bit, you're going to these are my peeps. I hadn't been here 15 minutes and every everyone eyed blind guy in the place and come in every success

representative come and come on. And I I mean, I love it. It's just like, oh, these are my peeps. You know, you look at my phone and I've got them like that. So and so and so so, so when I got so and I said one eye guy,

I take little notes because I'm getting old, you know, but yeah, it's just the coolest. And I'm the sad part is I know there's a lot of people out there and all of our 12 step fellowships that are not experiencing what we're experiencing today. You know, everybody thinks they, they're not guys. I get nonstop with it. I've just got to say it. You know, I've been in the industry I'm in. And of course I got lots of people calling, lots of people coming into treatment, you know, and they look around and they see the steps on the wall. And so my God, I thought this was going to be different

saying I said, why? What's up? She's man. I've tried the 12 step stuff. I've been a a it's just it doesn't work.

OK. And then I talked to him for a few minutes and find out that exactly what I did for seven years and Alcoholics nom they didn't do Jack. All they did was go to a bunch of meetings. Not one place in this book does it say go to a bunch of meetings and you'll stay sober. I'm not knocking it. It's a part of this y'all. It's just it's not the solution.

What freaks me out is these are the same people that want to defend their right to do it wrong.

Like really man, come at this with an open mind guys that maybe I don't know it all. I'm still to this day guys. If I don't do anything stupid in a couple of months, I'll have 35 years of sobriety.

But I'm the guy that couldn't get 30 days of sobriety in seven years. But it's but it's the same thing in 30 years. I just continue to try to grow. I continue to try to learn new things.

That's why I go to the panels And that, you know, I get, I want to be in the rooms when other people are speaking because you're always hear something cool. Oh shit, I never thought of that. You know, after all this time, that's what this is about. That spiritual path we were just talking about is open and ever evolving

man. I'm not. I don't want to live off a spiritual experience I had 35 years ago. 34 we don't front here. OK, I guess

it it could happen, but you know,

I I was born at Odessa, TX oil fields. My father was a printer out there and and I got hit an hour rock when I was about 6060 in 1964. And then we moved to the Hill Country soon after that and and dad like water. And then, you know, this was when Texas still had some water and we don't anymore. It's unbelievably dry down there. You know, no kidding. I was out there earlier sitting I'm looking around and getting somebody says, oh, I wish the weather was nicer for you. You know, welcome. I said, buddy, this is heaven.

What are those things up there? Those can use clouds,

but it's nasty in Texas right now. But we got to the Hill Country and I've got an identical twin brother that's some of y'all know Myers and he and I caught the bullet. I've got two sisters that never had a problem with alcohol or drugs. I thought they could, they could smoke a little joint or drink a little wine and then never have a problem at Christmas time. We're always, come on, drink up, you know, and we've been trying to get them drunk for years.

I have experience with this. I can show you how to do this better. No, no, don't. Thank you. I'm starting to feel it.

We used to say, yeah, me too. And your point is, let's do it. No, they don't want to do that, guys. This is why it just gets we were raising them. Believe it, the Beaver family. Y'all follow up. Mom was a professional artist. We were very, she was very progressive at the time. We were raised with lots of different people in our houses and just just, it was a wonderful upbringing. Pops was the hardest worker. I've got his work ethic, you know, I guess he was an alcoholic.

Caught that bullet, guys. We got to all get straight with it. This majority of this is genetic, Yes. If you're raised by a pack of wolves, that can affect you,

OK, but I'm but I feel like equal opportunity. I need to stand up and tell you I was not raised by a pack of wolves and I still turn out to be an alcoholic and a drug addict. It's just we spend a lifetime listening to people in treatment want to point a finger and blame why they're an alcoholic and addict. That stuff exacerbated the problem, made it worse. It did not 'cause it

genetics got y'all you. Yeah, this is fun for a long time, and then it becomes not so fun, and then it becomes a nightmare.

And when it becomes a nightmare, you're still doing it. You might want to look at this, folks. Gen. Ned X eggy little spermy come in and get you.

If they can drop the F bomb from up here, I can talk about little spermies, OK?

Oh man, we ended up

high school.

