The chapter Working with others at West End Big Book Awakening meeting in St. Paul, MN

No. Good morning. Welcome to the Big Book Awakening, St. Paul's West End Club Saturday morning women's big book study. Thanks for listening today. As a big book study, the goal of this recording is to increase our collective knowledge of the book Alcoholics Anonymous by sharing with each other. Let's start by introducing ourselves. I'm Kate, and I'm an alcoholic. Hey, Kate. I'm Callie. I'm an alcoholic. Hi, Kelly. So today we're going to be talking about Chapter 7, Working with others, which begins on page 89

of my version of big Book, which is I think the 3rd edition. So it might be different. Other people's I guess the same though. But before I begin, I wanted to read something from my daily reflections book. I ordered this book on Amazon and I got it and I opened it up the first the first day that I read it. And on the opening page there's a note and it says, dear Kathy, welcome to the club. It's an incredible way to live. You get to be the person you always wanted to be one day at a time. Love you Kate. And I just thought

full, I don't know these women at all, but it's just a really great illustration of one woman working with another woman. And I wanted to share that with you guys, 'cause I thought it was neat, so cool. Working with others. Practical experience shows that nothing will so much ensure immunity from drinking as intensive work with other Alcoholics. It works when other activities fail. This is our 12th suggestion.

Carry this message to other Alcoholics. You can help when no one else can. You can secure their confidence when others fail.

Remember they are very ill. So I just wanted to talk about two things in this paragraph, the phrases practical experience and other activities. And this is Bill's reflection of what worked for him and what's worked for so many of us. So his practical experience working with other Alcoholics showed that the other activities that he was engaged in, even going to treatment and trying to quit on his own and learning about the disease of alcoholism weren't enough. So

this chapter is about step 12,

and it's based on the fundamental insight gained by Bill when he was on the verge of relapse at the Mayflower Hotel in Akron, OH, in June 1935. And most of you guys know the story, but he was in the hotel, and on one side there was a bar and there was a phone booth on the other side. And he was torn between which to go to. And he decided to call a clergyman from the phone booth. And that's kind of how we started working with one another. He found another alcoholic.

So the first paragraph is about overtly helping others and paragraphs 2 is about how

this helping others will impact us. And my sponsor, sponsor has a note that this chapter could contain a subhead why sponsoring helps the sponsor, which I think is great. So also in the second paragraph, I was reflecting on my, my introduction to a A when I first started coming to AAI, went to this huge group out in Eden Prairie. It was my Home group of like 300 people and it was a speaker meeting. And I wasn't, I was sober from alcohol at the time, but I wasn't

sober. I was taking a ton of Adderall. And so I was pretty much high as a kite every single meeting. And they read the second paragraph and everyone in the room said bright spot together at the end. And I just thought, I don't know what that is. I'll never know what that is. I was so isolated and guilty and just didn't understand. But now you know, this paragraph is a lot like what I read when I started

the woman sharing with the other woman, Kate sharing with Kathy. You know, this is just such an amazing way to live. So

I just wanted to share that personal experience. And also on this page we get into kind of the throwback to the era language, which when Bill wrote this, it was door to door sales were popular and a lot of language and attitude of this chapter is the language of like prospecting and sales pitches. So it, it sort of applies today, but you know, we don't go out and like actively seek people

like door to door the way that he did.

Now I'm moving on to the next page.

I think I have highlighted the end of the first paragraph, sick person, and then tied it back to the first page where Bill talks about very ill, very ill people. And it's just important to keep in mind that these people are sick. And then moving along,

I highlighted you need to see that you need this information to put yourself in his place. And then at the top of the page, also find out all you can about him and this information

these,

this is something that I think I missed before. It's really important for us to get to know people and to understand them in order to work with them. And so the last thing I want to say on this page is the paragraphs that talk about working with an alcoholic and their actual physical condition. And I have underlined don't deal with him when he is very drunk. And I've had a lot of experience with this in my recovery. And my sponsor likes to say they're not going to remember

what you say. So that's a real easy way to look at it. It's tempting, but

and then moving on to page 91,

when possible, avoid meeting a man through his family. And I was looking at other people's notes on this chapter and someone wrote something really profound. I thought it said the alcoholic will not appreciate what may be seen as an extension of the family's nagging. And I just thought, that's pretty good. So dispassionate third party is much better than a hysterical family.

