Pollock Pines, CA

Continue to speak of alcoholism as an illness of fatal malady. Talk about his condition of body and mind.

Doctor's opinion,

Which account is it?

Keep his attention focused mainly on your personal experience. He built went around talking about spiritual experiences with the 1st 70 some odd people he tried to work with and none of them got sober. And Doctor Selfworth got along with him and said, look, you got to give him the problem first. You got to lay this, this obsession of the mind and allergy of the body on him and insanity and death. You got to that's to get their attention. You got to get on that first, and then you could tell them the rest of it.

Explain that many are doomed who never realized their predicament.

I cannot tell the truth and the false, and if not careful, I will drink myself to death right in front of you.

Doctors are rightly loath to tell alcoholic patients the whole truth unless it will serve some good purpose. The doctors won't even say you're alcoholic.

I mean, it's really interesting. They like to get them to tell them that they're Alcoholics from a professional idea, but it's just interesting. There's a famous guy who Bob Pearson, I can use his name and gave me permission. Bob Pearson was the and the general office in New York. I've got a great interview with him and his wife Betsy became in 1961

and they ended up having to go see a very famous. He's a guy. He's the last store in the Big N He had two esophagus hemorrhages and people usually do not survive the first one. And so they had the second one. He's surviving the second one. He asked the nurse how many people survived these things. And so he said to him, oh, you're the first one we've ever had that ever survived even once.

He said, We don't think you can survive this week.

So when you start, yeah, they do. They get you up, finally, get you walking as quick as possible. And they get him up and he's doing pretty good. And he's quit bleeding from the throat. The veins, the veins in the throat of the weakest place. That's why they break. That's why you have esophageal energy. And usually you'll bleed out if you're not careful. You can't put a tourniquet on your throat.

So he he gets out of bed as soon as he gets out of bed and let him walk around his little pajamas. He just walks himself right down to the liquor store and buys him a little vodka. And he comes back and he loves to call his wife when he's drinking for some reason. He said I never could figure out how she knew. And so he gets a little Snoop through and calls her up to, you know, and she calls the doctor said he's drinking. The doctor's a friend. Doctor gets mad, says I, I can't, your wife may have to put up with this, but I don't. And he said, well, what are you going to do with me?

He said I'm going to send you to a specialist. That guy's name was Doctor Harry Tebow. Doctor Tebow in our history is a prominent Doctor Who gave his all along with self worth and some number of others.

So they took him to Sephora's office, I mean to Tebow's office who has had in the same building the other doctor had. And he says to her, after talking to him, he says I can't help you.

He tells his wife he is surrounded by seamen and I can't track through it. He'll die before I can never find out what's going on. But I know some people that can help him.

And he looks at 5 and he said, would you like me to give you the numbers of eight? Oh, I don't want to. I don't want to put my problems on somebody else. And he and Bob said later in life, he remembered the guy reached over and called the number. He had it by memory. And he got his first sponsor. And the guy drove up in the porch at the top bath. And he was a lawyer for the city and he had a handlebar mustache. He was quite a flamboyant guy with a scarf that flew out. The

they drove down the road, gave him a scarf and took him to his first meeting. Never had a drink fest, isn't that amazing?

It's amazing.

You may talk to him about the wholeness of alcoholic, of alcoholism, because you offer a solution how you like that one.

If you have no solution, what good is it to talk about it

by standing over the cancer bed? Let's talk about the cancer. Boy, you look terrible today. Look at how yelling, I think talking about a solution. You can talk to them about the hopelessness of this thing. If you don't have a solution and you're in some doctor's office and he's got no solution, all he's going to do is talk about hopelessness. I'm going to come out of there terrible. I'm right, He's right. I don't. I'm hopeless,

but you offer a solution

and that's what makes us different than anybody else in the world. I heard a guy the other day in the meeting, I'm really glad to hear this kind of stuff, he said. We are not. This is not a therapy. I Polished Anonymous is not therapy.

You will soon have your friends admitting he has many, if not all of the traits of the alcoholic. If his own doctor is willing to tell him that he's alcoholic, so much the better. Yeah, from time to time, he'd get one to say so. Even though you're now he's a protege. How do you like? He's moving up, right? He's a protege. He's your pal, you know, he's a guy that follows you around to the meetings, you know? Come on, Mike. We're going to the meetings.

