The 53rd annual Las Vegas Roundup in Las Vegas, NV

Hello everyone, my name is Mark Torgerson. I'm a recovered alcoholic.

Welcome everyone to the 53rd Annual Las Vegas Roundup. We are glad everyone is here, especially newcomers. My name is Mark. I'm an alcoholic. After a moment of silence for the for those still suffering in and out of these rooms, please join me in the Serenity Prayer.

This is a sponsorship panel and each of our speakers will speak for 20 minutes, sharing their experience, strength and hope with us as it relates to sponsoring others and being sponsored.

And looks like I'll be starting, so I'll introduce myself. I'm Mark. I'm a recovered alcoholic.

It's a real honor to be up here. Thank you. I'm going to try and jam in about six hours of material in 20 minutes. So

I'm going to share my experience on sponsorship, and I know that that may not jive with someone else's experience.

If whatever I say you don't agree with and you're sober and happy, by all means, continue to do what you're doing right. But I'm the guy that I didn't get this right away.

I came to Alcoholics Anonymous and I suffered immensely. I was in and out, in and out, in and out, in and out

for approximately 7 years trying to get sober. And The thing is, I wanted to get sober and the pocket where I was from,

the only thing that was being said to me was go to meetings, meetings and meetings and meetings and meetings. And that's what I was doing. I was hitting a ton of meetings and I was dying on the inside.

I remember being told to go to 90 meetings in 90 days and I went to 100 meetings in 90 days

and I wanted to put a bullet in my head. I was suffering from untreated alcoholism and I didn't know what was going on. I thought there must be something, something else to this right? Remember going to the doctors and I was diagnosed with a DDADHD, bipolar, manic, depressed, you name it. What I've come to learn, as I'm a garden variety alcoholic, there's nothing special about me

and I don't need any of that other stuff.

Umm, I think with anyone that's, uh, in recovery,

you find that spot between seconds and inches. It might be a conversation that you have turning left instead of going right. Might be a Facebook post, maybe someone come in and talking to you in the hospital. Something happened along the way which changed your life forever. For me, it was, it was a click of a mouse. I was in and out of Alcoholics Anonymous for seven years,

dying of untreated alcoholism, contemplating suicide, and I remember clicking a mouse and wandering into an online

AAA meeting that was like no other that I've ever participated in. And it was a group that cared more for me than my feelings. They did not care about how I felt. They did not care about what I thought. The only cared about what my actions were.

Uh, the deal is with this group is I was assigned a sponsor day one, right? And if I didn't like that, get out. Now, of course was offended because I'm an alcoholic and I'm usually offended, but I was, I was intrigued. I was intrigued enough to stay and I was suffering enough that, that I decided to stay. And this woman from New York

took me through the 12 steps of Alcoholics Anonymous in a Really

quick fashion. We went through the work in somewhere between 2:00 and three weeks. And the big thing with her was pushing me very quickly into helping me, helping other Alcoholics. Now, the pocket of recovery that I was in, I was taught that the sponsors, your life coach, and you're supposed to come to them with all your problems. And I remember going back to this lady, it was always based on relationship drama, right?

And I would come to this lady and I'd say, you know, I got drama and I want to talk about it.

And she would always say the same thing to me. Did you help another alcoholic today?

And if the answer was number click

right now I'm I'm a fairly tough sponsor. I don't do that personally, but is it is what I needed at the time I was artful manipulator and a skilled liar and it taught me what my ultimate pathway out of this was, was one-on-one work with another alcoholic. That has been my go to for all of my recoveries since, right? More than prayer, more than meditation, more than calling my sponsor, more than meetings, right?

Especially when I don't feel like doing it. And this, this whole gig is easy when you feel good, but when you especially don't when you don't want to.

I'm going to try and jam in about six hours worth of material. And I'll probably got about 15 minutes left, right. So I'm just going to get right into the meat and potatoes of some of this And, and maybe it might spark a little controversy and Mark sparked some ideas. Hopefully we'll have a little bit of time at the end to a little bit of Q&A. We'll see how that goes. Umm, but I've taken approximately between 60 and 70 people through the steps now,

either in a sponsorship or a Co sponsorship position. Now the majority of those people are still sober. Umm, so I've just marked down a few bullet points and I'm not going to expand on these two in depth just purely because we don't have the time of some of the things that that we're talking to me and work for me. Pretty much everything can be reconciled with the the big book.