And then again in the next paragraph it says under these conditions, your prospect will see he is under no pressure, which sort of emphasizes

what I just said. So now I will pass it along to Kate. Thank you. Callie, I'm Kate, I'm an alcoholic. So looking on page 91 at the middle, this really this sets us up on pages 9192 and 93. These are really instructions on how to engage with a sponsee and how to approach it because in in my experience, it's very emotional time. And first of all, not everyone will react in the same way or accept it or

receive it in the same way. And therefore we can't give in the same way, even though it is our higher calling to give and be of service. And so there's, that's why I think there's like 3 pages of instructions, but it's pretty clear there are certain things in these pages that will help us think through the process of how we can engage with the sponsee. And in my experience, when I first meet with the sponsee, I've I've encountered people who are really open and

and willing to hear what I have to say right away, and they're willing to share what their experience is right away. And I've also encountered people who are incredibly doubtful and afraid and full of shame, who don't want to hear my story, who don't think I can relate to them at all, who think that they're in such a bad place that no one else in the world has ever experienced what they're experiencing.

And both of those situations are very

different and tricky. Both of them are because you want to bring someone into a place where they accept it and they understand it and they want to recover. And it's not about pleasing me and being a doormat for me when some of those people are so eager. But it's also not about me convincing someone of something they don't want when they're so full of shame. So in my experience,

it's difficult for some people to see where I've been because I am full of joy and full of the promises and happiness

in my life now. And some people assume that there's a scale from better to worse on recovery and really there's not. We all know that there's no scale of better or worse or coming in worse or better. I know we talk about a low bottom or a high bottom, but everyone gets to recover and we need to hold the space we get and are blessed to hold that space for anybody at any point in their experience.

Some of the people who have such deep shame when they come in, I can really relate to that.

And the instructions here tell me to share my experience and help people see that they're not alone and talk about my journey and my struggles. For example, you know, on page 92 talking about the hundreds of promises I made to myself to stop the methods I took to try to stop on my own by buying books, by swearing off alcohol, by changing my environment, by going to a different city.

I think that all of those things that I did and my

you trying to use my willpower, I can usually use that to explain to other people. It's very relatable how that doesn't work and how doing it alone time and time again

didn't work. And in the middle of page 92, there's a quote

that I really like. If he sticks to the idea that he can still control his drinking, tell him that possibly he can if he's not too alcoholic, but insist that if he is severely afflicted, there may be little chance that he can recover by himself. And to me, this is about letting them decide. We're not deciding on their behalf that they're alcoholic. They need to decide for themselves that they can take step one, that they admitted that they were powerless and that their lives have become unmanageable.

In my own experience, no one could decide this for me. I had to decide that for myself. And so again, here we give, we hold the space open to that person to make that decision themselves.

I have a little chuckle when I read at the bottom of page 92 about the word protege. I don't necessarily think of my sponsees as protegees, but it's kind of fun to think of it that way because I am helping be of service and spirit and guidance to other people. And if they accept that and want to reflect what I have in my life, I maybe they are a protege. So

on 93 again we get some very clear instructions.

Tell them exactly what happened to you.

Don't tell her that she's an alcoholic. Make it her choice to decide. Share my experience of what I went through trying to stop alone. Share my illness and my fatal malady, and talk about what it took for me, what I went through to stop. And now, once they're curious, now I can share what exactly happened to me, including the spirituality, and what it took for me to stop. And now I can talk about my higher power in my life. I'm not going to introduce that right away.

And

on page 93, I do appreciate the instructions in here. And if you're encountering resistance, for people who are already

religious or believe that they have a higher power and faith in their life, the quote toward the bottom of 93 to be vital, faith must be accompanied by self sacrifice and unselfish constructive action.

Let her see that you are not there to instruct her in religion, but you could perhaps imply it in a different way. So if there's resistance, what really we're saying here is one must not only have faith, but one must also act.

So that's what I was thinking about there. Are you ready, Callie? I am ready to outline the program of action on the top of page 94. And Kate, that was so great. I love, I love those pages and I love the practical advice contained. You know, it's like, here's how we work with other people. Here's how we work with each other. So outline the program of action, explaining how you made a self appraisal. How do you straighten out your past and why you are now endeavoring to be helpful to him or her?

I love action. I'm very action driven. I've taken lots of personality tests and management tests and no action, Action strategy and action. Those are my two big things. But when I first got into the program, I, I, I wasn't action oriented. I thought I could think my way into recovery. I tried to do that for a couple years and

it just doesn't work. And the other thing about this first opening statement is it highlights actual steps, talks about 458 and 9:00. Then it goes on. He goes on to say it is important for him or her to realize that your attempt to pass this on plays a vital part in your own recovery. And then later on in the same paragraph suggest how important it is that he placed the where the welfare of other people ahead of his own.