Mason

confrontation with absolution is brutality

and I want to write that in the book.

Confrontation

without solution is brutality. We all got it.

Confrontation without solution is brutality.

Would you think it was brutality if you went up to Napa?

Four or five people

started picking on the schizophrenic.

You're going to be here the rest of your life. Hahahaha

yeah. You really messed up aren't you? No solution. You've got to be. We have, we have enough. We have something we can offer people. We have a solution. So he said he has become very met his condition. He has become very curious to know how you got. Well then he's got he wanted the leading question. What do I have to do? Oh boy, oh boy. I'm ready.

Tell him exactly. Let him ask you that question if he will tell him exactly what happened to you.

The spiritual feature freely don't back up on God.

If the man be agnostic or atheist, make it emphatic that he does not have to agree with your conception of God. Yes, that's true if he can choose any conception he likes, provided it makes sense to him. The main thing is that he'd be willing to believe in a power greater than himself, and that he lived by spiritual principles.

He doesn't have to identify that power.

When dealing with such a person, you had better use everyday language to describe spiritual principles. There's no use arousing any prejudice he may have against your theological terms and conceptions about which he's already confused. Don't raise such issues, no matter what your own convictions are. Oh, change the name on you.

Your prospect may become a religious may come from religious denomination. His religious education and training may be far superior to yours. In that case, he's going to wonder how you can add anything to what he already knows if he but he will be curious to learn why his own convictions have not worked.

Roland Hazard, on his second visit to Carl Jung,

says the young young said to him, I never been successful with an alcoholic of your time. I misdiagnosed you and the only out I think that you have is you get yourself a bodyguard or lock yourself up.

Roland hit the bottom. He's not stupid. And he says it felt like the gates of hell had closed on him with a clang.

And he's just standing there demoralized. You know, is, is there nothing there? Is there nothing? I'm desperate now. Is there nothing? Here's one of the greatest minds I have all the faith in this guy can't help me. Where am I going now?

Can't see Feroid. He's all messed up. So he says is there nothing else? And the old doctor says he doesn't understand it, he says. But from time to time, he says, people have had spiritual experiences,

have changed their life, he said. You know, to me,

these are phenomenons I can't explain to you from a from a doctor's training. I'm an MD and a psychiatrist. I can't I can't explain it to you. So Roland gets real desperate. And he said, oh, well, after all, I'm a good church member. I'm bright enough to do that. You don't have to be a psychiatrist of that nature, Roland. Yeah, that's right. But you still a drunk rolling,

you're going to church, but you're still a drunk, you know, you got to find something else. And of course, although we know what happened, he found the Oxford Group,

so then he worked with Debbie. So your prospect we did that already knows. He would be curious to learn why his own convictions have not worked and why you're seem to work so well. He may be an example of the truth that faith alone is insufficient to be vital, life sustaining, vital faith must be accompanied by self sacrifice and unselfishness. Constructive action, service,

Service service.

We practice these principles in all of our affairs. It's how I stay out of me

out of me. Let him see that you are not there to instruct him in religion. It meant he probably knows more about it than you do. Famous story of Bill on the wet 12 step called of a Catholic guy.

But Carly's attention, the fact however deep his faith and knowledge, he could not have applied it or he would not have drank. That's right, a little religious. I love the priests that come in, you know, full of religion and drunk. I don't like good Baptist preacher coming in drunk, you know.

Perhaps your story will help him see where he has failed to practice the very precepts he's knows so well. Here's where we come from. We represent no

particular faith or denomination. We're dealing only with general principles common to most denomination. So where do we come from? What are our principles come from? They come from the common denominations of that day. Are you sitting here waiting to go to work?

There you go.

All right, here we go.

If if when you look at the books and it talks about faith or denominations, we're dealing on with general principle of common, the most denomination. This book bill of credits to Doctor Shoemaker of the Calvary Mission. He's an Episcopal priest.