One of the big things as I approach the newcomer, I do not wait for them to come to me. One of the big things in our pocket of recovery where I'm from is these meeting lists that go around when there's a newcomer and everyone writes their name down. I've written down hundreds and hundreds of times my name. I've gotten one call and it was a drunk I wanted to ride home, right? So, at least in my pocket recovery, those lists have been ineffective.

I approach the newcomer. I typically look for the guy sitting close to the door

with his head down, not the one sitting up front waiting to spew it about divorce or traffic, right? I'm looking for the one that's close to the door ready to bail, right? Those are the ones I want to hook in. And, and I had a lot of fear around that at first. I thought it had to be, I had to quote the big book and have this grandiose share. And it doesn't have to be anything grandiose to just simply, hey, how are you? My name is Mark. Would you like to go for a coffee? Right. And you let God take it from there. And that's worked unbelievably well.

I qualify the newcomer. I make sure that they're in the right fellowship. I ask a couple of questions right away. What happens when you start drinking? What happens when you stop drinking? Right? I find it see if they're if their problem is actually alcohol and and if they're maybe in the wrong fellowship right now, I'll help them steer them towards the right fellowship.

I'll outline what a sponsor is and what it isn't right away as it was outlined with me at. And like I said, if, if what you do as a sponsor is completely different than this, by all means keep doing it, right?

But what was taught to me is that, uh, well, what a sponsor isn't, is I'm not your therapist, I'm not your counselor. I'm not your driver, I'm not your banker,

I'm not sure how higher power. I'm not your mom. I'm not your dad.

What my job is as a sponsor is to take you through the 12 steps of Alcoholics Anonymous, get you connected to a higher power that's going to help solve your problems. And then I'm going to help Co sponsor as you now go out and find someone else to share this message with because there's a lot of fear with these newcomers, especially in early recovery on becoming a sponsor. Now my job is to Co sponsor and I and I do a ton of Co sponsoring back home.

I see if they're willing to go to any lengths.

So two questions I'll ask them. Hey are you willing to go to any links and BI tell them? I fully expect you to help other Alcoholics once we're done this process. The answer is no to either those questions. We're done. I'll still be nice to them at meetings, but they no longer get another minute of my personal time

if they want to. If they decide down the road that yes, they are now willing to go at any lengths, by all means, they have my full attention again. I've gone to

another extreme with that. There's an open page in the big book right at the very front, and I now have anyone that I sponsor sign a contract right on that open page. I haven't say I so and so am willing to do to go to any length to recover from alcoholism that I have them sign it and then I have them date it so that when they start whining the boat writing inventory, when they start whining about making amends, or when they start whining about

doing 12 step work, I can bring them back to that day. It's like, where's that guy,

right? Where was that guy that was desperate to get well, they're like, oh, yeah, yeah. Because what I, what I do know about the alcoholic is the resurgence power of the ego, right? Sometimes just a few days go by and they start to feel a little bit better and they think they don't need the right. They don't think they need to make amends, right? It allows me to go back to this contract and, well, make them accountable.

I work the steps fast with anyone that I take through the work. Typically between two and three weeks, never any more than a month.

Umm,

it is precisely what worked for me. I was dying from a progressive and a fatal illness. I needed relief and I needed relief quickly. I do encourage him to join big book studies and go through things line by line and get a deeper understanding right? But I do know that umm, I needed to work these steps fast. Like the desperation of a drowning man.

I don't have any dependencies. I want them dependent upon God and not me. I'm not a certified life coach. I I don't get involved with who they date. I don't get involved with where they work. I don't get involved with where they live right? I try to get them involved with the 12 steps which gets them connected to a higher power, which helps them with their problems. Now I will share my experience on something if I have experience on something. If I don't have experience on something, I send them to the right person, right? If they're having

with the law, I don't pretend to be a lawyer, I send them to a lawyer.

I let them know right away that the ultimate goal is to make them a future sponsor.

Umm, there was a study that I recently seen of UH-500 Alcoholics and addicts and what the study, it studied three groups. The first group was a group that just went to meetings and the recovery, the recovery rates were not good. And the second group was a group that went to meetings, got a sponsor and did the steps. And oddly enough, the recovery rates were better, but not that much better.