I got a job early on because we wanted to buy a car and that kind of stuff. We didn't have a lot of money in our family and hindsight looking back, we were, we were churchmouth poor, but but I got a job bussing tables at a place and then started cooking at this little place and I was like 16 years old, 16. This is before child labor laws came along and they could work your littles butt off and I is pretty cool. And

me and a friend went down on the river and drank a bottle of Boones farm apple wine. He stole it. I don't know where he got it, but y'all was just like a regular little small bottle

and he took a couple of sips and said he didn't want anymore. And I made sure that he meant that when he said it because I just drink enough to We finally hit my bloodstream. I said, this is pretty good. I'm going to see what this is about. And I drank the bottle and I didn't get squashed. I'm just sitting guys. It was January 1971. It was the month that Bill Wilson, the co-founder of Alcoholics Anonymous, passed away. I took my first drink and I remember walking across that field, a big old full moon up there and, and, and cold out there on the field. And I'm just thinking This is why pop strings.

I understood. It's first time in my little young adult life that I ever felt comfortable in my skin and I've heard every speaker talk about it. Y'all understand, guys? Alcohol and dope is not the problem, it is the solution.

There's a great line on 155 Bill Wilson's talking about. Doctor Bob says he had a much knowledge about himself, but he didn't understand fully what it meant to be an alcoholic. I'm paraphrasing. Yeah. No, kid. Yeah, I called myself for years, I'll call it guys. I didn't know what that meant. And cut to the chase because I want to cover some stuff here, but I am. High school football. We drink sometimes we drink too much. But you know, no, I'm not getting any kind of trouble. I'm showing up to work every day. I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing. Graduated.

Sort of I did, but at the very bottom, I took my SAT's on LSD.

I just, I thought it would be a great idea, you know, I mean, they didn't appreciate it at all. But anyway, there was a period of time, guys, I got to tell you, growing up there, my senior year of high school, there was a the summer before and that was the Saint, you know, right after I started drinking and there was a bunch of arrests. There's been a narcotics agent

running around the Hill Country. Y'all remember 13th floor elevators?

The musicians.

Oh, come on, guys, there's like 3 heads nodding out. The rest of you were losers. You need to lift it up. Y'all need to Google it. Yeah. This guy. Oh my God. They were the they were the bot psychedelic rock'n'roll. They, they lived in the town where I lived. They started right there in Central Texas. Anyway, when we're out there, you know, tearing it up out there, you could go to the bowling alley on any night of the week and buy pot by heroin, by LSD, mescaline. You could buy any drug you wanted. I couldn't buy alcohol. I'm not old enough. If you'll follow. We had to get somebody over and over and

other part of town to buy it for us. But we yeah, it was nuts, folks. And then all these people, it was 64 sealed indictments and all these people got arrested. I'll never forget that night. I'm sitting on the side of my bed. It's about 11:00 at night and, and all you can hear down there in the in the valley policeman sirens because they they issued all the executed all these warrants all at one time. I mean, it was, it was. I mean, some of y'all's butts are fucking right now, even though

I intend to trigger some of you. But yeah, yeah,

but that's what I was doing. I'm sitting there sucking up cushions on to thinking, Oh my God. You know, I said please, God, don't let me die. Don't look, I don't want to be arrested, you know? And we were out there smoking pot with everybody in that everybody that got arrested, we knew y'all understand we've been partying with for some reason we didn't get arrested. Not not a clue how. I mean, thank you, Jesus. I mean, I we just didn't. And and I remember making a deal with God the next morning, the sun comes up and we didn't get arrested. And I said, God, OK, I promise you, absolutely. I'll never do a drug again

because drugs are bad

and I didn't for a long time. Guys I drank, went to went to Houston, was in a food business and it was a restaurant again. I'm my little work ethics are awesome and

I'm climbing the ladder. I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing out there and it's all working good. And and I start this is like by the late 70s, I'm starting to experience this thing called depression. A lot of you guys in here want to talk about your clinical depression. Let me assure you for most of you in here, not everybody but 95,

99,

I'll go back, 95% of you is not clinical. It's it's untreated alcoholism,

number one symptom. Everybody thinks I'm going to be so good because I'm going to get sober. OK, But if you just don't drink and don't do anything else, y'all understand? A lot of nodding heads. Can I get a witness? Bill Wilson talks about I'm 64. Bill Wilson talks about this, this spiritual malady. When the spiritual malady is overcome, we straighten out physically and mentally. But nobody wants to talk about that. Only thing book says you got to stop breaking one day at a time. That book never says that, not once.

