Fellowship of the spirit conference at St. John's University in New York, NY

678 and to go to you to make amends, 5 steps come from the 4th column. That's how important the 4th column is. It's truth you can't get to on your own mind. It's truth that is not in your own mind some of the time, right? The other thing is something that came to me in the last few years, my last couple inventories. Check this out.

Stay in the fourth column until you can rewrite the first two and see that they were lies too. It's easy to see the third column lies. I'm not the greatest boyfriend in the world and I'm also not a piece of shit. Whether it was low self esteem or high self esteem, what I wanted was ridiculous. What I thought I needed was insane. How I thought you should see me was absolutely crazy. OK,

but I never saw always that the first two columns are also alive. So here's an example.

I got her name in the first column and the second column is that she left me third column. Mark described

on the greatest boyfriend in the world. No one should see Mr. A A being left. I wanted to stay no matter what I do. I need her to be OK.

I know friends don't leave friends. Sex, relations. Women don't leave men. Real men. Women don't leave real men. Men leave women, Right? And nobody leaving me should affect my I see the lies. I see through the lie. I see the lie. Turn the page over. I start writing. Where was I selfish? Where was I selfish? I did this. And I only cared about this and this and this. Put stuff you did. Put stuff you didn't do

three kinds of dishonesty. Outright lies. What's more dishonest, me telling you an outright lie or me not telling you the truth by omission. Just as dishonest self delusion. There's a third kind of dishonesty. One of the biggest lies was I thought I needed her to be OK. The third column you'll find your dishonesty. Where was I afraid? And all of a sudden, my, my intuition goes, holy moly,

you're not mad at her for leaving you, you're mad at yourself for driving her away.

So what I do now is this. I stay in the fourth column until I can rewrite the 1st 2 columns. And so far in the last three inventories, they've they've only been toward two things, either me

or God. Then when I'm done and I have those at the bottom of every 4th column,

what the real first and 2nd column should be, I take those as a new first column. And I got about 10 toward myself and I take the the second one, which is God, and I got about 10 toward myself

and I do 4 columns on those. And that's an inventory. That's the meat and the potatoes of the inventory. That's the kind of awareness that lasts for about two days after a fist tip, and you've seen it before you even get to the fist step. Take those 10 or 20s, just 10 or 20 more pages of inventory. So here's the key. Stay in the first in the fourth column until you can rewrite the first two. It'll either be toward you or God. Take those 10 or so toward yourself and the 10 or so toward God.

Do 4 columns on those. The third column of some of those will blow your mind. One of mine was

shit. I want to drink and not pay any price.

The other one was I want to control God,

right? Right through meditation and learning. And the 3rd and 4th column of those last 10, the other, the rest of the inventory help you with your amends. This inventory will be the root because you brought every resentment down to what it was really about. And it wasn't about all three column, the whole front page column one, two and three, all lies. Even if the truth about the lies are true. Even if the son of a bitch really did do that,

you got to see through it and see that it was a lie. Even if the truth about the lie is true,

powerful principle, you can see it. It's possible to see it. Inventorial show you

inventory written this way is so powerful can take what you absolutely think up to that moment is absolutely true. If you would have asked me during that inventory after she left, if you would have asked me the day you saw me. I'm in the first three columns. Who you mad at and why are you mad? I'm mad at her for leaving me. I will fight that to my death. And all of a sudden in the fourth column I saw holy moly, it turned the lion to the truth and the truth into a lie. I met it myself for driving her away

and I get to get free.

Sad thing is when they tell you the truth will set you free, they never tell you just before it does. It really pisses you off, right?

Stay in the fourth column until you can rewrite the 1st 2:00.

Now, about sex.

I'm really not the guy to be talking about the sex inventory. Mark Mark is the expert on this one,

but I've had some experience because the sex inventory ain't about sex. It's about subjecting each in relationship to this test.

It would be a very scary thing to find out that from the truth, from the theater, the lie.