And that's ties back to page 77, which I'm going to read in a minute, not the whole page, just a piece. But I think it's important that our sponsees and the people that we work with understand that step 12 is going to play a vital part in, in their recovery as well.

So if they see it working with us, then it's a motivator to continue moving. So page 77 has one of my favorite lines in the big book. And it is our real purpose is to fit ourselves to be of maximum service to God and the people about us. And I don't, I mean, there's really not much else to say about that. Our real purpose is to be of maximum service to God and to the people about us.

At the bottom of this page, I'm just going to read this paragraph and then go over it a little bit. Your candidate may give reasons why he need not follow all of the program. He may rebel at the thought of a drastic house cleaning, which requires discussion with other people. Do not contradict such views. Tell him you once felt as he does, but you doubt whether you would have made much progress had you not taken action. So this is the first kind of example on this page at least of how we're going to lead by example by working with

responses and not telling them what to do, but kind of showing them.

Page 95.

You will be most successful with Alcoholics if you do not exhibit any passion for crusader reform, never talked down to an alcoholic from any moral or spiritual hilltop. Simply lay out the kit of spiritual tools for his inspection. Show him how they worked with you. So I think this is really awesome life advice and it's one of the reasons I love my sponsor so much is that she either has the personal experience and shares it with me or she seeks it out. She talks to her sponsor, she talks to other women and says, here's what I've learned,

rather than say, well, here's what I think you should do. And I try to do that with my my sponsees. And then at the end of this paragraph, tell him that if he wants to get wealth, you will do anything to help him. Kate, you did a really great job of talking about, you know, the difference between wanting and needing someone who comes to this program who needs to get well, like me, for example, when I first started, I didn't necessarily want it and I wasn't able to work with others. I wasn't able to absorb that information

and that experience and hope

moving along. If he is not interested in your solution, if he expects you to act only as a banker for his financial difficulties or a nurse for his freeze, you may have to drop him like a bad habit. I'm just kidding, that's not what it says. You may have to drop him until he changes his mind.

I yeah, I couldn't exist. I just thought that was great. I love this for two reasons. I've had experience with

sponsee's and experience as a sponsee that relates to this. And

I worked with a woman once who, you know, continued to cancel our appointments and she, you know, she just wasn't available. And I got a text from her eventually saying, you know, I really need to work with a sponsee or a sponsor that I, that I can meet with. You know, I never see you. And I thought, okay,

and at first I, I was a little, you know, I was feeling catty about it. I think I shared this in this meeting couple years ago. And my response to her was, was critical. And I thought I first, the first thing that was good was that I didn't respond right away. I thought about what I wanted to say,

prayed about it and, you know, eventually realized I don't really care, you know, if she wants to meet with me in the future, that's great. And so I responded and said, you know, good luck and I'm I'm always here for you. And I heard from her recently and leaving that door open was, was really good. And my sponsor, who I've been working with on and off for seven years, I guess I don't, I'm really bad with numbers, but

we work together for, I don't know, a year or so. And then I said, you know, I don't need a sponsor

or, or I think it was, it was I don't need to sponsor. And she said, OK, you know, good luck, I'm here for you. And I went off for about 18 months and

eventually realized I really enjoyed working with her and it was beneficial. And I went back to her and said, hey, you do want to work together again. She said absolutely. And we've been working together for, I don't know, four years, Five years, which is great.

So I thought it was interesting. In the next paragraph, if he is sincerely interested and wants to see you again, ask him to read this book in the interval.

It's important that we, you know, work with sponsees and ask them to review the text on their own. This is our, this is our textbook, and it's an approach that works for me. So to recommend that to another woman is helpful, I think.

And then the next paragraph top of page 96 that begins do not be discouraged and ends he might have deprived many others who have since recovered of their chance. I think this paragraph is all about placing the well-being of others ahead of ourselves or placing the well-being of others ahead of a single individual. So really keeping an emphasis on

everyone really. And with that, I will pass to Kate. Thank you, Callie. Wow. I just had a memory of someone giving me a big book at one of my first meetings and

your sponsor Callie asking me the next time she saw me if I had read any of it. I said no, I hadn't.