And then there was a third group that went to meetings, got a sponsor, did the steps and became sponsors. And that group had a 75% recovery rate, which reconciled with the forward to the second edition, right when they talked about 50% got sober a once and 25% after a few relapses, right? To me, that's 75%. So I let them know that their ultimate goal is to make them a future sponsor. And if we're going through something in the book and they say, well, that doesn't really apply to me,

like we're going to talk about it anyways because it might apply to the next guy. This isn't about you anymore, right?

As soon as they're done the steps I get them. Actively looking for someone to sponsor as soon as possible. My job is now to Co sponsor with them. I, I know that there's a lot of fear around sponsorship. So now my job is to, umm, sit with them to help them get through that fear for the first couple of guys as they take them through the steps.

About six years ago, a man out of Texas by the name of Chris Raymer started sponsoring me and

I know when I call him now with and it always goes back to usually drama, right? Usually relationship drama. He always asks me one thing. Where are you in the circle, in the triangle plot yourself? Are you working all three parts? Recovery, unity and service. I do believe this to be a disease of perception. What I do find that if I'm not working all three parts of this program,

how I view the world is often very skewed

right. I get centered back into the middle of the circle in the triangle, right? I make sure I'm being of service.

I'm doing prayer and meditation. I'm being helpful to other Alcoholics. I'm sponsoring others

and what I find out is maybe that drama that I would have deemed as a nine doesn't completely go away, but it's maybe now about a four, right?

Umm, my ultimate

sing to share with anyone here is a message of hope. Whether you're new or struggling in sobriety, my message is that you can get well. You can get well quickly. That has been my experience and that is after someone who has suffered immensely in this program for very a lot of years. So

my suggestion is find someone that knows their way around this big book and get busy. So thank you.

I'd now like to introduce Lawrence.

I'm not alcoholic. My name is Lawrence Mazur.

Umm, thanks for having me here today.

Pretty much everything Mark said is what I wanna say, so thanks. Bye.

No, umm, I gotta admit I am nervous. And uh, I heard a guy

early on in my recovery and he was speaking up at this podium podium and he said, uh, you know, I'm going to tell you. He said I'm nervous here and if anybody ever tells you they don't get nervous and I'll call an honest period. He said keep an eye on that person because they'll probably lie about something else too. You know,

probably the most important thing that I want to say to start with here on the sponsorship panel is I have a sponsor and I have sponses.

You know, I, I come into Alcoholics Anonymous. I didn't come here voluntarily. Let's put that away. I didn't, you know, wake up one morning and say, man, you know, I don't want to drink anymore. And I think I got to join Alcoholics Anonymous. I come in through a series of circumstances. And when I first got on the Alcoholics Anonymous, I was one of these guys that used to just go to meetings and sit in the back corner and sit by the door. I was one of those guys that Mark was looking for, but I got away from him for a long from a wave away from him for a long

fine. And the first guy that I had sponsored me in Alcoholics Anonymous. Unfortunately for me, he cared more about my feelings than he did about how I was actually doing. And I suffered an Alcoholics Anonymous for a long time through this sponsorship, through misinformation.

But for some reason, God kept me around here long enough to and not even by my own accord to be set up with some people that actually cared more about how I was doing than how I was feeling. And I clearly remember and this guy Barry, he, he spotted me in a meeting and he came up to me afterwards and he said, Lawrence, I'm going to take

this other guy. So I'm going to take him through the steps. And I was wondering if maybe you would like to come and join

and maybe help me take them through the steps. I'm like, yeah, of course I would. You know, I can do that, right? Haven't haven't really worked a step. I've been around here for a while, but I haven't really worked. Little did I know that he was actually becoming my temporary sponsor. He was going to be the sponsor that was going to take me through the steps. And he did take me through the steps. And it became pretty paramount in a short period of time because right at that time when I was finally, finally going through the steps and finally getting some recovery from alcoholism, as

synonyms was, was based on, was Alcoholics Anonymous based on, I went through what I call the most tragic part of my life. I, I lost my son to this disease of alcoholism. And it was, it was a really, it was a really ugly situation. He was, he was in jail on an attempted murder charge and he got a bunch of drugs and he overdosed in jail and, and they pumped them up and they sent him to a hospital and they put him on a life support system.

And 10 days later they made, they made me make the he was already, he was dead in jail. Let me put that he was dead in jail

and 10 days later they made me make the decision to take him off this life support so that they wouldn't be responsible for his death.