We're going to talk about it in the 5th step as these personalities slowly start to be smashed through a a process of admission. Wouldn't it be really screwed up? And I hate to mess with those of you that have done a lot of work on your relationship

in a fit spiritual condition. If you know anything at all about equanimity. There is no such thing as a relationship when you're at one. Some people you're closer to, some people you know better. But there's nothing but love, compassion, truth, understanding. Relationships dissolve when you learn about equanimity,

right? There's no such thing as a relationship. We've seen what happens when you think there's a relationship. You ever gone home when you're in that third column stage state of mind and you're with your mother, your father, your sister, your brother, and your wife, and you're in a room and all of a sudden you can't say a word. You know why? You got a different relationship with each one of them, a different role with each one of them, a different belief system with each one of them. But through the 5th step and those personalities can be smashed,

you'll find there's no such thing as a relationship.

But we have to examine each relationship to see through the illusion of them.

And it asked us to list the relationships and then it gives you 9 questions. So I pray the list comes. A woman, A woman blew my mind one time at a meeting. I'm in inventory. I've been doing the work for many years. She comes up to me and she says you're writing inventory. I said Yep. She said have you gotten to sex inventory yet? I said no, I'm in the fear inventory. She said, let me ask you a question. What's the most important relationship in your life?

And I said God,

she said. Have you ever answered the nine questions from the sex inventory about your relationship with God?

Try it. It'll fuck you up. You'll see. The inventory will show you what you do with power, grace, and the love of God, what you do with it. Thank God that God ain't like most of the people that we are involved with because the people were involved with, you know, what they expect. And it's pretty healthy. She expects time, commitment, devotion,

honesty.

Boy, if my relationship with God was like my relationship with every woman I've ever been with and every human that I've ever known,

I wouldn't be here today. He'd be pissed at me. Look at the time I give him.

Look at the commitment. This inventory now is about what I do with power since my last time from one through 9, what I do in 1011 and 12 when I think I'm clear. Stay away from people in 1011 and 12 that know they're hot. You know when I think you're the hottest. The day you finish the last amend your conscious, you're untouchable. You're untouchable. Nobody can touch you, but you're open, you're wide, you're awake.

Then you slowly start to screw up that space between 9:00 and 1:00.

Yeah, right. Inventory. Next time you're in inventory, answer the nine questions about what you think is the most important relationship in your life. Right.

Answer the nine questions from The Sex Inventory about your relationship with yourself.

Put you and God on your immense list.

Try to make amends to yourself in a mirror. Oh, it sounds simple. It ain't going to be like going to somebody that I ripped off or lied to 15 years sober until I got to doing it. Don Corius asked me to do it. You know what it was? It was the last one. I couldn't bring myself to sit in front of a mirror in prayer and meditation and make amends to myself for what I'd seen in that four column inventory where they all came down to me and God. And then to sit in prayer and meditation, make amends to God and ask what I can do

with this relationship. I say that's so important.

Those that want to stay for questions, let's take a 15 minute break. Everybody else, I think they're going to start tonight at 7:30

mark and I'll be

alcoholic.

How about a few questions about Step 4?

As far as I know, they're going to be is Bart, Is Bart or Rick here in the room?

And they're starting tonight at,

I think they're starting tonight at 7th in at 7:30 with Mickey and Chris.

What else did I want to say?

7:30 tonight.

They're starting at 7:30. OK, let's go ahead. Any questions about Step 4?

You're in the ninth step but you're having trouble seeing the clarity and the 4th step, but you're asked to go back to the first step. Where's your sponsor?

Is it Sydney or Loretta?

Go to the person and ask them. We always think the most important thing is for us to be clear on what we did. The most important thing is for us to be able to be humble enough to ask them. What did I do that hurt you? Go to the person, ask them. Tell them while you're there, ask them what you did that might have hurt them.

About

yeah,

but you're into men's

and you have the list and you have their names. Let them tell you.

You do you have some clarity about your part, your selfishness, dishonesty, fear.

OK.

And I don't believe which which stage character is saying that.

Yeah, yeah. Well, get rid of that one

somebody real quick. This is this is my only comment on perfection. If you're if it's perfect, it's dead.

Two important things we forgot to mention about the sex inventory, and that is the 9 questions are on page

96.

So if you turn to 96, we'll find the instructions for the sex inventory that our friend Matthew uses.

I'm not kidding. Let's go to page 96 for the instructions for the sex inventory. And the instructions say. Don't be discouraged if your prospect does not respond at once. Search out another alcoholic and try again. You're sure to find someone desperate enough to accept with eagerness what you have to offer.