And she said, yeah, of course you didn't. So, but always there, always there for us, right? And always allowing us to be become our higher selves. And that's what I appreciate it about sponsorship in this program. So

a 96, we get into 96 and 9798, we get into some tricky instruction here around how to be of service and it's really dependent on

others motives as well as our own. And being emotionally intelligent and aware enough to understand what someone else's motives might be. Because we need to be of service always. But the way we are of service may vary based on what the person is looking for. So

you can see that where it says suppose you're making your second visit, he's read this, let him know you're available. He may be broken, homeless. You may offer help him getting a job

or offering assistance or bringing him into your home.

I think that what we need to do in this space is we don't want to also on the bottom of that page 96, we don't want to make it possible for this person to be insincere and to add to her own destruction, right? So there's a fine line between supporting someone and enabling someone. And in my experience, we have to be supporting of someone from a place of total honesty holding them.

To their own accountability, being direct, but we also get to ask for guidance from God in this space as a sponsor and as an example.

Um, we need to be a service in our, for our own recovery. And so it's important that we don't enable other people to act in an insincere manner. And I think one of the things that's really changed and we can benefit from so highly today that they didn't have back when this book was written was that we have inner group.

We can reach out to inner group and help us fonsee with resources through Intergroup. We can reach out to the detox center. We can get someone in detox. We can reach out to a treatment center or recovery counseling group and help someone get some support through that. So it doesn't mean that just because we're not maybe able to welcome someone into our home or we don't have the financial means ourselves to give someone else financial support in the moment. We are so

blessed today that we have so many other resources we can offer

someone who wants to come into recovery, and we just get to be the vehicle through which that person can experience that

and get that strength and get that hope. So we can support in ways where we can sincerely give that to others while not necessarily taking on damage or someone's ill motives ourselves. And I think there's a little nice bit of protection for us here, and also the ability to allow the other person to find their own way in this a little bit, because you have to be responsible in your own way as you start the path. Like Callie said, you have to read the text.

You can't just be told what it says. And so in the same way, you have to take some responsibility and we can also be of service in a moment when someone needs such great support and be there personally and provide that service of Intergroup and other resources that we have.

So on page 97, it's really, you know, I look at that and I think in the middle there, you know, being the Good Samaritan every day,

maybe we need to give up time. Maybe we need to do a lot of driving, maybe we need to bring an extra meal to someone. And that's a blessing that we get to do that as potential sponsors for people.

Um, it's what, when I think about my time and if I'm getting stressed about my time or my resources, I simply get to stop and say, what would God want me to do? It's not about me. My problem right now is that I have a resource issue that I think is a resource issue. And if I ask God what God wanted me to do in this moment, I think God would show me the right way and show me I don't have a resource issue and I'm able to give something to someone else in some way.

So on page 97, you know when you're thinking you're giving so much or that you're sacrificing? No, you're winning and you're receiving by doing this. And by giving to someone else, you're creating space for that person to receive also, because they can't receive if they're not

being shown away to be given to. It's so hard when we start this recovery thing to accept help. And so being as gracious and giving as we can will be really important when you're first working with someone.

On page 98,

You know, I said when I started this little section talking about what someone's motives might be, In my experience, I found that if people sincerely want to recover, they're usually quite humble and quite grateful,

and they are willing to accept the help and accept direction. In my experience, those who make big promises and big requests and show little action, at least little action that I can see when they're not taking action,

that's where I get a little more cautious before I commit a lot of resources or time to that person. We get to give, right? And this is a blessing in the program. We get to give. It doesn't matter when and how because we know, as it says on page 98, we do not stop drinking until we place our dependence upon God first, before everything else. We can't get. We can get well without support from others.

We just need God to get well. We do need to trust in God, but we also need to act as it says there

at the bottom of or in the middle of page 98.

We simply do not stop drinking so long as we place dependence upon other people ahead of dependence on God. Burn the idea into the consciousness of every woman that she can get well regardless of anyone. The only condition is that she trusts in God. And now the action and clean house that has there has to be action and that's where we understand the motive and that's where people get to really start their recovery journey. I'll pass to Cali. Thanks Kate. Wow, that was so awesome. I love

idea of just immersing ourselves in an attitude of service and serving other people.

We're going to talk a little bit more about that over these next couple pages. But first, the domestic problem.

There may be divorce, separation, or just strained relations. When your prospect has made such reparation as he can to his family and has thoroughly explained to them the new principles by which he is living, he should proceed to put those principles into action at home. So I think we're moving at home would be pretty effective as well.

