The Joy of Living convention in Aspen, CO

I'm going to move this real quick because I'll knock it off.

It's tough being handicapped

My name is Chris Raymond I'm very grateful we covered alcoholic. I am honored to be here. This is I got to thank everybody to help me get here Eileen helped us with the tickets. I don't know everybody's got their own little job. You know, takes that Tim asked me years ago to do this and I mean it's scheduling. It's been crazy and and

I don't I guess people have asked me over the years, have you ever been to Aspen? Have you ever been to Aspen and ask? You don't know? It's like,

So what? You don't know? I haven't been to Aspen. I was like,

I'm just going to say I owe you all an amends. I, I, I,

no, you know, you get up in here, I don't care where you talk. You can be talking to Amarillo, TX. This is a beautiful part of Texas. This is, you know, you'd be very complimentary from the podium. Damn buddies. Listen, Aspen, you know, if you if you ever wonder where Jesus lives when he's not really busy.

There's a lot of pretty plays. I get to travel a bunch. I, I, I got sober November 13th, 1987. And I mean, we're going to treatment center business. I do clerical work for treatment centers and have for 20 years. And, and I just got a chance to start speaking from the podiums and got the chance to do that. And so, you know, you get to see all parts of the world and there's some gorgeous places out there.

Damn. I mean, what a place y'all live in. I don't, I can't imagine what it would cost to live here. Good heavens,

I'll ask Jesus,

Joe did great. He picked me up. He picked me up the the the the the crux of this deal. Let me look at the clock because I've got to show him that the Texas boys know how to watch the clock. OK, I got that. I don't want to over overstay my welcome. Joe pick pick this up on time and he can get me back in the airport in the morning on time. Then with this has been because he's sure been a great a great host. Some of these hosts that did some of these little conferences are not really great. They're a little little soul suckers

turn around without him being right there, you know, and so and they want to tell you their story all weekend long and just drives me crazy.

I've been honored to get a chance to visit with some of you guys and I'm delighted. I talked to Patty, my wife right before he came over here like I always do when she's not with me and she says tell you all hi and I'm going to rub it in. But next year we're going to try to come hunt our own dime. This is because I this she'd love this. And I don't know. We,

we celebrated our 10th year wedding anniversary last weekend in Houston. I had to do a talk and she came over. She's a troop. She's an A A2 long time 21. I don't know how long, 21 years or something like that in sobriety. And she, we go to meetings together and it's just The Who just I, I was talking to somebody earlier. Well, my husband goes to meetings over here and I go to meetings over here and I, God, what a crying shame. You know, I, I don't know, I, I,

this is my life, this not this speaking stuff, just in the fellowship, the guys I sponsor and I sit in my little Home group at the outpost. I actually live in Ingram, Texas. I, I've lived in Austin on and off, but I live in Ingram, Texas and have for forever. And a little old small town over there on, on I-10 just West of San Antonio. And if any of you guys ever get a chance to get down there,

you're lost probably. I don't know why anybody would go there, but you

stop by the outpost, we have a little recovery club. I serve on the board of that little thing. And there's a little, little AAP Ingram solution group meets there and, and it's the best. I get to sit next to my wife and, and I watch the guys that I'm sponsoring. I'm watching them watch her girls that she's sponsoring. You know how that goes. And it's the best. It's the best. We have a charmed life and

every bit of it is a direct result of Alcoholics Anonymous. I want to I want to get into this. I want you all to understand before I get in very far into this, that I'm, I'm here to share my experience with Alcoholics Anonymous. I, my experience will be different than your experience. And it's amazing to me sometimes. Like I said, I've done this a long time and amazing how how close minded some Alcoholics can be. I don't that's how may come as a shock for some of you. You know, we, we asked a little newcomer, you know, Joe, you know, you got to be

open minded and willing, you know, and then about five years, you just slammed your mind shut. You know, anything is if I say something that you're you're counselors didn't agree with, well, that he's wrong, you know, and it's like, guys, I'm going to say some stuff from this podium that you don't agree with. So what