You'll find it a waste of time to keep chasing a man or woman who cannot or will not work with you.

Actually, the sex instructions for that inventory, which is about relationships, is on page 69, which is also ironic. And the nine questions are in the middle paragraph and the nine questions are we reviewed our conduct over the years past. Make a list,

pray. Let the list come. Add God, add yourself. The nine questions are Where was I selfish? Where was I dishonest? Where was I inconsiderate?

Who did I hurt? Other people around the relationship could have been hurt. I heard her husband,

her brother, mother. Where did you arouse jealousy? Where did you arouse suspicion? Where did you arouse bitterness? Where were you at your fault? And what should you have done instead? Keep in mind, it doesn't say what could you have done? You probably couldn't have done much better with what you had. But there's a lot you should have done, and question #9 used as a guide will help you form a sane and sound ideal for the future.

The sex ideal is very important, and it's interesting to me that it's the only part of the inventory that my sponsor ever warned me about not to do unless I wanted to see that area of my life change. But it's a chosen ideal. You ask God to help mold it, and it tells you what will happen if you don't live up to it. Don't try to set one that would be appropriate for a monk or a St. or a nun. Make it honest. You want to be monogamous? Make it part of your ideal. You want to have fun

and date. Make it part of your ideal. Make it an honest, chosen ideal that you can ask God to show you what's in your heart.

Any other questions about inventory? Yeah,

you had mentioned the movie Heat and.

Kill you? How does it apply to the 4th step and what did you mean by that?

All right, let me read you something.

Every piece of inventory that I have ever written,

I have written behind an attachment.

So I want to read something to you to give you an awareness of this.

See what he's talking about?

An attachment is a state of clinging

that comes from the false belief that something or someone is necessary for your happiness.

Do you have any attachment? People are things that you falsely believe you cannot be happy without. Make a list of them right now before we go on to study how exactly they're going to blind you,

and I'll talk more about that. But in essence, what he was saying was, is anything you're attached to outside of God in the present moment will lead to great suffering. That's the easiest way to say it. If you go in and look at your inventories, your resentment inventories, I promise you whatever you've written in, in whatever name

is behind an attachment,

whatever fear you write is behind some attachment, you have fear that you're not going to get it and that you need it.

In your sex inventories. There are normally about attachments, defined attachment as as an emotional state of clinging.

I always think of a Leech when I think of that, based on a belief system that I need something or someone in order to be happy and okay,

so that's what he meant by that.

That's great. I understand every time Mark and I have ever done this and we start to talk about the 4th column as far as getting free, someone always asked the great question. How does a three-year old, 4 year old, five year old, totally innocent, pure child see her or his part in some abusive situation? You don't, but you look at what you did with it for the next 20 or 30 years. That was selfish, dishonest, self seeking, rooted in fear

and how it filtered into every relationship you ever had and you get free and what you're doing with it right now

and the payoff perhaps. I've been writing inventory for 20 years on a regular basis and I've never found a resentment where I didn't see my part either. That something I did before the resentment? During the resentment or after the resentment?

This. Yeah.

You know, when I misbehaved, I got punished and I wasn't doing what they asked me to do. So I really did have a role, you know?

Yeah,

right.

Supposed to be the student

she was saying that when she saw her part with

not so much sexual abuse but with being punished by nuns or parents or teachers or whoever she did see her part, that there was things that she did to break rules

that led to

into a lot of these things. And sometimes I hear five things, six things, seven things when it talks about where were we to blame and our fault? Is that just the same thing? You know, what did I do? Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're great questions to use, but they belong somewhere on there. And a lot of people, something will come up that doesn't exactly fit under selfish or self seeking or dishonest or afraid.

Like things they specifically did fault or the other one you read. You know they can be written there somewhere.

The 4th column is just about getting to the truth.

Old.

She's asking another familiar question that there's a recurring resentments that show up on inventory after inventory after inventory. And my bet, which I guess would be a question to you, is I bet that attached to those resentments that keep coming back are an unfinished amends has been my case. When something can shows up, there's an unfinished immense connected to resentment.

Only guessing. Did you make amends?