But we are talking about domestics here. So before we talk more about trusting in God and service, I think this section, these next few pages could be also referred to as Alcoholics intro into Al Anon because it's about the Alcoholics. It's about our spiritual condition, not where others are at fault.

Some at the top of page 99,

middle of the paragraph. The most incompatible people discover they have a basis upon which they can meet.

I've never been divorced. I've had a couple real rough breakups, but I have lived in sober living. I lived in and was kicked out of six different sober houses. And I think this paragraph actually is pretty culturally relevant or, you know, to today to sober living. It's more common today than when the book was written. And when I read the most incompatible people discover they have a basis upon which they can meet,

I thought, wow, that's, you know, that was definitely my experience growing with other women in sober living. So I just thought I would share that

and I'm going to skip ahead a little bit to the paragraph that begins. If there be divorce or separation, there should be no undue haze for the couple to get together. And then skipping ahead a little bit more, this means a new attitude and spirit all around. And at the very end of the paragraph, let the alcohol continue his program day by day. So those are just really important Nuggets. I think from this page and paragraph.

This means a new attitude and spirit all around.

That's something that we cultivate through our relationship with a higher power and through our relationship with each other. Same with living a program day by day. That was not something that I could do. I could not live on a daily basis before I established a relationship with a higher power.

At the bottom of the page it says remind the prospect that his recovery is not dependent upon people. It is dependent upon his relationship with God, which we've talked about here for the past few minutes. And I just think it's so critical. And I have two quotes that I pulled that kind of support these very powerful statements. And the first is from a woman that I respect and love in the program who said I get well by trusting that my God knows what's best for me.

And the second quote is from another speaker, Sandy B, who said it is not our job

to solve problems. It is our job to do God's work. And that really kind of reinforces what Kate was talking about. And it's often, you know, what my sponsor tells me to do or just being honest. God's work in my life is being honest and being, being transparent and open and accepting.

The next paragraph in the middle, when it says we look back, we realize that the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands were better than anything we could have planned. So I've shared this story

probably 10 times in this meeting, but people listening to the recording haven't necessarily heard it. I,

I don't know, five years ago, 5 1/2 years ago, I had been sober for about 6 months when this all went down. So do the math 'cause I have five years today.

I was working in a job where I was traveling a lot and I had a corporate credit card and I just wasn't making the monthly payments. And I don't know what I was thinking. I don't know if I just thought it magically one day I'd be able to, but I just was being irresponsible with the company's money.

And eventually I've been sober for about 6 months. So it was that summer and I, I had wrapped up like over $9000 of debt and I talked to my sponsor, but I did a four step and a fifth step. I think I left it out of my fifth step actually. And a couple weeks later I was like, Oh yeah, one more thing. She was like, that's pretty big. You should probably talk to some people at work about that. So I said, are you no, like I'll lose my job. And she said, well, you know what,

you'll gain all this like you're not if you if you hold on to this stuff, you're not going to, you're not going to succeed. And so I went and talked to the CFO

boss and said, you know, here's what I did, here's my plan to pay it off. And my plan to pay it off was it was a route. They were minimal payments, you know, because that was all I could afford at the time. And they were very receptive and supportive and said, thank you, you know, for your honesty. And this is a great, you know, it's good that you have a plan and we'll just work with it. So I thought, Oh my God, like the program works. And a couple weeks later, I had taken the day off to go to the State Fair, and I got

a call from the CFO. And

what had happened was my payments weren't big enough. And so American Express had canceled all the corporate cards on the account. So everyone in the company with a credit card who is traveling or doing whatever wasn't able to use their card was frozen. And so I said, well, that's it. You know, I lost my job. And my boyfriend at the time was like, are you really thinking I'm like, yeah. And so the next day, I walked in and was asked to leave. And

I had just been promoted to, I just been promoted to. It was a great promotion and, and I thought, my life is over. You know, I can't believe this is happening. And I think my sponsor may have even laughed a little bit. She said, you know what, it's going to be fine. This is the thing that's supposed to happen. And

I saw my life is over. About a month later, I started working in a small agency where I met my now husband. So you know, life works great. And that's just one example of when we look back, we realize that the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands, AKA listening to my sponsor and working the program, we're better than anything I could have planned.

So I just wanted to share that personal experience.

The next few paragraphs emphasize again, not participating in family quarrels, but rather sharing our own experience. And that being the case, we can be present for Alcoholics and non Alcoholics, which Kate we'll talk more about next. Cool, thank you, Kelly. Well, so we're coming to the close of this chapter on working with others. And what we really see here is a little bit more instruction on

how, again, to

live life. Because

when I think back to where I was before I came into the program, my life was so small.