I'm here to share my story and, and, and I and I got to do that. I'm not going to make up anything. I'm just I'm going to tell you like it is. Doug did we got the chance to do the little workshop this morning, this afternoon. And it was fun to get to do share the podium with the other speakers. And you know, he said something. It was, it was, I mean, it's the truth. You know, guys, if what you're doing is working for you,

you don't need a little one eyed guy from Texas come and tell you what how to change it up. If if you're sober and you're happy and you're kicking butt, rock on. My heart goes out to the cats that around the fellowship, that

who haven't kept up with the progression of their illness and, you know, they haven't worked a step and they haven't done much of anything else, and they're asking themselves if this really is worth it. I don't think it's OK to be in the meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous and be miserable.

There's something wrong

and that's where I was for so many years. And that's, that's, that's all I'm, I want to share with you. Is that, that story you, you got, I come, you know, again, I work in the hospitals and I get a chance to love on lots and lots and lots. You know, y'all get a chance to come in contact with a, with a few 100 drunks every year. I, I, I, I'm in contact with thousands of drunks and, and, and every year and I get to watch a lot of them come. Most of the folks that come to treatment goes, I don't know if you all realize this or not, but they've been to a A before.

And I, I've had this experience 1000 times. I've told it from the podium a bunch of times and little knucklehead will come in, you know, and he's all detoxing. Not the time. He's starting to come off that stupid Ativan.

You know, he'll be looking around for something to eat and you know, I'll take him to the little cafeteria and get him a Pop Tart and a Big Red. And you know, if listen, if any of you guys ever have to detox somebody, don't worry about the Ativan Pop Tart and Big Red again.

I don't know what it does, but it'll, it'll change. You don't spill it because it'll stain everything he touch. But this little guy's eating. He's got big red all over his mouth. You know what I'm saying? He's looking around and all his eyes focus up and we got some steps on the wall and the traditions and looks up and he goes, oh man, no way. That's not bigger for this kind of money. We get something besides the 12 steps. I said, buddy, no, really, no kidding. I says, how come he says, buddy, I've done the 12 steps. I mean, I've, I've been in a a it doesn't work.

See, that's the stuff that breaks my heart

'cause you see, I know for a fact, and in just a short conversation, I'm going to find out the truth. He's been to meetings in a A and he's never worked the steps. He never got a sponsor, He never stayed in all three parts of the legacy, and he damn sure never sponsored another alcoholic. And that's why he's not sober. A A works perfect. I've never known anybody and I've known some knucklehead fools. I guarantee you I've never known. I've never known anybody that came and did all three parts. I don't even care what

attitude you bring to it. I don't care if you work the steps perfect. I don't care how you do. Just do it and a miracle starts to take place. And this thing called a spiritual experience is absolutely real. I got a lady in my group. I introduced myself as a recovered alcoholic because the big Book says I should. And she says it at our Home group all the time. She says God's grace is continual.

I don't have to walk on egg shells every day because those those old ten step promises have come true and I've been placed in a position of neutrality, safe and protected. All I got to worry about is how much joy am I going to squeeze out of each day? How many cool things, how many, how many envelopes am I going to push in my lifetime? God, that's what it's about. I'm this little, little little fried pie on 7 medications a day. When I tried to commit suicide watching a little black and white TV, my life was over at 35. I'll tell you a little bit about it, but I'm, I'm

about recoveries you can get and I just whatever path you're working, if it's working for you, that's great. Sometimes I just, I feel lost in my own fellowship sometimes, you know, because anybody. See,

if you think this is a really cool cover for a Grapevine, you're going to hate this talk.

