The 22nd Annual Mens Fall Retreat in Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada

Thank you, Mr. President.

That was almost a 10 minute break. That's almost historic and I hate you know you have to have a roundup if you have a 10/10/10 minute break gathered up the herd,

so I commend you on that. Good stuff

in

it was skimmed a little on further on in this thing, but the yeah, wrapping up on the part on Step 10. It's one of the shortest riding, but it's got some of the heaviest stuff in it that I really like that

and talk about that thing of what happens when we let up on quit practice in it. Of course, you know the old stuff returns you get we get a full refund on our misery. The what we have is our daily reprieve continued on that maintenance to the spiritual condition. Every day is a day when we must carry the vision of God's will into all of of our activities. How can I best serve these? Thy will be done, and if I will not mind, be done.

These are thoughts which must go with us on constantly. We can exercise our willpower along this line. All we wish is the proper use of the will.

And

one more paragraph and I'll share a little something along that line. Much has already been said about receiving strength, inspiration, direction from Him who has all knowledge of power. We have carefully followed directions. We have begun to sense the flow of His Spirit front into us. To some extent we have become God conscious. We've gone develop His vital and vital 6th sense. But we must go further, and that means more action.

And, and by the way, a lot of people call these three steps maintenance steps. And I think anything but.

Yeah, I think they're building steps. They're really action step, not maintenance at all. It may maintain, but that the primary thrust of this thing is put this thing into motion. Let it be a way to live, not just a way to be you benignly grateful for stuff.

Let me tell you a thing that that that I do at at it fits me. You know, I don't don't try to market it, but it's just something that fits me. There's

I, I have a routine.

I did it on the porch this morning, but I do it every morning If I'm at home, I do it in, out, in my in, in have a little little patio area and have a pond there that with waterfall and I like water. I like to be around. Water is soothing. There's just something about it that sitting by a mountain stream is by idea of paradise that that is a wonderful place to be. Do you want to sit outside? No,

no,

my idea, not my reality.

But thanks for the offer.

Outside in Vancouver is not usually a wonderful idea, but yeah, but but what I do every every day, if, if I'm there and I do it elsewhere, ever I am. What I do is basically to, to, to implement that spirit of what this is talking about.

I, I go out, I go out to that pond and I have a little bit of breakfast at it. I normally just have to prove maybe a cereal or something to take the dog, let him bark the squirrels and all that. And so I just sort of sit there for a while and, and I do three basic things. You know, when I'm trying to meditate, you know, the first thing I'll try to do is get my mind slowed down. Yeah, I, I don't know about you, but my mind races most of the time.

I mean, my, my mind's almost an enemy because that sucker is always proven into something.

And so first thing I have to do is just get quiet and down as much as you can. I mean, it never quits, but at least can tone down, you know, so that's not just making a lot of noise. So I sent it for the line and just sort of get, get open and get peaceful and, and so I can be receptive, you know, and then then three, there's three basic things that I do to get suited up.

One is I reflect on who I am,

not just that I'm Tom. I was true, a nice young man, not that, but but who I am as a human being.

And I'm a guy who by any measurable standard ought to be dead. I mean, there is no way that I can justify being here. There is no way that I can explain why I've done all of the goofy stuff I've done and survived. By any standard, I ought to be dead

and not instead of being dead, I have been given a life beyond imagination. Most people who have alcoholism, the overwhelming majority of, of people who have alcoholism died of it. You know, just like David, you're an awful lot of people who try to die. You know, it's a terrifically fatal illness. And so the overwhelming majority of people on earth, you're probably 90% of the alcoholic population in this world have never heard of anything to do for

never, you know, don't even know it exists. And they die of conditions in total ignorance, you know, and, and in our country, the, the death rate is extremely high. The suicide rate is extremely high, both in and out of a a So it's, it's a terrifically deadly illness. And so I just reflect on that a little bit, not morbidly, but just realistically that by any kind of measurable standard, I can't explain why I'm still here. I mean no way.

But instead I've been given a solution. I didn't even look for it. I mean didn't even ask for any help. And I was given a solution that had some work requirements in it, but I was given a solution. I didn't even know a a existed.