No I'm sorry. Some of our literature talks about one day that y'all understand. It says we live life a day at a time.

All right, I'm like that guy. We were just talking about splitting hairs. I know that. I'm sorry, OK,

And I'm seeing doctors and starting to get some medication and, and I'm moving around a little bit. Some of you guys maybe have done that geographic, you know, because I'm convinced if I could just move here, I'd be OK. I'll never forget calling my mom one night late and I says, I'm, I got to get out of Houston. I'm drinking a little bit too much. And, and I just, she said, well, where do you want to go? And she was going to send me some money and, and so I could move. And I said, well, I'm thinking about Austin, TX, and this is back in the day Home in the Armadillos

and this, Oh my God,

who knew? They drank and did drugs in Austin, TX. I mean, I don't know. And I got a job at a big old Country Club. There's sous chef at this place. And I mean, it was I'm, you know, on the outside, everything looking pretty good, you know, on the inside, I'm dying and I'm not a happy camper. It was Austin for a couple years. Moved to Atlanta, GA and couldn't stay there because I didn't sell booze on Sundays. It was stupid.

I moved back to Texas. Oh, it's the, you know, I'm in the restaurant business. I need to get out of the restaurant business. Started doing some other things,

new sales, you know, salesman, they drink too and, and it's nuts. I'm changing stuff around and I can't, I can't, I'm holding it together pretty good though, guys, You all understand. I'm not getting a lot of trouble. I'm just, I'm miserable. It's sooner or later it talks about in the book, you're going to get to a place where you can't imagine life living with it. You can't imagine life living without it. Guys, if it was still working like it did for me when I was 18, I'd still be doing it. It's just, it's, it stops working,

You know, that little window of opportunity is, is. Oh my God.

And I got married and one of my geographics went back to Houston, TX and and met this little girl and she was a waitress at this place. I, you know, worked and I, I don't we just yeah. And we got married. She was a sweetheart. And I drug her up to North Texas to be closer to my twin brother and got a job at a Country Club and we bought a little house and with a mortgage that you wouldn't believe. You all understand? Just yeah, I got to be a semi new pickup truck. That's, that's the Holy Trinity in Texas, right? Job girl pick up truck.

Yeah,

it's the same here too. Trust me. I but we went out and and everything was pretty good. But I'm I'm not a happy camper under my wife's guidance. And she suggested that I'm not going to see a doctor about this depression. And the docs again, same thing. I've got good doctors and they're prescribing antidepressants and you know, I'm not being straight with them about the alcohol. I'm telling them I'm drinking, but I'm not telling them how much, for heaven's sakes. You know, no sense in that

because it doesn't make it's not going to make any difference. And

if I was just depressed when I drank it it'd be one thing y'all understand. But when I stopped drinking it gets worse. So I'm all confused. I'm all these medications and

this is early 80s and

oh, my God, everybody in the world, folks, was doing cocaine. Miami Vice, people that didn't do drugs was doing drugs. OK? You couldn't go to a wedding without doing drugs. Cocaine, cocaine, coke. Yeah, we all thought we were Don Johnson little drug runners. We everybody.

I still hear that song on the radio. Everyone. Oh, man. Yeah. And it triggered me. No,

we're doing cocaine and I'm with this guy. And anyway, we've done some had some beers at work and done a little bit outside issue stuff went home how to push and match with my wife. I don't remember what the fight was about, but I came back a few hours later. I she'd asked me to leave and and.

Again, I come from a family, we don't do that nonsense. There was no touching anybody angrily like that. And I apologized and she let me back in the house and she I told her the truth. I told her she didn't know about the cocaine. She knew our checking account was nothing but she didn't know about the cocaine and and y'all know how funny that is about drugs. Oh my God, I had never been in a pawn shop in my life as long as I was drinking. Once I started doing drugs, you'll follow.

Who knew that they would give you $5 for a for a a electric shaver? Oh my God,

the things we do I know. And

I promised her I'd stop and I can't share it. I don't care what fellowship I'm sharing in guys. I can't share it with this without saying it. When I looked her in the eyes with tears and begged her forgiveness that night for acting like a poot and promised her I was going to stop drinking and drugging. I meant it with every fiber in my body.