He says he's the influence for this book. He will after every fades on him and it's not around. His sponsor became a guy you call the spiritual advice of the name of Father Ed Dowling. You can read a book called and there is that list back. I see that somebody came up. I bought that list up. It's a great book called The Soulless Sponsorship. It is a wonderful book

called The Soul SOUL of Sponsorship,

and if you find that list, it will tell you where to look for it on the Internet. You can order these books, but it's a great relationship. When you get to this book, you're going to find it. It's going to be saying things like 7 deadly Sins. You don't find that over here.

Sins of omission and Commission, That's very Catholic. So there's some influence. Bill will take the lessons from the Catholic Church. He won't stay with him, but he took the lessons. All right, now you're down to taking some action with this guy because he has now said he would like to do something and they're not backing up at all here. They get they lay it out. You got to come to him with depth and weight. You can't come in an alcoholic

with with baloney, so he says. Outline the program of action

one through 12 Adam was going to have to do explain how you made a self appraisal step four of how you straightened out your past that they nine and while you're now endeavoring to be helpful to him. Step 12.

It's important for him to realize that your attempts to pass this on to him plays a vital part in your own recovery. Actually, he may be helping you more than you're helping him and that is the absolute truth.

I made lots of 12 step calls that didn't work, but I'm still sober.

Make it plain he's under no obligation to you that you hope, only that he will try to help other Alcoholics when he escapes his own difficulties. So I think the two promises go and let 12 step tall with me night a day and work with others when the time comes. See, I know it's coming. So I just fell them out front.

Suggest how important it is that he placed the welfare of other people ahead of his own. Absolutely. I told you about that today,

made it clear that he is not under pressure, that he needn't seek you again if he doesn't want to. You should not be offended if he wants to. Call it all for yourself. You, more than you, have helped him.

If your toss has been sane, quiet and fully human understanding, you have perhaps made a friend. Maybe you have disturbed him about the question of alcoholism. This is all to the good. The more hopeless he feels, the better

he will be more likely to follow your suggestion.

Now he's going to call him another. Name. Your candidate.

They give reasons why it did not follow all of the program. Oh boy, my sponsor says. I wish they'd never put the steps on the wall.

He may rebel at the thought of a drastic house soon. Step forward, which requires discussion with other people. Step five. Do not contradict such views. Tell him that you won't spell as he does, but you doubt whether you would have made much progress had you not taken action on your first visit. Tell him about the fellowship of Alcoholic Banana,

then that we meet group of us. If he shows interest, lend him a copy of this book. Mine's too marked up from study. I'll give him a new one. They can do his own study.

Unless your friend wants to talk further about himself, do not wear out your welcome. That's a important thing to do. Give him a chance to think it over. If you do not stay, let him steer the conversation in any direction he likes. Sometimes a a new man is anxious to proceed at once, and you may be tempted to let him do so. This sometimes is a mistake. If he has trouble later, he is likely to say you rushed him.

You will be more successful with Alcoholics if you do not exist any passionate for for crusader reform.

Never talked down to an alcoholic from any moral spiritual hilltop. Simply layout the kid a spiritual tool for his inspector. Step one through 12.

Show him how they worked with you. This is how you sponsored. Offer him friendship and fellowship. Tell him that if he wants to get well, you will do anything to help. That's absolutely true. If he's not interested in your solution, if he expects you to act only as a banker for his financial difficulties or nursing or his trees, you may have to drop him until he changes his mind. Some people might call this tough love.

This he may do after he gets hurt some more. Pain is the price

of admission here.

The flamethrower on the cheeks of my butt that drove me through them doors was alcohol. But you didn't know. You didn't care to know you.

If he is sincerely interested and wants to see you again, ask him to read this book. In the interval after doing that, he must decipher himself whether he wants to go on. He should not be pushed or prodded by you, his wife, or his friends. If he is to find God, the desire must come from within.

It is unnatural for the soul to be separated from that which created it. It's just as unnatural for the child to be separated, the parent

very painful as parents whose children die before they do

terrible thing.

If he thinks he can do the job in some other way, or prefer some other spiritual approach, encourage him to follow his own conscience. I am big on that. Please go out and get everything out of the way. Get it all done. Try ask for a while. That don't work. Well, alright, let's go and do this, you know, let's find something more, get it all. If I'd had one more good idea, I'd be dead.