And some people just said, hey guy, try this. Yeah, nobody ever pushed me into anything to just basically gave some concerned guidance and said, yeah, you ought to try that out. And and and with that kind of a feeble non effort, I walked into a program and and a life happened that not only gave me a life, but a life beyond my imagination. That's literally true

beyond my imagination. And and so

I reflect on that a little bit. You know that that here's a guy who ought to be dead, who's been given something you didn't even ask for and been given a life that's just beyond description.

So I think about that and I think about how grateful I am for the gift I've been given that it doesn't take long. You know, the whole exercise, I'm taking a little longer explaining just to try to draw the picture because that's all it is. You know, it is. It's not you like trying to God make me a spiritual robot. You know what my real purpose is? I'm trying to get in tune with my higher power. That's what I want to do is get into the right wavelength into, into sync with my higher power.

And and so

I reflect on that for just a little bit and and think about how grateful I am for that life.

So the second thing

is that I want to wear that gift. Well,

if I'm so grateful, I want it to show. I want it to show. I want to be an example of what sobriety looks looks like in a grateful human being. I don't want to be some grumpy grouchy yo-yo that's got some snide remark for everything. I cut people a little bit every once in a while, but gently

let me know they're cut to. The arm falls off,

but, but

I want to wear that gratitude. I want it to look good. If I'm so grateful for what I've been given, I want to look like I might even be remotely worthy of the gift. David Yeah. I don't want to be some guy that just sort of pollutes every environment I get into. I don't want to do that. And I want to be a good example. Yeah. If I somebody sees and say that, you know, that guy there, he's he's real active in a, A I want to look like a good example of a. That's the least I could do for God's sakes.

You know, I've been given a life. The very least I can do is look like that, that life means something and that it wasn't a a bad investment. You know, that it might be a decent human. So I want to express that gratitude. I want to express it and how I deal with people. I don't want to be rude and overbearing. And yet we were talking to break about a thing that I do that

it's like that in a way, and yet it's a little bit more proactive as I'm not a fan of just just open

random discussions. They give me a headache and I just, I just don't like it, you know, because it just it's not productive for me. And so sometimes I'll go into A to a group where that's what's the mode is. I've never left.

Nobody's going to run me out of AII, don't they might if they Uzi I might go, but I'm I'm not leaving, you know, I'm staying right here. So when I go in and sometimes I'll go in, my heart will sink a little bit

say oh God, no yo,

not getting into this post mortem stuffing, but but I don't leave. I sit there and

if, if, if they make the mistake of calling on me or just one of those round the table deals,

if it's on one of those things of demonizing something. When it gets to me, I act like I'm deaf, dumb and blind. Act like I haven't heard one word that's been said. And then I begin to share with what I want to share in a meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous.

And it won't be me too. It'll be what I want to do. I give you an example. I had a quest Epcot one day and I, I didn't want to do this guy, a meathead drunk, a bad drunk. I took him in the office and guarded him off the head, would let him go out unattended and kept him. And I was in the night in my hometown. I was in a different port. My office was and I was going to take him to a meeting that night

and I knew a group that had what was called a beginner's meeting.

Well, that's what else you going to do with a guy that you owe 12 stepping. Yeah, of course I'm going to take him that beginning to me. So we go in huge meeting. Huge. They had broke up into six groups and one of them was a beginners meeting. I said, well, that's for me and him

set the meeting and the beginners meeting

dumbfounded. Nobody ever said anything even reasonably rhyme with beginner. They started talking about so much Canary fell out or something and nothing. And I'm sitting here with a band. You drunk. I mean a bad case. Bad case. Good God.

Oh well I don't think about that. I've 12 step that dude 25 times. If I do it one more time, I'm going to choke him.