Play

we were talking about it the little deal today at the little workshop. Richard mentioned it and I and I've got a sticker on the back of my book. If you ever want one, e-mail me and I'll send you some some of these stickers. I have them made by the thousands. It's one of the cool things that God lets me do with my money. I get to, you know, make cool stickers and stuff and give them away to people I don't know a little cheesy maybe, but it says this is an excerpt from a letter that Bill Wilson wrote in 1942. As Bill sees it, you can look out there on the table and look at it and but the but the letter says it says

our chief responsibility to the newcomer is an adequate presentation of the program.

See, it means means I don't know who I'm going to see in this room again. All I know is let's say you're at my Home group and I see a little newcomer coming in. I got to make sure that I fulfill what I'm supposed to do, my primary purpose. We just read it in the traditions. My the 5th tradition tells us that we've got one primary purpose and that's the carry the message to the alcoholic who still suffers 1

1

one, not a lot 1 primary purpose. That's to make sure that little knucklehead that walked through the door understands what this program is about. Whether he stays or not. Buddies, I don't know. Who knows they we come and go. It's a revolving door out there. What the heck? But I only way I can sleep at night is to know that the little guy got the message, that he understood that it was about the 12 steps

and the ensuant spiritual experience that removed the obsession to drink.

And if all we're doing

is this,

and we don't happen to be talking about the solution at this, then we're not giving him the adequate presentation that he needs. You'll follow. Some of your heads are spinning already. I don't know what to tell you. I just feel a sense of responsibility. Bill Wilson and Doctor Bob, they went to all this trouble to do the work. I want to read something to you. Bottom of page 164

it's some of y'all were talking about that this week last second. The last little paragraph says abandoned yourself to God as you understand God.

Second third step buddy, we're as open a roomy as we can be. You can pray to Mr. Magoo for all I care. I don't care. Pick something I don't How?

How can you be in this area yesterday, watching that snow come down and not believe there's a God? I don't care how smart you are, it's pretty cool. Abandon yourself to God, Admit your faults to him and your fellows. But this step, making the amends, clear away the wreckage of your past, absolutely give freely what you find and join us. You shall. We shall be with you in the fellowship of the Spirit, and you will surely meet some of us as you trudge the road of happy destiny.

This is he just summed up. These are the 12 steps he just summed up in one paragraph.

But our meeting in print says no, you don't. All you got to do is just don't drink and go to meetings.

I got the meetings down. Don't misunderstand what I'm saying. I love the meetings. I still go to a boatload of meetings. Y'all follow? I got the meeting part down. It's the just don't drink part that I'm having a little problem with

because my book says if you can choose not to drink, you're not one of us. And I hear people in meetings all the time. I got up this morning and chose not to drink. Did you really?

I think the Elks Club need you.

I know. Oh, that's terrible. I shouldn't have said that

somewhere along the line we got this idea that it's OK to kind of mix this up a little bit. I'm not knocking meetings. I'll tell you about my story. I, I grew up in we were born out in Odessa, TX out in the oil field. My father was a, was a printed an oil field magazine and he was a one of the finest printers you'd ever want to come a technician. He, this guy was amazing And I've got a mother who's a professional artist. She's still alive today as I I work part time so I can be home in the Hill Country with her some She's lost her eyesight a few years back and and she's

she can still whip my ass. I think she's a she's a she's amazing stock. I I absolutely love to be with her, but I've got an identical

twin brother. He's up in Cheyenne, WY tonight doing the same kind of thing I'm doing here and I've got a little sister that lives over in Portland and half sister and raising the same family. We were talking earlier. Perfect. I mean, nice family front row of the Baptist Church every time the door was open, no goofy stuff going on. Pops was a drinker. That was it. And he was there was a genetic predisposition. We know that's for a fact. That's OK. It's this is this is how it comes down to Pike usually and most of us. I don't care where I'm sharing all over the world. You know, you can be

wherever you can, you can talk to people. Can you see some alcoholism or addiction in your family and everybody laughs and kicks the guy. Hell yes. You know, you kick my family tree buddy and they drop out like nuts in the top. I'm, I'm just, there's a, there's a bunch of Indian blood in my family and we, we, I can be president of AA one day with that lineage. I mean, I,