It was my couch and four walls and a lot of anger and a lot of isolation.

And so when we get into this next, this next little bit here on page starting on page 101, there's some reference to if we don't have a spiritual solution and if we're not acting toward our spiritual solution, we'll have to go to like the Greenland ice cap. And then there's risk that someone may, you know, come with some seaweed alcohol or something, right? So avoiding life is not the answer to

what our, our solution is because it's a spiritual solution. And, and early on, I, I do think that when we're not yet spiritually fit. And even at times when I mean, I have 2 1/2 years and there are days or weeks where I'm not spiritually fit even in those 2 1/2 years. And I need to take care of myself in a little different way and maybe exclude myself from some situations because I can't be in that situation. And I know that and I know that I have that

that knowledge now, but I think early on in the program and for a new sponsee, if they're not spiritually fit yet, yes, maybe they should really avoid bars and parties and things with family and people that trigger them to want to drink. Because the the real problem, you know, when you get to the end of this chapter on page 103, all of our problems are of our own making. And the bottle was only the symbol, right? The bottle is only

So what we need to do in our recovery here is think about how do we address those problems in our lives with a spiritual approach and with turning our will and our our power and our over to the care of God and our higher power. So early on, if we're not there yet, absolutely go to Greenland if you have to.

I don't even know what city you'd fly to in Greenland, and that's kind of funny to think about.

But later in your program with spiritual fitness, this is not a problem. And I get to stand a source for many other women who are in situations which may trigger them. And those situations could be a business trip. Those situations could be a family birthday party. Those situations could be having dinner and there's alcohol around. Or like last weekend, I was talking to someone and we wanted to go and do intentional acts of kindness.

Decided we would go to a VFW and give people hugs and talk to the veterans and thank them for their service. And a friend in my group said, are you going to be okay going into a VFW? Because it's basically a bar. And I said I think I'll be okay. And again, what it comes down to is my motive in the situation. Why am I going into a VFW? Why am I going to a birthday party? Why am I going to a work dinner? I'm going to a work dinner to show up and give to other people. I'm going to a birthday party to celebrate that person's birthday.

I'm going to that VFW last weekend because I wanted to thank veterans and give some kindness and love to them in the month of November. And so again, instead of tempting Providence, if we're spiritually fit, we can go anywhere in the world and we can show up because our motive is about

it's about giving to others. So on the bottom of page one O 1, ask yourself on each occasion, have I any good social, business or personal reason to go to this place?

Okay, check. Yes, I have a good reason. Am I expecting to steal a little vicarious pleasure from the atmosphere of such a place?

Maybe yes, maybe no. And you need to ask yourself this question. And the question I ask myself is, and, and I use this a lot on the top of page 102, not what am I going to get out, but what am I going to bring to the situation? How am I going to fill up that space in that room for other people and stand a source and service to other people? In the middle of 102, when I was drinking, I was withdrawing from life little by little. Absolutely, to the point where I had to pay people to hang out with me.

I mean, that's pretty sad, right? And now

I'm so busy that I get to have a conversation with God to say, OK, what resources can I give today? And I'm so blessed to give all these resources today. And I am of maximum helpfulness to others in my life. And what do I get out of that? On the bottom of 102, I get the promises. If I keep on the firing line of life with these motives, with my motives, God will keep me unharmed. God will give me the promises

before I'm halfway through. I will be amazed, right? So really, we know that in this chapter, in our experience, what we get to do is give our experience, share our experience, strength and hope with others. That's what we do in meetings. That's what we do when we meet other Alcoholics. That's what we do when we meet normal people who don't understand alcoholism. We get to stand a source for all of those people. We get to share that alcoholism is not about

the drug of alcohol itself.

It's a spiritual malady that we can work toward remedying with a spiritual solution. And as we share that with others, we grow, we get the promises, we are really benefiting from this. And not only that, but we get to help others do that too. So what I want to leave you with is if you're ever in question,

just check your motive. Ask God for support. Accepting life on life's terms is a choice.

We get to make that choice every day, and God will support us with that. And if you're ever wondering how to handle a situation with an alcoholic person who may or may not want sponsorship, who may or may not feel shame, or may or may not be ready to admit their alcoholism, just ask God to show me the way and give me strength. All right, with that, I pass Thanks, Kate. Thanks for listening.