But but he's, he's a bad case. So I'm sitting there thinking, for God's sake, come on, man. Let's talk about sobriety. Let's talk about newcomers. Let's talk about one day at a time. Let's talk about the survival stuff, for God's sakes, You know, not refinement. And so

understanding and effective, you say, yeah, I'm sitting there thinking, I don't volunteer. You say, let me speak. I don't do that. And so I made an exception,

stuck my head up and and the gal lead to bed and said, yeah, Tom, What? And I started talking, drunk talking. They've been listening to me all day. I didn't want him to have to listen to me, but I'm not going to take him in. Some meeting with that rinky dink stuff had nothing to do with getting sober.

So that's what I started doing. And so I mean, that's the way I like to operate in a year that I'm not going to just sit there and be a complaining spectator, you know, somewhere other. I'm going to make a contribution if I can. And I'll tell you the remarkable thing that we were talking about at the break. I've been doing for many, many years that that thing with with, with going into a meeting.

And if it comes to me, I act like I haven't heard one thing

and I start talking about recovery.

Never rude, never chastising anybody, never complaining. What I do is is setting it. Oh, bless your heart.

He knows that I got robbed so many times in Detroit.

Yes, it was. It was almost an evil split with how many I rocked

they. But if you see what see what I'm talking about it, It's it's it's, it's, it's a matter of of of if you want to see it, do it. You know, don't try to make somebody else do it. If you want to see it, do it that way. You can't miss. And I swear to God

I have never done that and seen the meeting go back to what it was.

I'm not the only guy in there aggravated. Your people come looking for a solution, and I'm looking for just a bunch of stuff. Yeah. And so people want that. They want it badly. And the meeting never goes back.

There's another word for that's called leadership. We were talking about that the other day, you know, and somebody has to take the lead, you know, if you just sit back and watch you go down the tube, pay no attention. Yeah. And so that's just a simple little thing that to me, has to do with this thing. And so that's a way of shortness of gratitude. So that's the one thing I do is let me let me wear that gratitude and then use it. Let me share it to the best of my ability. That's the second thing. I want to be a good example

that somebody would be willing to follow or buddy up with or whatever, and not some doubt. It's just sort of a rude, crude dude that hard to put up with. I just don't want to do that. And so that's the second thing is how how I carry myself. If I and I live in a fairly small town, most people probably in that town, if they know me, they know I'm an A a, you know, the guy was going for tourists were going through one day stopped at a coffee shop and said, I know a guy in this town. Whoever's waiting on him said, who is it? Said his name,

my Australian. And the person who care said, yeah, I know him. And he said where you reckon I can find him? He said, well, it's Monday night, go over to the First Baptist Church. That's what happens is fall out of America. That probably wouldn't happen to Vancouver, but it sure happens there. And, and I'm glad it does. I've had them send them to my house. Yeah, pulled into McDonald's the other day. I'd have to get an emergency cup of coffee.

Went in there dark dark and I heard this voice in there

high top.

There's no anonymity in small town America that anyway. But I want to be a good example because they know me on my bad days too. I don't want to be that guy that's crabby and crushed in over 1/4 at a Kmart or something. I want to be somebody who looks like a decent human who would say I don't know much about it hey, but I know God is in it. Push you in touch with.

That's what I want to do.

So that's what I'm trying to do in the morning. I'm late. I'm laboring over that more than really needs. I think you see what I'm talking about. I'm trying to get into the right frame of mind so I can go out and have a useful, purposeful day so I can use my recovery to good advantage of is what I'm doing. And so those are just in sort of more internal things, you know, that I really understand what's wrong with me. I understand the illness. I understand what the gift. I understand what it's like to try to be a decent example.

And the third thing that that I that I ask for everyone did this morning,

what is to make me sensitive to opportunities to be of service,

not for opportunity of service. They are everywhere. You don't need to pray for that, but to make me sensitive to opportunities be of service. And my God, if you, if you say that prayer, you better mean it because I'll guarantee you you'll get flooded with more opportunities. You know what to do with. And that everybody you know that you know, I walked one day in front of a little stripping off thing that and there was a Husky looking woman with a little pickup truck. She had two barrels.