And I know today, I know today if it wasn't for the sponsorship that I got from Barry, if I still would have been under the regime of my first sponsor without with no recovery, I know today that I wouldn't be able to stand. I wouldn't be standing here guys. I know I wouldn't be standing here. Finding being able to share this and being able to share it with, with some,

with some recovery under my belt, with some, you know, factual things instead of talking about, you know, how it broke my heart and how, how I, you know, I cried. And I mean, it is it is part of my story. It's part of my life. And it's the saddest thing that I went through, but I was able to get through it and I know how I got through it. I got through it through the steps of Cogs and Honest, through the sponsorship, all Cox Anonymous.

I know that as as a fact today. And, and I remember, I remember the night that they called me to go to the hospital to tell me this news and make this decision. And probably 6 months before that, or maybe even three months before that,

my reaction to that would have been I would have went to the hospital, I would have did that. I would have been heartbroken. I would have crawled into a corner and I probably would have found a bottle of jugs or whatever I would have done. But that night, my reaction was to jump into the, to jump into the fellowship. I needed the fellowship at that time to support me. And I didn't turn my back on the fellowship. I got more involved in the fellowship. I started to get a craving. I started to get a craving for Alcoholics and awesome after that that I never ever had prior to that because I thought, wow,

if this can get me through that, if this can get me through that, what else can it get me through,

You know, because I never, I never thought that I could get through any kind of hardships like that. And it did. So I got a craving for Alcoholics and arms. I got a craving for the information. I got a craving for the, for the nuts and bolts of Alcoholics Anonymous. I wanted to know, I wanted to know more about what it was.

Unfortunately, Barry suffered a brain injury right after that period of time. And he, he's still alive and he's still a great guy. And, and I talked to him and as a matter of fact, I've told people this story for years and years and that, and Barry is still running Alcoholics and ONS, but he's not around very much and not a lot of people know him. And it's, it's kind of cool because last year I was at a meeting with one of my sponsors that was sponsored for, for several years now. And we were at a meeting with at all College Anonymous and.

Happen to be there and it was it it gave me a sense of pride and joy to see Barry there and to to introduce him to some people that I talked about him you know in the past and and that he is real. You know, he wasn't a made-up guy that I, I talked to. You know that I my little made a friend from when I was in kindergarten. But

you know, through that craving of wanting, I knew that my first Monster couldn't sponsor me anymore

and I had to find another sponsor. And I went for a while. I went for a while without a sponsor and unfortunately without a sponsor. I wasn't sponsoring anybody. I was staying sober and I wasn't growing. And, but I knew I needed a sponsor and I needed somebody that, that, that had the, that had the passion and, and, and, and the zest for Alcoholics and monks. That I, that I thought that I, I was and, and I went to a convention much like this

and we didn't get this to the convention till Saturday. And somebody was saying to me, oh, you should have heard this speaker last night. He was so on point. He was like big book. He was like just talking about everything. And I'm thinking to myself, wow, that's the kind of guy that I'm looking for to be my sponsor. And we're sitting in the room we're sitting around the table. There's four or five of us and one of the guys at the table was one of my sponsors and and we're sitting around the table there and and

incomes, incomes Dale walking in the back corner. Now I know Dale

from the Fellowship and from we ride motorcycles together. I've known Dale for a few years. And Dale comes in walking back corner and someone turns on, oh, there's our speaker from last night. And I knew at that instant, I knew at that instant that that's who's going to be my sponsor. Dale is my sponsor still to this day. Mark knows him really well.

I know Mark works with him quite a bit and Dale is a fundamentalist, a a guy. He you can't talk to Dale about anything.

Him taking you back into the big book.

And that's exactly what this alcoholic needs. And through that kind of a sponsorship, I've been able to stay away from alcohol. I've been able to grow spiritually, I've been able to grow mentally, and I've been able to emanate that sponsorship to my sponsees. Now, when I deal with my sponsees, I deal with my sponsees is the exact same way that Dale is. I don't tell my sponsees what they have to do.