No, actually the answer is no, I didn't.

Well, sort of, kind of maybe.

How about this one? Have you ever heard this? The only one I owe amends to, the only one I ever hurt was myself. Or how about this one my sponsor told me to make living amends, right? I heard a guy say one time his sponsor told him go to the top of a big mountain, make amends to the universe, and then he'd be done.

Question mark,

I don't know,

she said very quickly. I don't know if you've ever had this experience, but as someone in my Home group called me to ask me if I had, what was it?

Oh, someone called her

under the guise of amends and did nothing but explain to her what she had done to she reviewed. She reviewed her second column of you. You should have said thanks for sharing your second column with me. If you ever get a fourth one, call me back,

but

but a lot of I've heard a lot of therapists and probably sponsors that tell people go back to the people that that you were resentful toward and tell them what they did to to hurt you.

Yes, there was a lady there.

She's asking if, if you get to a name on your list and there's just one resentment, do you use a whole sheet of paper?

They're not gold tap. They're not tablets of gold. Use the whole page and write on that one. Resentment.

Yeah,

Joe Blow ripped me off for 500 bucks. Third column, turn the page over. 4th column

No no no no, no. One piece of paper for each resentment column one, two and three on the front. Turn the page over column four on the back and stay on the back page until the whole front page is bullshit.

And then the the 4th step has worked because it's turned what you thought was the truth into a lie and what you thought was a lie that you had anything to do with it into the into the truth.

Hi my name is Richard New and I just wanted to.

No talking about the

in making the 2nd evaporate.

Yeah,

yeah,

yeah.

Yep. What's the question?

Is that what you meant? Yes, he was saying in using the principle of staying in the fourth column to until you see the first two columns are a lie, that that's been his experience, that he's either

mad at God for not letting him be God or mad at himself for not becoming God.

Yeah, and that is similar to distilling down the fears where it ends up with two basic ones. And whatever fears you distill it down by doing 4 columns on the final ten, like 10 positive ones and their opposites,

you'll get down to two fears. They'll change a little bit each time through the work, but what they'll come down to is whether to die an alcoholic death or living on a spiritual basis are not always easy alternatives to face. That's the bottom line of the fear inventory for me most of the time. Yeah,

I Lassie, where are you from? Where are you from? Scotland,

Dublin, OH, What was the, what was the question?

I was so caught off in that wonderful accent. I was like it,

yeah. Is this with one specific resentment or the whole

she's saying she's saying if the 4th column isn't clear and you haven't seen your part, is it OK for the person that's hearing your footstep to help you with it? It's it's of course, absolutely. Yeah.

Yeah. The big book says that's life and death. You better have someone sitting across from you who understands that line, The big book, that it's life and death. And the 4th column is a key part of that. Where you're at fault, there'll be no freedom. It's the death of the ego and life of the spirit.

So sure was it.

Someone told me that I have to.

I need to pray since I'm unable to get honest. I need to pray for God to help.

How can I see my truth? Someone else is pointing it out

because they know themselves.

If it's true for me, it's true for you. There's only one. If I have special truth and you have special truth,

Oh, she was saying based on her question, how can someone listening to your fist step help you see the truth? Because they've had their own experience. Is it always going to be true, everything they say? Are they going to know the truth the way God might reveal it? No, it's going to be helpful.

It's going to be helpful. That's why the 5th step says we admitted to God to ourselves and to another person

told that I

absolutely

I can't get to the truth in the fourth column if something hasn't happened in 1-2 and three and God reveals it to me and through prayer

and I need someone else. The ego balks upon investigation. But just because the book says in the middle of the doctor's opinion that we can't differentiate the true from the false doesn't mean that that condition doesn't change when it comes time to see the truth. That be like saying everything that's true in the first step is going to be true when I'm in a recovered state. No, I've been I'm given power. I'm given power

in the 11th step. I'm not the same person that started one. The person that started one will drink again. The person that started one can't get to the truth in the fourth column,

but all of a sudden it was there when I got to the 4th column. The person in the fourth column can't go finish those amends.

And

someone's going to have to interpret that question that can hear her.