I qualify, I qualify, but, but the point I want you to see is that it's in my little sister and my, my older sister, they've never had a problem with alcohol. My older sister one time asking, asked she can you go to the store and buy some beer for the, we're having, having a party at New Year's Eve party and they were cooking hot dogs and stuff. And I, I said absolutely. And then she said, oh, well, that bother you? Because they still think I'm going to, I'm going to be triggered by something and, and drink, you know, and it's like, buddy, I'm no, that's not going to bother me. Absolutely not. Give me the money. How much you want. She gave me a $20 bill.

How many are you expecting? And she said, I don't know. I don't know. We're we're, we got hot dogs for 60 or 70.

You're kind of cheap here, aren't you? I mean, it's 20 and I went and bought $20 worth of beer. I mean it laughing the whole way And, and I guarantee if you go to her house right now, there's still some of those beers in the refrigerator. It's just guys, we're not like other people. My mother, I guarantee I watched her 1000 times. Somebody overheard me tell it from the podium. She can drink a glass of wine every night at 5:00. Some doc she had cancer. One time a doctor said this would be good for you. You drink a glass of wine and she does unless it doesn't taste right. And I've seen her a million times. She'll take

Bony finger and she'll slide that glass across the table and I know the stuff. Fixing to hit the fan. I said mom, what's wrong? She says it tastes a little off. OK Mom, does that mean you're not going to finish it? She looks at me like I'm crazy, like I got 3 heads. What? No, she's not going to finish it. She just said it tastes off.

I don't care if there's a dead cricket floating in it,

cigarette butt. You know what? I was like OK now come on.

I mean y'all understand what I'm talking about

I ain't drinking for the taste I'm not drinking for the color of the ambien. I I'm I'm trying to get right. And that was years of me drinking before I understood what that meant. I didn't want to get drunk. You talk to those kids all the time. Why do you dream drink to get effed up And I just want that's not why I drank. I don't want to get like that. That's when you get a DWI and get a fight with a girl.

I want to get

you all know what I'm talking. Just the right amount of stuff in your system to be John Travolta. That's what I that's what I want

in there. Doug will tell you the same step in the morning because exactly what happens guys, this stuff works. People are always trying to get me. Chris, you have such a high profile out there. We want to get you on this anti drug and anti alcohol campaign. Absolutely not. Why would I want to do that? There ain't nothing wrong with that stuff. If you can drink it like a normal person, go for it. Because of the genetic makeup,

I can't.

When I drink alcohol, I can't guarantee you how much I'm going to drink. Sometimes I can just drink a little bit. The craving sometimes can be satisfied with two or three drinks. The book says can you do it every time? Can you guarantee me every time you put that stuff in your system that you're going to be able to stop? How many times was I going to go? I'm going to go pick this girl up and we're going to have a nice night. At about 3:00, I start to get 3:00 in the afternoon. I start to get ready, you know, because it takes

some of us a long time to get ready. I don't know.

And I'm getting right, you know, at 3:00 I open a beer because I'm going to get, I'm going to be John Travolta. And you know, at 5:00 I was John Travolta, except I wasn't. I was picking her up about 7, you know, and I kind of passed the mark up a little bit. You, I'm a little sloppy and it patches a little crooked and you know,

was that my intention to do that? Absolutely not. But something happened. My first wife used to come with you and I'd be sitting down with a 12 pack of beer all dead around me like that. She'd walk in. She says, my, you were thirsty this morning.

Come on, guys. I mean, he's the the dullest of us in here. Even Oprah understands that. That little piece that was not. I like Coca-Cola too, but I've never sat down like a 12 pack in the morning.

The craving kicks in and we're off to the stupid races. If that was all we had to worry about, we just keep putting you little knuckleheads in jail and pretty soon you said I'm tired of going to jail, I'm going to quit.