I don't tell. I pretend like nobody. I have no idea, no idea in this room was going to take any of you to stay recovered. I have no idea whatsoever. I know what I do. I know exactly what I do and that's all I can share with you. And that's exactly what I do with my sponsees. I have lots of sponsors that call up. And just like Mark was talking about, I call Dale sometimes with some some drama and, and I call Dale with, you know, world problems that I have or something that's, you know, going to skew. And usually the first thing Dale asked me is,

what have you done for? He says. What have you done for another person today,

let alone an alcoholic? What have you done for another person today? And if I tell them, well, you know, I've been busy. I've been busy. And it's he doesn't, he doesn't buy into that. He doesn't buy into that. And I don't buy into that with my sponsees. And it's, it's just the way that, that I, I lead my sponsorship because that's the way that I'm taught. It's like, I'll tell you what I've done if I have experience in it, if I don't have experience in it, I know enough people. I've been around

Alcoholics and honest now since September 1st,

2000. I've been sober since September 1st, 2000. Even though I've had some periods of suffering through Alcoholics in the in fellowship Alcoholics, I've never ever found it necessary to take a drink since then.

So I've, I've gotten to know a lot of people. I'm involved in Alcoholics and honest, umm, actually both from, uh, from from where I am. I guess I didn't say that at the beginning when I said I introduced myself. I'm from Calgary, AB, Canada, but I also live part time in Las Vegas, NV. I've been, I've been coming to this roundup since 2004 and I've been coming to Las Vegas on a steady basis since 2004, and I ended up buying a house down here a few years ago. So I spent a lot of time down down in Las Vegas and I'm

involved in Alcoholics and honest and in Las Vegas, like I don't see too many familiar faces here today, but I can come into a lot of meetings and Alcoholics and autumns in Vegas. And then I know people, you know, and I stay involved. And through that, why I'm sharing that is through that I've heard a lot of stories. So when I have a sponsee that talks to me about something and and ask me about something, if I don't have the experience to share with that Swansea something that I can I can relate and I can tell them how I got to something like that. I usually have somebody that I know

that has gone to something like that and I can get them connected and I can have them share their story with them. Not to tell them what to do, not to tell them what to do. To show them how they got through that. To show them what happened with them. To show them that it's possible to get through this with some hope and some grace and some dignity. You know, before I come to Alcoholics and honest, all's I ever wanted was I wanted to be happy. I wanted to be free.

I wanted to have, you know, some seminars of, of what I declared normal

and I could never do that. I could never do that. Today in Alcoholics and Moss, I can tell you that I can be happy and I am free. There's lots of days that I'm not happy. And it has absolutely nothing to do with Alcoholics Anonymous or my higher power. It has absolutely everything to do with Lawrence Mazur. You know, it's like I didn't when when they asked me to do this, I said yes.

About two days later, I didn't want to do this about two minutes before I walked in here. I didn't want to do this,

but the same time I know that I've been put here for a purpose. I have no idea what it is. I have no idea what it is, but I'm here for a purpose. And all I'm trying to do here today is share with with you guys my experience, my strength and my hopes. Now I've gotten all that. I've gotten all that through the direct results of the fundamentals of the big book, You know, for coming Alcoholics Anonymous. I had a lot of ideas and they were some great ideas and,

and I'm sure if I wrote them down and you got it, I could have read some of those ideas to you guys. I'm sure you guys would have thought they were great ideas too. But today I know where those ideas got me. Those ideas got me right here

in Alcoholics Anonymous. And when I was a kid thinking about what I was going to do for the rest of my life, one of the things I thought about doing wasn't joining Alcoholics Anonymous. So my ideas, my emotions and my thoughts are not very good and not very good.

So my sponsor took me through the steps and he teaches me the big book and he can refer to the big book any time I have a problem when it comes to dealing with what I deem as my problems as my issues of the day, as my problem of today. And it's always, always like I was standing over there talking to our morning speaker and

Cody was there and Mark was there and, and I haven't phoned my sponsor yet because I didn't have time before we started this. But I got a resentment. I got to tell you guys. I got a resentment. I, I walked in here last night and I got registered

and now I see that everybody that gets to come up on this stage and gets to speak,

little red tag hanging off their name tag. So I got some work to do when I leave here. I got to phone my sponsor and I got to get through this resentment that I have.