She she asked about destroying an inventory when it's done or comparing it to past inventories. I had a friend one time who who died recently. And when I met him in my first meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous five years later, I became his sponsor. And when I met, when I became his sponsor, he showed me a pile of old inventories that he kept in the house. And I said, go through them and see if there's any names that might help you with a new eight step

and get rid of those old inventories you're holding on to give them to God. But the other extreme is a lot of sponsors will say burn your inventory before you've gotten what you need out of it. As far as an 8 step list, I say get everything you need out of it to fill out your cards, which we're going to talk about tomorrow to be clear on your amends and symbolically in a way that's meaningful to you. Give it to God, get rid of it, get it. Get. Yeah, yeah, we we've only got a couple minutes left.

That isn't what the book says.

Come on, the big book says we're not the arbiter of anyones sex conduct. That's followed by we all need an overhauling. We avoid. What does it say? We avoided

advice. Yeah, hysterical thinking or advice. We let God be the final judge.

Counsel with others can be important, but

yeah, yeah, you've got that. Gives you the freedom to take it anywhere you want to take it. You said that gives them the freedom to take it anywhere once,

take it. But it is pretty clear what will happen if your sex conduct continues to hurt other people. And it's also clear of what will happen if you're honest and you've learned your lessons. It actually says, and it shocked me that God could take me to better things in that area.

But pimpin, pimping and Alcoholics Anonymous?

I'm just joking. Just joking.

13 Stepping

Can you share your experience?

I said OK, I'll I set an ideal.

When I first started getting asked to speak, I was three years sober and my sponsor had me speak at the International in Montreal.

Was the first time I spoke outside of Colorado. I made a commitment to myself. He didn't ask me to. I told him my commitment that I would never use this

as a way to get laid and I never got laid at an A a convention.

But

in my first sex inventory I had two women pregnant. One I had been with us a few months earlier, one I was currently with. I slept with my first fiancee Sponsee while she was gone to California. The only two times I've read my lovers inventory, the relationship ended within two weeks. I don't know if there's a spiritual

principle involved in that, but I have a slight idea that I probably would never read anybody's inventory again. And

I do happen to remember vaguely that while Mark was in treatment, there was a beautiful woman there that I was helping with the program of Alcoholics Anonymous by taking her to meetings. And we had an affair and she got pregnant. And I said, why don't you have a, why don't you have the baby? She said that might be a little complicated because my husband had a vasectomy

and the treatment center almost got sued and

ever since then I've been a St.

I.

I would say that those kind of behaviors did lower the expectations in my sane and sound ideal for the future

when I allowed myself to be human.

Oh God,

Glenn, we're out of time.

We'll we'll share on that issue tomorrow.

We, we actually, we are. We are out of time

nine o'clock 9:00 tomorrow morning.

And I want to thank Mickey again for sharing and making us laugh today

left is good. We need a lot of laughter. So that's the reason that we asked Mickey to come this weekend because we knew we were going to get serious and then we needed to laugh and enjoy ourselves. And we also asked Chris to come. And as a surprise, we we, we discussed it with him over the the weekend and he agreed. He doesn't say no, and he agreed.

You know, I just want to shoot. I had, I had like a preconceived notion for years of of Texans. I hated Texans.

You know, Chris, I never told you this, but

to me I thought Texans could just like say fuck you, really kind and you and and you didn't even know they were saying it.

And, and when I met Chris, Chris was the only person who ever became friends with or really got to know

a Texan. And that's not what he does.

He tells you the truth. Nice. He just, he talks to you the way it is, you know, he doesn't hide nothing. And he spoke for us last year, fellowship of the spirit. And he got a lot of friends from what I understand out of it. Me and him became friends. We we trade emails and talk. Once in a while he gets to call me back and talk to four crackheads instead and looking for me because he got the wrong number.

Anyway,

you know, I, I came to a conclusion this, this morning when we came back, you know, there was quite a few 100 people here last night and

this morning I noticed a lot of them were gone. And

I thought Mark and Joe were very calm.

They weren't yelling and screaming. They were just calmly telling the truth and a lot of people didn't want to hear it and left. Chris, on the other hand, is very passionate and he tells the truth and the same thing happens. It doesn't matter how you tell the truth and who you are. God assigns you a role and you play it and you tell the truth and peace on people stay and some people go.