I'm just going to not drink.

Except the second piece that makes this a fatal illness kicks in the obsession of the mind from 23 to 43. If any of you guys are straddling the fence out here, ladies got you young guys in here, Anybody, anybody out here straddling the fence wondering, I'm not sure if I'm a real alcoholic or not because Bill, those are Bill Wilson's words, not Chris Ramos.

Bill Wilson talks about. But what about the real alcoholic? I'm not talking about the little disco drunk. I'm talking about the cat. You'll follow. It says he's not going to do it anymore and does it anyway. That mental obsession, that insanity that the book talks about is what the steps and the second step we're talking about to return us to sanity. I don't have to stop myself from drinking. Sanity is returned. I know what that stuff is now and I don't have to drink it anymore. That's a great place to be. I don't have to hide from it.

Triggers. Oh my God, how many of you guys drank at night?

OK, I'll be careful when you leave tonight. I don't.

Guys, let me tell you something.

The reason I drank was not because of the things I was doing is the things that I wasn't doing.

I got people in here tiptoeing around, worried I can't go home, why I drank there. Oh,

where didn't you drink?

You'll not Look, I've been in the industry for a billion years, guys, I'm just telling you early sobriety. We can teach you that stuff all, all you want to. You're going to spend the rest of your life tiptoeing around. You'll follow. Oh, I can't go near that wine aisle. Then you're not recovered. You're not well yet. Let's finish your immense. Let's get you working with somebody. And I guarantee you, you can come and go any place you want. It's the nature of the beast. God, it's what how free do you want to be? Is what my sponsor used to say. I want to be free so I can go do all the cool stuff I've always wanted to go do without having to worry about

it. Freaks me out,

yell with me, mental obsession that suddenly when it hits you, Oh my God,

I ended up in the food business. I was bussing tables at a hotel in Kerrville, TX, and there was a Swiss chef that owned the place and they're back there cooking. You know, I still get tingly every time I see a chef in his whites, you know, and he's got his checkered pants on, you know, and he back there and he's just slinging skillets and there's flames everywhere. And it's just, it's, and I'm a little busboy. I'm back there thinking that's where I went because all of those guys are getting laid. I got to tell you that for a fact. I'm just saying I know, I know.

They're drinking on a job, and they got all the dates they want, you know, and I'm this little skinny guy and I'm looking. I says, man, I want to do that. The guy says, man, come with us, let's talk about it. And we went to his little chef's office. I'll never forget it. And he opened a beer, and he slid it across the table and says, here, have one,

We're still at work. He says, yeah, I know. I'm 17 years old. And he says, but if you're going to work back here with us, you're going to have to drink like us. Hot damn. I mean,

this is turning out to be pretty cool. You know, back in the day, folks, folks didn't care if you drank on the job. Reviewing the food business, a lot of you guys are like, as long as you can show up and, and do your job and go home and not, not 'cause I'm a bunch of headaches. They don't care what you drink. It's just no big now that with litigation out there, they, they kind of clamp down on that. But back in the day, you could drink all you want. I thought this, this is the bomb. And I went off to Houston, got an apprenticeship program and it was pretty talented. I was pretty good and

I started making little money and

had a nice little apartment with shag carpet.

Some nice green, green appliances. You'll remember the avocado green appliances. Oh my God, this is before John Travolta and it, it was pretty cool. Beanbag chair, you know, was pretty hot. And

because guys, because you all need to understand, because everybody talked laughs about this. There's a time when alcohol works. I mean, people don't understand. We talk in the meeting nonstop about, you know what the, when it where their arrest and the throwing up and all the bad stuff that happens. But there was a time when it worked that we wouldn't be doing it. My I watched my little sister get sick one time and that was it. I said, at least you want another drink. She says no, I'm starting to feel it. I don't ever want to feel that bad again,

OK? Can I have yours? Yeah, absolutely. Let's.