I had to find that kind of bottle.

We have no monopoly on God. We don't and people do recover in other ways. We just happen to be some guy talking in a meeting that Mike and I and he kind of went after me a little bit. We talked about God lot here and I'm an atheist and I sort of stuff so he couldn't draw me in. But I can tell you this,

of all the recovery in the world today, including the medical and the psychiatric and all 12 step programs around of all kinds with all kinds of deals,

no one even gets close to us.

No one has ever even got close.

Hospitals seduced about 3%.

No one's ever even got well, think about that for a minute. Never. They don't even get close to us.

Nice, he said. We merely have an approach that works with us. This is a voluntary, totally voluntary thing. I want to go back to that line

where he talks about the design must come from within. Have you ever thought about that for yourself? Have you ever thought about why you stayed and they didn't?

Because I know you know lots of them that didn't. Have you ever thought about that? Someone was handing out why we were chosen today,

But that's a tremendous statement. They're talking about the spirit from within. They're talking about your soul.

They're talking about the essence of your life.

That's deep stuff. I mean, I wish I could give you a beautiful explanation. I can't.

But I'm talking about this is beyond. Beyond. And they recognized it.

I don't know. I just knew when I came here that I'd had enough

and I didn't know I could quit drinking. I found you people. I thought you were marvelous then, and I think you're marvelous now.

You are the first place in my life that I ever fit. Does that make sense?

Do you feel that way?

I sit here. I've never tired of it. I got tired of a lot. I've been president of unions. I've done a lot of stuff in my life. Never, never have I ever tired of this. And I never tired of hearing the story of recovery coming out of the lips of somebody that's the speaker of that day

that didn't have to drink that day. I've never thought of that story,

oh man. But point out that we Alcoholics have much in common that we would like in case to be friendly and let it go with that.

Do not discourage if you're well, let's see. I'll do that and then I'll let Mike talk a while. There's a big joke here. I'll tell you what it is this lady,

our sponsor, he went to her and she says

I've never had sex sober. The sponsor each of it and our sex indicates that we really need to work this out with God and no human being really can do this. Maybe some old timer that's been around and married and you know. So anyway, she tells her to go to page 69 and read about sex.

The time she gets home that even she got the numbers backwards and she goes to 96. So let's see what you read about sex.

It says do not be discouraged if your prospect does not respond at once. That's kind of clever, isn't it?

Search out another alcoholic. Try again.

You're sure to find someone desperate enough to accept with eagerness what you offer. I like that

we we may we may find it a waste of time to keep chasing a man who cannot or will not work with you.

If you leave such a person alone, he may soon become convinced that he can cannot recover by himself. To spend too much time on any one situation is to deny some other alcoholic of an opportunity to live and be happy.

One of our fellowship failed entirely with his first half a dozen prospects. He often says if he had continued to work on them, he might have deprived many others who have since recovered of their chance. Suppose now you're making your second visit to a man.

He has read this volume and says he prepared to go through with the 12 steps of the program of recovery. Having had to experience yourself, you can give him much practical advice. That's all sponsors do. They just walk with you as you take the steps

with some experience with God.

Let Him know you are available if he wishes to make a decision called Step 3

and tell his story. 4:00 and 5:00

but do not insist upon it if he prefers to consult someone else. We will try anything but God, just anything. Are you ready, Mike? Fire up kids.

So he may be broke and homeless. If he is, you might try to help him about getting the job or give him a little financial assistance. But you should not deprive your family or creditors of money they should have. Perhaps you won't take this man into your home for a few days, but be sure use discretion. Be sure to be welcomed by your family and that he is not trying to impose upon you for money, connections or shelter. Permit that

and you only harm him.

You will be making it possible for him to be insincere. You may be aiding his destruction rather than his recovery.