And Chris has his way of doing it

and

makes me laugh

and I love Chris and I want to thank him again for agreeing to to share with us tonight and bring him up Chris from Hunt, TX.

Can you hear me? All right? It's so good. My name is Chris Framer. I'm a recovered alcoholic

and I'm honored to be here, guys, I got to tell you real because this was an afterthought, me coming up here and doing this and I, I, I'm not going to keep you very long. I'm going to, I'll try to make this about 30 minutes and I just want to visit with you a few minutes. I got a chance to meet so many of you last year and I, and I absolutely, I'm like, I'm like Bart, I never knew anybody from New York for heaven sakes. And it's like, it's like, I mean, you, you think you all got preconceived ideas. What Texans are, buddy?

I mean, you, you guys from New York been taking bad rap for years, you know, and it's like, I can't, I was up here last year and we're just absolutely blown away with your hospitality And,

and I was a consummate tourist. You know, that's, you know, you look at the Empire State Building and start crying. I mean, what's this shit? You know, I mean, it's like stuff you've grown up with as a, as a school kid and then all of a sudden you get to see it in person. And, and then there was the towers and stuff and what a year you all have had. And I'm just going to take a few minutes with you. I just want to visit with you for, for, for 30 minutes or so and, and talk about some stuff. I came up Thursday night and talked at my, my buddies Mike's group in, in New Jersey on Thursday night. And I got to follow Joe Hawk, eloquent speaker as he is, you know, from

from India and California and what a guy. And then I get to come up here and follow Mickey Bush. I mean this what is this my turn in the barrel this weekend? What

I got to come up here one time just and just do just me, you know, and then I don't have, then I have to bless. I got to say this. It's the, it's a hoot because I've shared the podium with Mickey a bunch. And I, and you know, a few years ago, some of y'all, some of y'all that have heard some of my tapes and stuff. I, I got, I do a lot of talking Cocaine Anonymous also. And I, I guess it was 2000, the World Conference. I, I got to speak and buddy, there was, there was 3000 people out there in that audience. It was 2000 in the ballroom and 1000 under A10 outside, and 500 people during my talk got up and left in mass

pissed off because they didn't like what I was saying from the podium. And it wasn't. They didn't like what I was saying. I think they like the tone I was using and I think the fact that I call them couch broke sons of bitches had something to do with.

But I took a lot of scalding from it, you know, and I'm telling you and I, I, I made demands where I needed to make amends. But I mean, the truth of the matter is we've got some problems in Alcoholics Anonymous and we've got some problems in our sister fellowships or Narcotics Anonymous and Cocaine Anonymous. The problem is, is that a lot of people aren't getting sober with a message that we, we should be all getting to hear. We're not hearing. And that's, and that's where I was coming from that night. But anyway, when I, I took so much heat for that nonsense, I got to tell you, it was Mickey Bush. It was right there

on my doorstep the next morning telling me how to carry the cat. I mean,

you think it's one thing to come up here and share. Somebody says, boy, you must really love this. I've said this from the podium before and I just need to say it again because I've got so many friends in this audience. I love seeing you guys and hugging your neck and being a part of your lives. I hate to speak from the podium cause 'cause I can't seem to quite get it right, 'cause when I, when I talk, I mean, I, what I, my intention is every time I come speak, I want to come up here and tell you a few stories, entertaining a little bit, talk to you about my recovery and then leave. But you know, it's like I get into this thing about 10 seconds and

God kind of kicks in. It's like, and I start talking, I'm a product of this of a fellowship that nearly killed me trying to help me get comfortable in this fellowship. They forgot to tell me how to stay sober. It's just exactly what Mickey was saying. It's like, it's like we were so busy with a, with a chicken shit one liners that we, we couldn't get down to what the message was about. This message is about having a spiritual experience and getting connected to God. And we're too busy trying to water it down and and and make it palpable for everybody to get comfortable at is that

is that? But I nearly died of a fatal illness. And so I come up here and I try to talk to you cats about this. And I want y'all to see where I'm coming from. I'm going to get fucking whiplash from doing this tonight. It's like, can we can we have done this?

Could we have done this any different? It's bad enough with one fucking eye in here, you know? And it's like,

God damn, Mickey, you watch that side of the room for me, OK? And I'll watch this side of the room, right?