You making that face again? She she she had two barrels

and they look heavy and so I'm going by that. You got to make a quick decision. You want to buddy in or act like you don't see it, you know, and and so I I said, what the heck yes, I I started over enough this day and time people are suspicious about folks approaching and I started at her. She got into position. She she red take me off and I said those things look heavy. She said, my God, they are. I will let me help you with the thing. She looked at me dumbfounded. You know that

supposed to happen Yeah. And I so she did. She let me. I had do it by myself. She just retired and

counting on her,

but got to bear. We got the barrels on you. Well, that's no big deal, is it? That's not a cure for cancer.

But don't you know she had a better day?

How about me?

That's what it's about. It's about participating this thing called life and being a productive part so that I'm not in a blue funk all the time, that I'm really on top of my game, could do stuff and I, I could give you tons of examples of that. I'll just give you one more but but no, no extra charges is on the House.

I do you know, about how I do a lot of stuff on airplanes and

I won't tell one, I don't think, unless I just can't resist.

But they I got on one the other day and there was a little short woman. You don't have just a long ways up there to that thing. It's just a little girl. She couldn't have gotten up there with a ladder. I I mean, she got this bag and she tried to figure out what to do with it. So I went over to her and I said, give me the bag and she said no. And she turned away and I said, give me the bag and I just took it away properly. You know, I mean, I wasn't rough on brutal. I but I was insistent. So I said, give it a bag.

So I took the bag, put it up, and she said, I really appreciate that. I said, well, I'm happy to do it. She said, you're from the South, aren't you? And I said, well, I am. I said, why do you ask? She said, well, I'm from New York and we don't do that in New York. And I said, yes, you do. She said, no, we don't. Yes you do. The only difference is in New York, if you take the bag, they'll leave with it.

She she, she says, she said, she said, man, you right about that.

But you know, hey, that's up. That's just a freaky little thing. No big deal was to her,

it was to her he'd beat a him, him, hernia, whatever. But anyway, just simple little stuff. They being sensitive that and if I'm not sensitive to it, that's what I'm asking God to help me do is to be sensitive to see it. And if I'm not tuned in, I'll walk right past it, walk right past it, not even see it. And that line, I'm going to tell you one more.

A guy was it's not a biggie, but it was biggie to him. There was a guy

walking by like me that only works toward the gates at the airport, and I'm standing over by a wheelchair and this guy is really working, trying to walk. So I went over and I said stopped him. I said I got a wheelchair. It wasn't mine, but I said I got a wheelchair over here. I'd be glad to roll you down to the gate if you like. He said no, no, no, Sir. I appreciate you doing that. But I'm trying his therapy for me. I want to do this walking because

that's good. We appreciated me doing making the offer, So I do that because that's the kind of world I want to live in. I don't want to live in a world with pushing and shoving and being guardian and cautious about everything. You do nothing naive. I mean, by God, if you live in Detroit and Chicago and those kind of places, you don't get naive. You're aware of human nature and stuff like that.

It's so different between being stupid and being civil, inappropriate settings yard. It's right. That's what I'm going to do. And that's that's how I want to live my life, you know, so that I'm not only, but I'm of service. I don't have to wait till somebody called me

service God knows how many times a day. And, and so that's what I do with that thing. And so when I do my daily stuff, get my preparation, that's what I want to do is that I'm not asking God to tell me when to turn left and stuff like that. I'm not a spiritual puppet, you know, I want to get in tune with my higher power and, and, and so that my life flows instead of just a whole bunch of herky jerky stuff.

I put something else in there. So this doesn't count as a third one, but I'll tell you one more, one more

that

Peter heard me, heard me talk about that it really meant something to me. I was in the O'Hare in Chicago, one of the more grungy airports around. But it it's, but it serves a purpose. So I'm in, I'm in O'Hare and I'm going down to concourse headed trying to get to a plane and

all at once I realized I was grinning.

You don't grin at airports. I mean, man, they'll put a net on you if you grin an airport. Everybody's mad in airports. They don't have to be mad about anything. They're just mad. And so going to charge it down that thing and side wheels. I'm granted it embarrassed me. I said, Jesus, man, what am I doing? So I put on my game face and and and I got thinking about that.

Why on earth am I doing grinning in O'Hare airport?