You need to hear it, folks. There's always somebody. Want to make a joke of it? You little Alcoholics and addicts? Boy, if your mouse moving your lion, you need to bite my ass

'cause that's not true folks. Everybody wants to paint pictures that were all a bunch of misfits because we're alcoholic and addict. That is not my experience. There's some misfits out there. Y'all understand? There was a book out there written. It was one of the great little quote in there and says we're not different than other drinkers or druggers. We're not different than other people. We're different than other drinkers and druggers.

Response to alcohol and drugs is different than somebody else, Lafala. But other than that, I'm just like everybody else. Some of you little guys, you can't, you can't find as much success in your life because you continue to want to blame everything that's wrong in your life on your alcoholism and drug addiction. Quit.

I got a guy and sponsor right now that's cheating on his wife. You know what? He wants to play. Well, what do you expect? I'm a drug addict. This has got nothing to do with nothing. You're a dirty dog. That's what you are. OK,

let's go. Let's, let's. Yeah,

Can we run a black?

I was sober for a week, week and a half, came home and had a beer with a chef after work, patting myself on the back because I didn't get drunk. We didn't do none of that nasty cocaine And and I,

she packed, she smelled on my breath and that was it. And

I'm a mess, folks. I go back to alcohol, tsunamis, and I spent the next seven years in and out of a a I'm, I'm, I was in and out of Narcotics Anonymous. We didn't have any DAA at the time. And I'm, you know, every time I'd come in again with the motivation, I'm going to do it this time. I can do this right, Right. And then here, this is my story. If I say anything in here, they'll make any of you uncomfortable. This is it. I'm just saying, you walk in and they beat you on the cheeks and you're the most important person here. You keep coming back. Everything going to be OK? And I'm sitting there for an hour listening to you tell stories

I can't identify with. Y'all understand? I'm not smoking crack. I'm not doing some of that. Like I hear people in treatment all the time. It's all the same thing.

No, listen,

no no. If you think it's the same thing, sit down with a with a with an alcoholic and do his first step. And then sit down next to a little crackhead and do his first step.

The what

with a chicken? No,

Oh my God, I'm in and out the nicest people in the world, guys. But every time I come back in, they're trying to scare me back in with her stupid war stories always followed by well meaning people. OK, like, but you don't want to end up like me, do you? And let me tell you what happened. And I went to prison 15 times and I chopped up 20 people and put them in plastic bag and I've been in this and I've done that. Y'all fall and it's like who? Who? Hey, you know, and I'm sitting there thinking I can't possibly be an alcoholic or I'm not knocking your story, guys. OK, Friday night, tell a story. I understand that. I'm just saying every time a newcomer comes back in,

they didn't get scared off the for 20 times they came in. What do you make you think they're going to do it this time? Oh my God, I finally remembered he ate out of a dumpster and I quit drinking. That's not

it's never happened guys. If you could connect it with the symptoms, maybe you could get some headway here, but they didn't do that. Nicest people on earth. Fuck, I'd sit in there, arms folded, scowl on my face, waiting to be offended so I can leave

in and out, picking up chips. Just in and out.

I'd leave and hear the old bastard at the table. You know, I knew that little one I got wasn't ready.

Feeling the love here now. Yeah. Yeah, 87.

I'm I've discovered the substance called methamphetamine.

I've always been wired a little fast.

I laugh about it. Guys on the podium, we can just talk about it like that. I mean, I just that's yeah, some of you know, I know we got a little opiate, a lot of opiate addicts in here and I just, you know, little potheads. I don't. This does not look fun.

Oh, oh,

it's three. It's 3:00 in the morning and I've got a toaster and I'm going to fix this thing and it's

Let's go,

let's get some shit done

and I'm drinking and I'm doing all this anyway and but I'm a miserable undercut. The medications are not working. I'm on 7 prescription medications a day and these are all doctor prescribed. I'm not out there doctor shopping like some of you losers.

I have some legitimate legitimate ailments here.

Turned out to not be legitimate. Y'all thought it turned out to be untreated alcoholism and drug addiction. I just say it. But anyway, I got, came home, picked up a stack of return checks and my little ratty apartment and, and just was done guys.

And I've been in a a for seven years. I'm on all these medications. I've, I've done everything you've ever asked me to do. If I've done therapy, I'm an IO. PS I'm, I've done all my triggers list and I've done everything I'm supposed to do. And I'm not making fun of that. I'm just making fun of it. God damn it.

God Dang, I don't.

And

again, we continue to talk about alcoholism and drug addiction is a disease that we want to treat it like it's a behavioral problem.