It's so easy when you start. For me, I got to tell you, it's just my story. I first start sponsoring and it's like I want to do everything I can to help. I'm going to save the world. You know, My ego is coming back into the thing and these are like my babies,

you know, and I next thing you know, I'm performing a service function

instead of responsible function. You know, there's a level at which you can do everything in your own experience will tell you that. But but

I often get sponsors when the question is, well,

I just need a little money. I just need to like get a place to stay and I'll be OK. If I just get like $100 in my pocket, I'll be alright, you know?

I just need some connections. You need to help me get a job. That's not what I do. I'm your sponsor. I'm back up here on the two paragraphs back up the page. My job is to be available if you wish to make a decision to tell your story

so it says

back on page 97. Never avoid these responsibilities. Be sure you are doing the right thing if you assume them helping others as a foundation stone of your recovery. A kindly act once in a while isn't enough, you have to. You have to act a Good Samaritan every day if need be. It may mean the loss of many nights sleep. Great interference with your pleasure. Interruptions to your business.

It may mean sharing your money in your home. Counseling. Frantic wives and relatives. Innumerable trips to police, courts, sanitariums, hospitals, jails and asylum. Your phone may Django at any time of night and day. Your wife may sometimes say she's neglected. A drunk may smash the furniture in your home or burn a mattress. You may have a fight with him if he is filing. Sometimes you may have to call a doctor

and administrative under his direction. Another time you may have to send for the police or an ambulance.

Occasionally you will have to meet such conditions. Now, remember, this is 1939 when the book came out. There's no treatment centers. There's no detox. There's no hospital that wants to take drunks. The people at this time in the history of a A are in fact serving as detox centers, taking drugs that are home doing all these kind of things. It's not as prevalent anymore, but my experience is, is that I have been in that position. I have taken sponses into my home. I have supplied them with a little money.

I have tried to do what I can do to help a sponsee and it becomes very

Gray area between one of my stepping over that line and one of my not

so it says. We seldom allow an alcoholic to live in our homes for long at a time. It's not good for them. It sometimes creates serious complications in the family.

So an alcoholic does not respond. There is no reason why you shouldn't. You should neglect this family. You should continue to be friendly with him.

The family should be offered your way of life should they accept and practice spiritual principles. There is much better chance that the head of the whole family will recover and even though he continues to drink, the family will find life more bearable. Once again. This was before Al Anon. Al Anon, that wasn't in place at the time that the book was written and at that time,

those sponsoring an AA, we're dealing with families a whole lot more than they do today. But it still doesn't mean that when you're sponsoring that you're not going to have that occasion. As Don was talking about earlier, we're a mother or a sister or a wife or somebody is going to be calling you saying you're a sponsor. Why isn't this guy getting well?

You know, You know, why aren't you doing what you need to be doing? You know, and it's difficult to say, you know, Joe, I'm just a sponsor, but you can also counsel him on our way of life. You know that this is a program that requires participation on the part of the alcohol

for the type of alcoholic who's able and willing to get well,

That's a that's a very conditional qualification for that guy or girl

who is able and willing to get well, little charity in the ordinary sense. The word is needed or wanted.

Men who cry for money and shelter before conquering alcohol are on the wrong track.

Yet we do go to great extremes to provide each other with these very things when such action is warranted. This may seem inconsistent, but we think it is not. Once again, I'm drawing a line. I have. I have to look at each situation. I need to judge what's taking place here. And if I've got a sponsee that's saying no, I'm not going to, you know, I'm not interested in doing these steps. I'm not interested in reading the book until I get back to my job and I get a roof over my head.

I'm not going to do these things.

And my experience of the Salvation Army and elsewhere, but particularly the Salvation Army, is once you get in there, you got four walls around, you got food and you got a shelter and you, you know, they don't pay very much, but you know, you're safe. Then all of a sudden my need, you know, what I needed and wanted is I got this basic necessities done. My enthusiasm for being able and willing

to get well

start drifting away. I need you to be at your bottom. You know, that's what that's my judgment. Are you, am I bottomed out and am I working a program and am I moving forward? Then it can make some sense for me.

I got to tell you don't can verify. I spent a lot of time when I first started sponsoring. I'm on the phone with Don Oh, this guy really needs some help. I really got to do something for him. My kids don't know what I'm going to do. And,

you know, next year. No, we're not working steps anymore. We're talking about the Bank of Mike.