But you know, and I know, I know exactly, like I know exactly what, what's what's gonna happen with Dale when he gets me to this resentment? He goes, well, he's gonna tell me. He's gonna ask me like, what natural instinct does that affect? And he's gonna, what do you mean? What natural instance does it affect? Does it affect your, you know, your, your, your sex instincts, your, your ambitions in sex, your emotional surprise. He's gonna, he's gonna take me through the process of the fourth step and I'm gonna get through that resentment. I'm gonna get through that resentment. I'm gonna find out exactly

my part is. And when I find out what my part is, then, then and only then, you know, the spirit of the sunlight will start to shine in me and I'll get some serenity again. And that's exactly what I try to do with my sponsees. I have some sponsees up in Canada, just like in the States here, there's some pretty remote places. But I remember one of my sponsors called me up and he had, he had some huge life issues, like it was his life was going sideways and he couldn't see how he was going to stay away from the liquor store.

And unfortunately the little town that he's in, there's only about four meetings a week there. So I asked him on the phone and I said to him, I said, uh, and I know his situation. I know where he lives. He lives just a little bit out of the town itself. And, and I know his, a few of his neighbors are lesbian. I said, what's your neighbors lawn look like today? And he's like, what are you talking about? I said, what's your neighbor's lung look like today?

And he said, well, looks green grass. I said, does it, is it trimmed? Does it cut? Does it look neat? And he said, no, he says that like this couple little old ladies beside him, they haven't been able to get out for a while.

I said, tell you what, go cut your neighbors lawn. Give me a call when you're done. Cut your neighbors lawn. He goes, I'm not going to cut my neighbors lawn. I said please go cut your neighbors lawn for me. Would you do it for me? Would you just go cut your neighbor's lawn? Give me a call when you're done cutting your neighbor's lawn. So about an hour and a half later, he calls me. I said, how are you doing? He said

I'm doing great. I'm doing great now. It's something that was taught way back in the beginning.

It says in the big book that I'm going to be a maximum service to all God's children, to all of God's children. And sometimes, sometimes, you know, there is another alcoholic to work with. Does that not mean that I cannot be of service? Of course I can be of service. I can be of service in many, many ways as long as I'm getting out of myself. How could it be a wrong thing? You know, so I was taught that a long time ago. And that's something, that's something even to this day that I, that I, that I do and my sponsor gives me credit

all the time. So it can be a wrong thing. You know,

I'm really good at, at solving problems. I, I, I, it's just something that, that comes natural to me. I'm really good at solving problems and, and mechanical problems. And I help a lot of people fix car, mostly motorcycles, but I will help them fix cars too. And, and I know a little bit about, about a lot of things, but not on, you know, but I'm, I'm good at solving problems and I'm good at helping people and I'm good at showing people how to, how do you solve problems like that?

And I do that outside of this fellowship. And my sponsor always tells me, like when I first started, when I was first doing it and I was telling about it, I was thinking that I was, you know, being selfish, I should get more into, more into trying to help Alcoholics. And, and he says, no, no, he's doing exactly what you're supposed to be doing today. That person needed that help. And I remember, I remember we were on a motorcycle trip one time. And I remember how how exactly how that trickled down because I was on a motorcycle trip with my sponsor

and one of my sponsors, and we went to a Walmart to pick something up late in the evening.

And there was this lady and she was trying to get her groceries in her car

and she looked like she was having a little bit of a struggle. And immediately, immediately, my spawn C ran over to the little van to help her put those groceries in the van. And Dale and I sat there and we looked at them.

It was kind of a it was kind of a neat moment for both of us. It's kind of a neat moment for all this because that's how Dale had always taught me.

And obviously I had, I had shared that same message to my sponsees and our sponsorship family works that a way to this day. And I think it's a cool thing because it's exactly what I'm supposed to be doing. I'm supposed to be a maximum service to all God's children in and outside of these rooms. And through that, I, I get to stay sober. I get to stay sober. I like that. I like that story about

Bill Wilson. You know, six months into this thing trying to help Alcoholics, right,

and he wasn't he didn't think he was helping anybody, you know, and thank God for Lois, you know, never mind Bill Wilson, thank God for Lois. It was Lois who recognized, right? He was still sober. He was still sober. I have one of my sponsors and and we do these these big bucks studies that I know Cody was talking about. I'm sorry, Mark was talking big book studies that that go on some places. And one of my sponsors, we put on two big book studies a year, usually

sometimes three. And I know every time we start these big box studies and we got a whole room full of people and I say to them, I say, I have no idea. I have no idea. It's like today, I have no idea. I have no idea that this is going to help anybody. I have no idea if that big book today is going to help anybody. I do know one person that's going to help for sure. I do know one person and it's going to help me. It's going to help me. I have

what I consider a Swiss Swiss cheese brain. I, I put this information and then it kind of

kind of sloshes around in there and it'll find itself a hole and it'll fall out

and then I'll forget about it. So I stay involved and I stay putting that information in my brain over and over and over again so I don't forget

because I don't ever want to forget where I come from.