If I could stop myself from using folks, I would have done it a long time before now.

I'll never forget crawling out of a dumpster when I was young, young, young, eating some chicken. That's why I hate cats, because I always had to fight a cat for my I wasn't living on the street guys. I had an apartment, but I didn't have enough for drugs and food. So, you know, you go to did you do what you got to go do. I remember looking myself in the rearview mirror again, looking, thinking, God Dang it, if my dad could see me now, you know, I just, there was some low spots, folks. There was plenty of reason to stop.

Unfortunately didn't have the answer of how to stop

because everybody still believes, oh this is a disease, but if you really want it bad enough, you can get it. I don't get too poops how bad you want it or how bad you need it. If somebody doesn't tell you how to get well, you're not going to get well.

If you're the real alcoholic or the real drug addict, y'all understand it, guys, I've said it from a million podiums, you little dope beans hiding out and Alcoholics Anonymous coming over to a A, y'all are never going to hurt us. The people in a a that are going to be hurt or the people, we call them hard drinkers. They didn't have to work the steps. All they got to do is come in there and share their opinions about nothing they they they've had any experience with. And there you go. I've seen it at that, and we see it in in. Yeah,

man, what a world we would live in if you could just talk about stuff you've got experience with.

How many of y'all have ever been to a meeting like that? We're going to talk about the four step today. And the first little guy said, well, you know, I've never actually done a four step, but

we'll shut them down at our group. No time out. Bye, bye. Now we know. No, we'll talk later.

Not gonna, not gonna do that.

I ended up with these guys. I walked in the door and a little girl stopped me from leaving. I got real self-conscious and she stopped me. She's about 19 years old. She sat me down on a chair. She's a sit down cowboy. You're not going anywhere. Her sponsor was across the way and couldn't get to me.

She didn't sponsor me. You'll understand. I asked her. She said no.

Some of you in here have an idea who who you think is going to help you. The truth of the matter is on this spiritual path, you got no idea who God's going to use to change something in your life. And for me that night, it was a little 19 year old girl that set me down in a chair and wouldn't let me leave because if I'd have left, I'd have died. I'm less than 24 hours away from a suicide attempt. Y'all follow she, she was just as kind as could be. Got me a cup of coffee and some paper towels. Clean up the mess. And you know, and that was it. Chairperson had seen me in North Texas,

looked up and again, I've been a A and NA for years and this guy seen me around. He said, God Dang, we got a newcomer coming back and he's been around a long time. And and why don't we tell, tell Chris how our lives have changed as a result of working the steps?

What, what, what like I said up. I was like, what? I never heard that as a topic. You all understand. I heard because I was ready for it. Caught me off guard. Let's tell case how we got here.

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, but I'm going to. I don't give.

I don't give two Poots how you got here. Nothing personal, I just don't care.

It's because it's all about me.

They went around guys and I got

lady Catachornic. I can't not talk about it. She's she was got her a car. She's about, you know, a little better than years over and had a car keys and she was jingling car keys that she had a brand new car in a parking lot. She got her a brand new ride and I just been turned down two months earlier for a $500 car loan to buy a newer old pickup. Yeah, one where the windows would roll all the way up. You know, that's

got turned down and, and here this little girl got her, got her brand new car. This guy next to it started a little landscape business.

He was all excited. It started, Yeah,

lady at the end of the table. She was older. I was 35 when I got. So she she was in her 40s and she had gone back to art school and she got her degree and she was all excited about. She had a little sketch pad. She's sitting meetings and sketch like some people knit the meetings and she'd sketch and it just

love in her life. And I'm a big art fan. I come from a family of artists. I'm just talentless, you know? But here I am. I'm looking. Oh my God, you went back to school, you know,

got next to me jumps, jumping because he I can't see him coming. He's,

he's got his billfold open and he shows me these little Polaroid pictures of his kids and he come to a A and married this little girl and a, a boy meets a, a girl on a, a campus, you know, and they got married and had a couple little kids. And he's sitting there crying in that meeting, talking about his his family,

and I'm less than 24 hours away from trying to commit suicide in a little dirty apartment with two stinky ferrets and a dead Ivy

stack of bills. Y'all. These people gave me the one thing I needed more than anything, which was hope.