And I thought about it and what I thought about was a guy. I know you've never heard him, but there was a guy named Michael Jordan that about from North Carolina. By the way,

he just bought some property 5 miles from my house. My property values may go up just a little

Go Michael, but

I thought about my I was thinking about how on earth am I grinning in some situation? I'm on the way to Fargo, ND

and it's February and it is cold in Fargo, ND and I'm on the way there and I'm thinking, for God's sake, yeah, what's wrong with a guy doing this? And then I thought about

why do it

there? Michael Jordan would and I'm sure you've seen it of these has been run a million times. He was in a game and he was just having one of those blind days, you know, where he could not miss. I mean, he could shoot for mid court blindfold didn't hit it. And so he went down and made some unreal, unreal kind of a dunk or whatever. And he's trotting back up the course and he goes past the opposing match. He turns to him and gives it that. Excuse me, excuse me, Tony, that Polish salute. You know it,

don't ask me, man. I don't know. I just got through the ball. You know, it's you gave it that shrug. And later on he described it as being in his own because he could not miss. I mean, everything was working and he called it a zone. And when it when he said that, that really identified why I was grinning that day. And and it was those three basic things I was talking about. I was exactly who I'm supposed to be.

No pretense,

no shell, no trying to impress. I'm exactly who I am. I'm where I'm supposed to be.

I'm on my way to Fargo, ND I told some people I would be there and that's exactly where I was headed. You and I was doing exactly what I'm supposed to be doing

and that's what for me, it produces that zone where it's not just some sort of a thing of getting going and trying to find spirit and all that stuff. It's about being tuned in. And so my whole deal when I'm sitting out with that pond is I want to get in tune with my higher power. And then I focus on those three things. But what comes out of that is the engine, the energy to, to, to engage in life in that kind of a way so that it really becomes

a life where we happy joys and free. And so

I've had millions and not millions, but many thousands of experiences along that line. And to me, that's what this whole business is about. It's, it's not about becoming a spiritual zombie. It's about becoming a useful servant. And, and, and, and good God, you know, the winner is me every single time winner is me. And so I see these, these this 10/11/12 is very clearly action steps, you know, not meditation steps and not, I mean, you got that built in. But it's not about

study in my naval and going through all this kind of stuff. It's about getting suited up to engage in life and let the spiritual be spiritual. I'd be the way I live and not just some study I do. And so anyway that that's that's what I do on a daily basis. And

there's nothing super about that. It's just my way of living the spiritual life. It's my way of letting this become a way of life and not just an activity I engage in. You know, it's the way I live. It's the way I do, you know, wherever I am. So so that is it works for me.

I would say we would be interactive, but anybody comment or anything you want want to say or advise or whatever,

Yeah, Tony,

absolutely. Polish salutis

me, mate.

Yeah, thank you.

Yeah, yeah. I've been in some step studies where the leader facility slash facilitator has said that we don't use the word prayer, meditation kind of interchangeably the way he describes the steps with using different words. I've been in some step studies where they say that you need to get a sheet of paper, write down the thoughts that come to you and if there is selfish, dishonest, self seeking, we're frightened then and not from God. I've been in some studies where they say you do

a quiet thing where you try to quieten the voices inside you and the other one says listen to the voices inside.

Is it kind of an individual thing, this,

you know, the book says water rising when we retire at night, and that's good stuff. The Bill Wilson used the word meditation in 1940s the way we do today.

Yeah. Well, you know, we got a couple million members. We've got a couple million ways of doing it. You know what they do? We're free to do what fits us. If we don't have conformity or this kind of stuff, Yes. It's a matter of finding what works in my life, you know, how does this work for me? And now I'm a, I'm an activist type of guy. I'm not a, I'm not AI mean. I'm not a dummy, but I'm not a deep thinker. I don't spend my time in analysis and all this stuff.

The what I want to do is get into action.