You know, we're talking about why don't you come over and see me today and let's go have lunch and you're buying.

So it's not a matter of giving back in the book. That's not a matter of giving that is the in question, but when and how to give.

That often makes the difference between failure and success

very important line. The minute we put our work on the service plane, the alcoholic commences to rely on our assistance rather than upon God.

Wah, see that's what was so great about working with Don. Had me start going to Salvation Army in all the years I've been there is that I understand they're a service organization.

You know, what they want to do is feed and house and clothe and provide a service for people that are indigent and that are Alcoholics and addicts.

And I let them do the service part.

Now they think they're taking them to God and that's OK. They can think that I also come in there, but I'm in there to take them on the program. And that helps me to finally understand what that is. Because when I need somebody just at a meeting I wanted, you know, I start thinking I'm the Salvation Army

or I'm, you know, what is it the

Sisters of Charity or the Poor Sisters of the Poor or the Catholic Charities Foundation or, you know, somebody else. I mean, that's not our job. That's not what a sponsor is supposed to do. He clamors for this or that claim he cannot master alcohol into the material needs are cared for

nonsense. Long sentence,

some of us have taken very Hard Knocks to learn this truth. Thank you very much.

Job or no job, wife or no wife, we simply do not stop drinking so long as we place dependence upon other people ahead of dependence upon God.

Well, I can't.

I can't. As much as I want to. I can't go play God again,

burn the idea into the consciousness of every man that he can. He can get well regardless of anyone. The only condition is that he trust in God in clean house. That's my job as a sponsor to help someone on the path to their understanding of their relationship with their God so that they can recover the way that through the spiritual experience of alcohol. It's not

now the domestic problem. There may be divorce, separation or just strained relations. When your spot prospect has made such reparation as he can to to his family, and as thoroughly explained to them the new principles by which he is living, he should proceed to put these principles into action at home. That is, if he is lucky enough to have a home so his family be at fault in many respects, he should not be concerned about that. He should concentrate on his own spiritual demonstration.

Argument and Paul finding are to be avoided like the plague.

This is a difficult thing to do, but it must be done if any results are to be expected.

It persisted in for a few months. The effect on a man's family is sure to be great. The most the most incompatible people discover they have a basis upon which they can meet. Little by little, the family may see their own defects and admit them. These can then be discussed in an atmosphere of helpfulness and friendliness. See, I can't, my program comes first. My sponsees. It's like, you know, I've got this problem with my family. I got this problem with my kids. I need to go work on my job and you don't need to do anything

except get sober

and work these steps

and find a relationship with God as you understand God. So then you can be of use to somebody else. It doesn't matter job or no job, wife or no wife, if I'm not a sober person,

I'm not going anywhere.

There's nothing else to solve. There's no reparation to be made. I can't make restitution for anything because I'm still going to be living in the problem, not living in the solution.

After they have seen tangible results, the family will perhaps want to go along. These things will come to pass naturally and in good time. Provided, however, the alcoholic continues to demonstrate that he could be sober, considered and helpful. Regardless of what anyone says or does. That's all I have to do. You know my sponsee, I'm telling you. Sober,

considerate, helpful. Regardless

of what anyone else has it up.

Of course, we all fall much below this standard many times, right? I'm not going to get there, but that's the standard. But we must try to repair the damage immediately, lest we pay the penalty with a spree. The danger isn't that I can't ever get back. I I start thinking that I'm not going to get back something. I started living in the past. You know, I want to go back and recreate something. I want to recover something. Well, guess what? What I did, I've done. I cannot change the past

in my 4th step. You know, when you guys come in, it's like,

I think I'm going to be able to go back here and like fix this. Now that damage is done, those harms are done. That is behind you and all you can do is clean house and straight down out as best you can, but only if you've gotten through the steps.

So if I'm going to sit here in a sponsee sponsor relationship and you're going to continue to tell me about all of the problems and issues that you have,

I'm going to continue to tell you that you better go to God with them.

Because I got to go to the solution.

I got to bring my sponsors out of being in the problem. Like the book said, your problems are nonsense.

Our problems, we think, are of our own making. I think that's what it says factor on about page 62.