Dad, Gummet, that's what we're supposed to be doing in these rooms. Please hear me say this again. You cannot scare a drug addict into recovery. You might scare him into treatment, you might scare him into the rooms, but you are not going to scare them into doing this work. We're all different folks. But the thing that ties us all together in this room, look at it. God damn, got some beautiful people in here. We got some butt ugly people in here. We got

1000 pronouns.

I don't know.

I don't care. I don't care what ties us all together, guys. It's not all that experience. What ties us together is we've all got the exact same symptoms. Same symptoms is getting me, is getting him. But I'm seven years now, folks, anonymous, and I can't explain what an alcoholic is. I can't tell you what a drug addict is because my story is always different than yours.

These two old guys got me after the meeting. I'm looking at that clock. They got me after the meeting and they sat me down and, and asked me to sit and I'm detoxing. And they said, Chris, let's try to help you figure out why you can't stay sober. And I'm a little indignant because I've got, you know, a psychiatrist on speed dial. You know, it's just.

And now these two old country bumpkins are going to stop. Show me. Yeah. This is that stereotypical text that you'll follow. Belt buckle about the size of a dinner plate. You know, big old white stitching on like that white snap shirt. You know, it's like, yeah, he's got a Cadillac out in the parking lot with bullhorns on the front. Y'all think I'm making that shit up? Nice and nice as an honest fact. And he opens the big book up there and he cherry picks it. We didn't start reading on the title page. You all understand. I don't have time to sponsor anybody. That's because you're starting on the title page, reading with them.

Nowhere in the book does it say do that. It says give them a big book and then let's help them figure this out. And they sat with me and they showed me up in the front where it talked about, in the doctor's opinion, the physical craving in the middle of session. And these guys understood. They wanted to find out

in 25 minutes. They I found out that I was an alcoholic and a drug addict, he said. Chris, I think you can go to any one of these meetings if you want to and I've been doing it ever since. Some of y'all qualify for a bunch of meetings. I'm just saying, you know, that's OK,

God.

But when I'm in alcohol, it's Anonymous. I don't talk about drugs. And when I'm in Drug Addicts Anonymous, I don't talk about alcohol.

You know, when I'm in the Sex Addicts Anonymous meeting, I don't talk. Well, I did talk about the farm animals then

there you

these guys got me real busy. I'm watching because I don't want to run out of time. These guys got me real busy folks. And I need to tell you the next morning, they told me that night, they said, Chris, if you work these steps real quick, we can we can guarantee that you can have a spiritual experience. You can recover from this crap. And and I started to argue with them because I've been around a long enough to know Narcotics Anonymous. God forbid you know you, you'll always be, you know, And they just roll their eyes as Chris, why don't you be quiet for a minute? Just listen, all right. And they showed me in the book where it says you could recover and you can

doesn't mean that I'm going to leave recovery. You'll understand. As long as I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing, that obsession goes away. 34 years sober guys and I have never, not once thought about taking a drink.

I've had some rough days in 30-4 years and

there was a couple of times that I wasn't sure I really wanted to be here,

but not once that I want to take a drink.

That position neutrality Big Book talks about in this ten step stuff is real,

but it's not as a result of sitting your butt in a bunch of meetings is as a result of actually doing this work. These guys said, Chris, if you'd come with us and get active, I guarantee you can recover. And the next day, you know, we went to a 10:00 meeting and they showed me how to make a pot of coffee because I'd never done Jack Yelp. They they figured this out that night. Chris, have you ever done any service work?

How can I help anybody else? Like, I can't even help myself.

Wrong thing to say to those guys, y'all. But anyway, yeah,

after the meeting, we went in the backroom and we did a third step prayer. They explained it and we got underneath and did a little third step prayer. We went and got some Mexican food and they came back and they gave me a little notebook and says, Chris, let's start working on a four step. I get emails from all over the world. People listen to these talks. Don't you think that's a bit fast? I've been in a A7 years

but even if it had been my first visit that is not too fast. If y'all read the history sites. I got cards up here guys with my e-mail on there. If you e-mail me just say stuff. I'll I'll send you a bunch of websites that you can get on. You can look at the history. Nobody guys in the early days of Alcoholics Anonymous when we had a successful rate of 75%. In 1955, when the

book went into its second edition, we, we didn't a second, yeah, the 2nd edition, we didn't take any nobody took longer than a couple of weeks to work the steps. You know, most of these guys, within a within a few hours, they're already making their amends. Bill Wilson's in Towns hospital on his 9th day detoxing, making amends from the from the hospital