I mean, that ought to be the question we ought to ask every alcoholic. Did you ever get sick drinking? Did you ever get sick more than once? Uh-huh. Welcome to Alcoholics Anonymous.

I, I we don't need 20 questions. I could still see myself walking out of that bathroom wiping my mouth. Must have been the chicken. I don't know.

You want another beer? Yes.

I'm not finished yet. You know, I'm doing pretty good in Houston. I'm holding it together pretty good. But by the late 70s, I'm starting to experience a thing that some of you are really familiar with called depression. And it is kicking my butt and I'm seeing doctors about this depression. The number one symptom of untreated alcoholism, whether you're drinking or not, is depression,

not clinical depression. It's just depression as a result of the illness. And one of the one of the Bill Wilson talked about it. He wrote about it extensively. He fought it for years. I guarantee it if you read the history around it. But I'm seeing the doctors and of course, the request. Are you drinking? Yeah, some, a couple. And here we go. You know, so it's the same stuff. And, and, but it's starting to affect me in all of these other areas. And I finally ended up getting married to this old woman. She was a sweetheart and

she really was a nice girl. And

I, a counselor told me one time and says, Chris, if you want to get sober, you just need to get married. Put some roots down. Luckily we didn't put roots in the shape of kids down, you know, because that would have been a nightmare. But we just, we got married. I moved up North Texas to be closer to my twin brother and I took a job at a Country Club that whose chef was a cocaine dealer. And it was working out OK for a while. And

I'm doing all those other outside issues and drinking like a fiend. And I'm taking seven medications a day. Chris, you're not an alcoholic. You, you have a bipolar disorder. So anybody can see that, Chris, you're not, you know, it's just manic depressive. You've got some schizoid tendencies here. You need a little medication here. And your adult attention deficit disorder was the big one right there. You can't seem to focus, Chris. And we're going to give you some of that and chop it up, snort the daylights out of it later on.

I'm on so many medications. I glowed.

I came home one night and I was really, I was, I was banged up and she said something wrong and I shoved her. You know, I'm one of them West TX boys. We just you don't touch a woman

ever like that, and I scared the daylights out of her. I just

after the cops left, it was just a screaming match neighbors around the yard and all this and I'm showing my butt like a big dog and I, I he's a stupid and I she's what what what happened? What asked? I just I did too much cocaine. I did some other stuff. I did just I'm drinking too much. And she says, first we talked about that. Of course you're drinking too much, she said. But you're going to have to stop

because if you want to stay married to me, because I'm not ever going to be embarrassed like this again. This is ridiculous and I'm and I'm embarrassed. You know,

I'm what we call one of these functioning Alcoholics. Y'all ever heard that expression? I see I'm not going to jail, but I'm periodically I'm making some good money and then I lose that job. Lose it. I never got fired from a job, but I'll quit the job because they didn't use the right tone with me.

Carlos was saying the other day, you know this, we're so hyper vigilant, you know, we're sensitive to everything. You know, I know what she was thinking when she talked. You know, I can read minds and it's, it's stupid, but. And then I'd be eating out of dumpsters in Houston, TX, you know, and then

I'd get a cool little job and a little sous chef's job someplace and I'd start making some more money and I'd buy, get a little condo. And, you know, it's one minute I'm doing great, the next minute I'm not doing so well, but I'm not having a whole bunch of drama on the outside. And so the families think I'm holding it together pretty well. And

anyway, I promised her I wasn't going to drink. And I got to tell you, I'm going to reiterate because all the speakers have alluded to this. I when I looked her in the face and told her that I was going to quit, I meant it with every fiber in my body. I am so sick and tired of people painting pictures that every alcoholic out there is a liar. Was there sometimes that I, I lied? Absolutely.