If there be divorce and separation, there should be no undue haste for the couple to get together. The man should be sure of his recovery. The wife should fully understand his new way of life. If their old relationship is to be resumed, it must be on a better basis since the former did not work. This means a new attitude and spirit all around. Sometimes it is to the best interest of all concern that a couple remain apart.

Obviously, no rule can be laid down.

Let the alcoholic continues program day by day.

When the time for living together has come, it will be apparent to both parties.

Why am I going to go back and become the director and try to figure out how I'm going to put relationships back together? What? I could never do it in the beginning.

Why am I going to not look at doing the 12 steps? And I'm going to think that somehow I have control over the fact that I can change somebody else's life.

There's no rule to be laid down. We just let it continue day by day. And when the time for living together has come, it will be apparent to both parties. It's not a one way St. I never understood relationships in the 1st place. Why am I all of a sudden? I haven't had a drink for a week

and I'm smart.

Let no alcoholic see he cannot recover unless he has his family back.

This just isn't so. In some cases, the wife will never come back for one reason or another.

Remind the prospect that his recovery is not dependent upon

people,

it is dependent upon his relationship with God.

We have seen men get well whose families have not returned at all. We have seen others slip from the family came back too soon.

Oh, I can't control this.

Both you. Both you and the Newman must walk day by day

in the path of spiritual progress.

See, I'm walking with responsive. We are walking hand in hand, but we're not walking towards what we want. We're walking towards a spiritual relationship. We're walking to get closer to God as we understand God.

If you persist, and these are promises, if you persist, remarkable things will happen. When we look back, we realize that the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands

were better than anything we could have planned.

Follow the dictates of a higher power and you will presently live in a new and wonderful world. Number matter what your present circumstances.

See, I love it. I got, I got guys.

I just love them to death.

You know,

I got through the steps like at 10, nine. I've done nine. I've done some of my men's. But you know what? I met the most beautiful woman and I think this is really it.

But mom feel like in step eight you haven't made a single amends in step 9, but you think you ought to wait till nines over and you cleaned up some wreckage of your path before you start creating wreckage in the future.

Oh no, I have a relationship. My phone rings and somebody starts out, I have a new relationship. I say talk to God, call me later.

See, I can go from wreckage to wreckage to wreckage. I'm what it's saying here is I've got to be on a path of spiritual progress. I got to find my spiritual well-being before I start going back to all those other things.

So it says when working with a man and his family, you should take care not to participate in their quarrels. That happens all the time. I'm not parties, none of my business. My only business I have is to walk with another man to a relationship with God of his understanding. You may spoil your chance of being helpful if you do but urge upon a man's family that he has been very sick person and should be treated accordingly.

You should warn against arousing resentment or jealousy. You should point out that his defects of character are not going to disappear overnight.

Show them that he is entered upon a period of growth. Ask them to remember

when they are impatient, the blessed fact of his sobriety.

If you have been successful in solving your own domestic problems, who

tell the newcomers family how that was accomplished?

In this way, you can set them on the right track without becoming critical of them. The story of how you and your wife settled your difficulty is worth any amount of criticism. I'm only ever speaking to my own experience. That's what the book's telling us here. I don't go one inch beyond my own experience.

You know, if I got a sponsee that I mean, you know, if I'm single and I got a sponsee that's married and he comes to me and says, jeez, how did you make things better with your wife? Or how can I make things better with my wife? It's very difficult for me to say. You know what? I think I'll give you some advice,

but I've never done it. Now people come to me and they want advice about it. I said, well are you serious?

I could. I couldn't follow my own advice. I don't have advice, but if I have an experience that I can relate,

that's tied to the solution, that's tied to the program, then I've got something to share.

Assuming this is a big one. Assuming we are spiritually fit, we can do all sorts of things Alcoholics are not supposed to do. People who said we must not go where liquor is served, we must not have it in our homes. We must shun friends who drink. We must avoid moving pictures for drink that would show drinking scenes. We must not go into bars or friends must hide their bottles if we go into their houses. We mustn't think or be reminded of alcohol at all.

Our experience shows that this is not necessarily so.

Step 10 told us,