So I might end up like my son. I might end up like my son and many of our many of our other of us

that have come into this fellowship and have floundered and have had to die over this disease.

Today I don't have to die. Today I get to live happy, sober and free.

I think I've spoken up today, so I'm going to introduce Cody to come up and close.

Hey all, my name is Cody Loud and we're covered. Alcoholic

boy. Batting clean up after these two guys is not going to be an easy feat. Aya,

I want to thank both these guys for getting getting up here and talking and getting me a chance to come up here and speak. I want to thank Greg and Vicki. You guys couldn't see it. Vicki was, she got, she must have ballet shoes on. She was standing on her tip toes. I was sitting over there. I was like, she's about to tip over. She's about to tip over. She didn't do it, but they almost did. So I've got a couple of things,

man. Just just great stuff. And I'm, I'm, I'm not going to beat a dead horse.

Is everybody in here clear why we drank, Right. It says in the big book that we drank because we like the effects produced by alcohol.

So it's like, why do we sponsor?

I like the effects produced by sponsorship. OK, It talks about in a vision for you. It says the two friends knew that they must help others if they were to stay sober, But that feeling was transcended right by a gift of giving to see others recover.

That's that's what Dale was just talking about or just what he was talking about with his sponsor day or when they saw the little sponsor he do that,

it was like, it hits you right here. You're like, Oh my God, God's used me as a vessel

to help some holy shit.

God used me, a worthless alcoholic, to help somebody get sober.

How cool is that? So if you're not sponsoring, you're missing out on some really cool blessings.

OK, so, and we're, I was talking to Matt a little bit about this. There's a couple of different ways to kind of look at this. So it's, it's about sponsorship. So when I brought this into meditation, there's two different things. What to look for in a sponsor, right? If I'm gonna look for a sponsor and what are my duties as a sponsor? So I'm, I'm gonna kinda start with with that and, and go. So, umm.

When I'm looking for a sponsor and I've had the same sponsor for 13 years, but I was taught this by him when I talk with with new guys is I'm I wanna find somebody that's had a spiritual experience as a result of work in the steps. OK, for years, 10 years, from the time I was 19 until I was 29, I bounced around Alcoholics Anonymous jail. And I always heard find a sponsor that has something that you want,

right? I want what you have. And I would see guys driving badass cars,

right? Big gold diamond rings, X dancer old lady, you know what I mean? Like dude, I want some what 20 year old alcoholic does not want that. It's like I want that,

right?

The truth is, what I want

is somebody who's had a spiritual experience as a result of work in the steps, because they can show me how they've recovered from alcoholism,

right? That's what I'm looking for. So if you're looking for a sponsor, that's one of the main questions that you ask somebody that that you asked to be your sponsor buddy, is have you had a spiritual experience as a result of working the steps? And if they haven't,

I found somebody else,

you know, I'd find a sponsor who has a spiritual experience as a result of working the steps

they can show me through unity, service and recovery, right? The mind, body and spirit. It's like

Eddie went to Bill, right? And Bill goes, I got to find this power. It didn't originate in him,

it originated somewhere else.

And that's the power we're talking about, that we want to. I want to find somebody who can talk to me about the mental piece, right, the physical piece and the spiritual piece and tell me, look, where am I at in Unity? Where am I at in service? Where am I in recovery?

The main thing somebody who's had a spiritual experience by the result of working the steps is they're going to know the big book

guys. I read the big book like a novel for a long time. I was like, Oh yeah, it's about the stock broker and this butt doctor and and they, you know, these lofty ideals that they had in the third, you know what I mean? And I couldn't relate. It's like I didn't understand

that the 1st 164 pages were it's a textbook. The 1st 164 pages is a textbook. How to have a spiritual experience.

It showed you exactly how to do that. I didn't. Nobody ever told me that I really, really wanted to be sober. Literally, if somebody would say, look, dude, take your redneck ass and run naked down the street, I would have done it because I didn't want to drink, man.