So do the people at the Elks Club, everybody. We're no better, no worse than anything like this. Addicted personality. You have an alcoholic mind. You have

crap. You have an illness, a disease called alcoholism, and you're loaded with a whole bunch of character defects. Let's work on those. You'll follow everybody. Every time anybody wants to do it, they blame it on alcoholism. You're cheating on your wife. Oh, it's alcoholism, buddy. You've been sober 20 years. What are you? You're an alley cat. What are you? What? What,

you want to blame it on the alcoholism? Alcoholism is about my drinking. That's, that's where we need to go with it. Anyway, I looked her in the face and told her I was going to quit. I meant it with every fiber. And two weeks later I had a beer after work with one of the chefs and came home patting myself on the back because I didn't get drunk and see. But my deal with with her was that I wasn't going to touch another drop. And she could smell it from the curb. And she went straight. No word, no nothing, no fight. She just went to the

bedroom and packed. I had five more years left in me

blaming her. She deserted me. I chased her out of that marriage on the front of a Mack truck.

Years later, years later, I was able to make amends to that woman. And when she sat down and listened to my men, she said, Chris, thank you so much for taking the time. It took me 13 years to track her down and make that amend. She wasn't hearing it for 13 when I finally sat down. And she says, I'm so grateful that you took time to do this, but you don't have a clue what you did to me.

And then she told me

thank God for Alcoholics Anonymous.

I'm working for my twin brother up in North Texas and I'm living a little crappy apartment that my sister in laws had to cosign for me. I'm driving an old beat up pick up truck and I got big old long hair and a big old bushy beard and I'm

I hate my life.

Can you relate to that? I still have this idea in my mind but you don't understand my case is different. If I could get that job, I'd be OK. If I could get that apt, I would be OK if I could get that woman with us. I mean that's when I got married. If I could just marry that woman, I could be OK. The two weeks later she's shoveling Cheerios in her mouth and I'm sitting over there looking at his God, if I could just kill this woman I would be OK. And we laugh and I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but how many of y'all are like that? You know? That's what the geographical cure. I still drive a pickup because you never know when you have to move again. You know,

I got to get out of Texas. I moved to Atlanta, GA. Like there's no drinking in Atlanta, GA.

I heard a guy yesterday, exact same thing. Cruise. I got to get out of Austin. I just can't. I got to get out of Austin. I said where are you going to go? She said. Houston. Good idea.

Good. You can't escape it guys. It's just it's everywhere. That's not the problem anyway, I, I'm working for my twin brother and I picked up a stack of return checks one night and

I've been going to AA guys, I gotta tell you for seven years. When I, when I was trying to save that marriage, I started going to Alcoholics Anonymous and this old boy qualified me one night. He says, when I first showed up, he said, Chris, are you, are you, do you have a desire not to drink? And I said yes. And he was qualifying me for membership and Alcoholics Anonymous. He was not qualifying me as an alcoholic. You'll get the difference. It's two, two different things. You can anybody can be a member of A A and R you know every I mean we're we're full of people that may or may not need to be here, but but they're here and

want to be here. They're welcome. I got no truck with any of that. But he didn't qualify me as an alcoholic. He just said come on in. And so we went around the rooms and it's the same stuff. Y'all heard me talk about it a billion times. Some of you I meetings were divided into two kinds. We got problem solving meetings where we talk about your grandkids. Oh my God, heaven forbid, and I don't have a problem with that. But that's all we talked about. The other ones were, Oh, we got a newcomer coming back. Let's tell Chris how we got here and I know a lot of y'all like those meetings and we call them ID meetings in certain parts of the country. I don't know what you'll call them up here in God's lamb, but

ID meetings means that we're going to go around and everybody's going to tell how they got here, which means we're going to get to hear your drunk a log and then we're going to hear your drunk a log and your drunk a log and your drunk a log. And I got to tell you guys if there's anything I say from the podium that's ever misconstrued is controversial. This is what I'm saying. Your story is so important it's not even funny. Friday night from the podium like we've been doing this weekend. You better have a good story. Make up some shit. I don't, I don't, I don't care.

What are they going to do, Fact Check it? I don't care.