I disappted. Another story. I know. Really,

I absolutely love Alcoholics Anonymous 12 step meetings. I love Cocaine Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous guys, it's the only game in town. I, I, I talk a bunch of, I do clerical work for a treatment center. So I get to see that into the perspective I get a lot of people want to come talk to me. I, I made a lot of friends with you all last year because I, I'd worked in the industry and we stayed connected And in fact I just the truth of the matter is this that there's a lot of good things come out of treatment centers. There's a lot of lot of great therapy and a lot of cool stuff happening out there, but our

straights suck. You see in our success rates should be better if we could get that. What happens to us is that we send people out of our treatment centers and we send them back into a fellowship. Now, if we're lucky enough to send them into to to some of the groups like you get you guys go to where they're actually carrying big books and doing the work. These cats stay sober the rest of their lives. They have great lives. But if we send them to meetings where all they want to do is sit around and piss and moan about their problems, they don't stay sober. And I'm see that's my job. I do the clerical work. If we get 1000 people through this hospital that I work a year and

my department, there's four of us and that's all we do all day long is call these cats. Hey, hey, you still sober, buddy? Lay the crack pipe down. Talk to me just for a few minutes. Let's let's rap. Let's visit just a little bit. What happened, You know, and it's like, it's the same story. I've been for nine years. I've been hearing this. Now, guys, you can get twisted about this if you want to. I mean, this is my nickel. I'm up here for free. You know, nobody's twisting my arms. You just need to hear this. If it wasn't the truth, I wouldn't be risking my friendship

you to tell you about this. The people are not staying in the fellowship because the fellowship is unfucking palatable.

Well, we need to. It's the truth. We can't keep the young adults in the meetings because there's too many people telling war stories that they can't identify with. We can't keep the women, the professionals in the fellowship because there's too many people using it as a as a process group. Alcoholics Anonymous is not now nor ever was a process group.

This is what scalded them in Phoenix. Because everybody thinks that what I do from the podium is that I make fun of therapy and that's the last thing I want to do. But there's two separate things. I'm a product of some great therapy. I, I went through a little little this time last year when I was here, I was married and I'm not married today, buddy. Don't you think I went through some therapy around that? You know what I didn't do, and I made a point not to do, was walk back into your recovery meetings and spilling my guts about that cheap shit 'cause it had nothing to do with you staying sober.

Ain't that right?

I just said it his most controversial thing I'll say from the podium and I'm gonna try to go through this real quick, but I got to say point blank, it's really disrespectful. I think when we go into meetings and just dump shit on the table and expect the room to clean it up and it's like I was I wish I could remember her name and I don't she's in she was what's your name Michelle. And we were talking earlier and we were talking about this business, about this. And then me is that the problem is, is that not that any of us want to be abrasive or abusive, is that we all have a tendency to want to walk on egg shells and

very gentle with the newcomer because we don't want to piss anybody off. But but you know, at what point I said it last year and I've said it 1000 times, there's a little article in box 4-5 nine years ago. And this lady in this thing said, at what point does does live and let live become apathy?

I'm so I'm so concerned about hurting your feelings that I'm just going to shut up and let you ruin the whole meeting for everybody talking about your horse shit. See, I'm an alcoholic, folks. I'm just like Mickey, Mickey and and Mark and the cats and so many of y'all I know in this room. I'm an alcoholic and, and, and possibly have some problems with cocaine. I don't know,

I just know I bankrupted 2 businesses around the cocaine, but I don't know if that had anything to do with me having a problem with it or not. But

but I'm doing this because I'm an alcoholic and a drug addict. Now folks, and here's the here's the key piece. And I think so many people don't understand. I think Joe and Mark have done a great job this weekend trying to explain this to you cats. Alcoholism and drug addiction is not causal.

Can y'all get your little hands around that? Alcoholism and drug addiction is not causal. Nothing out there is causing me to be alcoholic and addict. If if that is then what I need to do is do like we do in treatment a lot of times is treat that problem and then you can get the fuck out of here and go have a great life. See please by all means and don't let the door hit you on the butt on the way out because if you don't need to be here, we don't. We don't want you here.