In a 12 step call, Doug and I are going to go get this guy over here at Denny's. We're going to talk to him about a A and he's drunk. He's not going to listen to us until he finds out who he's talking to. He's going to tell him some stories. I'm going to tell him some stories. He says no kidding. You really did that good. You, you just like me?

Yes, Sir.

And somewhere in the conversation that guy is going to say, But you don't seem to be drinking now.

No, Sir, I'm not. I've been sober 26 years.

No. Yes.

How'd you do it? It's like fishing. Click easy, go see.

Really easy not to

when he asked the question, how did you do it?

Set, set the hook. And really, man, that's all you got to do. But he never would have nibbled on the on the on the hook if he had to give him a story. You follow now I got it and he's coming to a meeting and now we're going to tell him some stories. And for the first couple of weeks, it's going to be pretty cool. And then my experience, listen to thousands of Alcoholics who hate it. They're going to get tired of it just like I did. Really.

How did you get here? Let me. Oh shit, Let me guess. You drank too much

'cause we're, we're Listen, guys, I ain't gonna get off of it for just a second. We're killing women with this. There's thousands women out there that won't come to Alcoholics Anonymous because they're sick and tired of listening to the stupid stories. One story after another. This guy had the DWI. Oh, it's scary. This guy, she, she, she chopped up three people and she's had 60 Wis and this one's been to prison. And this one, I'm not making a lot of any of this. You all understand. With a sponsor, with somebody you're working the steps with, and a 12 step call from the podium

tell all the story. I'm just asking why is it that every meeting we go to, most of the world, we've got to spend it with ID? They're here. There's no chapter in the back of the book called into scare. Can we share some hope with these cats?

It's meeting formats. It's not the personalities. If your meeting format suggests that we do that, then then I would suggest that some of us, as responsible members of a A, go back in and change some of these meeting formats. I'm going to tell you what happened to me. Seven years in and out of Alcoholics Anonymous. I can't stay in these rooms. I'm picking up chips. You'll follow. I picked up so many chips. The last time I picked up a chip, nobody applauded.

They were, they weren't feeling the love, you know, they said, Chris, could you bring some of these chips back? You're bankrupting us, you know,

But it's like we were talking about I do great guys for a couple of weeks. I come in and I want to stay sober, right? They every time one of you little guys relapses, we just blame it on you. Well, you just didn't want it. But the truth is, nobody's telling me how to get well. I'll take some responsibility, absolutely. But nobody. I didn't own a book for seven years, never got a sponsor. Nobody ever got in my face and said, Chris, what are you doing, you idiot? You're dying here. Nobody.

You, just you. You just keep coming to meetings. It'll be all right.

Not if you're a real alcoholic it won't.

Guys,

I know intuitively that AA works because I see you stay sober, but I can't get sober.

1987 I picked up that stacker return checks in my little apartment. It was November, cold outside and I walked in there and I, I can't, I just, I'm opening these checks and I bankrupted another checking account. I'm 35 years old. I'm going to have to go back to my sister-in-law one more time and borrow some more money. Y'all understand this? I, you could just, you could just let your family down so many times, you know, and I'm not trying to, to glorify any of this. I just, I got up. I've been to treatment,

I'm on 7 medications. I I I'm going to your stupid meetings.

I fed the ferrets and water, the old sick Ivy and stacked those checks on the table and went to the medicine cabinet, took 2 bottles of pills and tried to die.

Got those pills about down to my down to my top part of my stomach and I heard this voice said don't do this, go back to a A and I'm arguing. I kicked the ferret cage. I said, see if the ferrets were talking. I don't know what I heard that night. This wasn't Carl, this wasn't a thought. Perhaps you should get, you know, interesting hypothesis. This a a perhaps you should was none of that this intellectual. I heard a voice that said, I've got emails from all over the world from people that heard that same voice. Sometimes it was a man's voice, sometimes it was a woman's voice. Don't do this. Go back to a A and I,