Like when I do, I don't do studies, I don't do study. We do that weekly in my group. We do discussions and that's what we do basically go through the book in, in that, in that particular group. When I take people through the book, it's action, It's action. And what we're trying to do is make those that that programmer, which is what our book is. This is the story of recovery. And what we want to do is make that book my book. We want to make that be my program of recovery. So that's what our

is. And, and so I don't get into the nuances of this participle versus that noun and that kind of stuff. You know, I, I like to get into the action mode, you know, that's my approach to it. And so when I take people through the book, what we're looking in looking for is members. We're looking for real strong members. And rather than just refining their vocabulary, we want them to be strong members when they come out. You know, my Home group,

by the way, it was a product of a big book workshop. And

but the one I referred to a little earlier where this, this gal came in and I didn't like and it went through and had 15 people and, and they started bugging me about starting a group and I was the founder of the group I was in. And and so they've they've said they're going to start. I said, well, go ahead, you guys are ready. Just go, go, go for it. You can do it. And so I don't know, we want you to come with us. I can't desert the ship, man. I'm driving and so

come on, it's and so I thought about it and my, my, my then Home group was well established. It had found its niche. It was a real good group and it served a real purpose of what we we set out to do with that group.

And I realized that it was not going to make any difference if I left. We were by then we were several years old, no good numbering years old. And so I just. I dropped a rumor, didn't make it. Now, you don't announce something like that. I just dropped a rumor that I might be helping start a new group if I didn't want to just look around one day. Where's Tom? Yeah, well, he's left. He's deserted ship. So I just started a rumor and I didn't dispute it. And so we started with,

now I'll tell you. And that's what I'm talking about when I say to make it

the way we live, you know, not just the way we think, but the way we live. When we started that good, I told the guys, I said, I, I will, I will join in and help start a group. If you really want a group, if you want a meeting, count me out. So if you want a group where you're really purposeful in doing something and, and about carrying out the program, count me in. And they wanted a group. And then they said what we want is action. You know, we don't want a lot of conversation. We want action because when you get through

workshop, you're pumped and a lot of time you're pumped and don't have an adequate vehicle. Now, if you get pumped and they don't have a group that's supportive or in tune with that, you feel like you're from another planet, you know? So they said they wanted actually, all right, By golly, we did. We did a did a little thing. I guess it's just a way of putting legs on some of this thing. What does it mean in real life?

The we didn't, we didn't have a meeting

we pull together. We had 10 people who really wanted to help develop that group, 10 people we met in the back of a guy's business. It was not an A a meeting. It was a planning session by a, a members. And so we did the first meeting we did a, I'm a, I'm a brainstorming guy. I really like quit thinking. What I found is that my first thought is the best it ever gets.

When I think about it, I screw it up. But my first thought is what I really believe. And so I like brainstorming. You know where you don't discuss that, you just put it on the wall

and it stays there unless you deliberately make decision, take it down. So in, in 12 minutes, in 12 minutes where the brainstorming session, the question was, if we do a group, what is a component or something that you would insist on having as a part of that group? A lot of times you just get a coffee pot and go and let's see what happens. Well, that's kind of a weak, weak method, I think. And so we said, what are those things we got through? We had 19 qualities

in 12 minutes and they were saying we'd get here, you know what we wanted that group to be. And I added, I arbitrarily added a 20th when I put in Rule 62 and, and it's a good thing and we practice that rule 62. But that told us what we're looking for. So designing the group was a no brainer. We know what people are looking for. So how do you do that? And so we put together the components that would deliver.

That's why we started out day one with every service committee that exists in a A1 minute day that the more than one minute, but won't be much more. I don't want to lie on Sunday

they they but but before we ever started, you know, we had 10 positions and committees already lined up.

It just so happened another one of those sort of spontaneous things happen. We had 10 people, 10 positions. And so now I was thinking ahead just a little bit. We had to tend things lined up and somebody said we're in the world. We going to get people for all those, all those service things. I said, well, they tell you, but it's already completed. We got ten of them, ten of us. Pick one.

So we were, we were organized as a as a group, functional group before we ever met. And and so, you know, then it was just, it was really a no brainer. You know what, once you get what you're looking for, what do you do it put it together.

And so we went to work and that's, that's 14 years ago. And, and it's, it's turned into a powerful group. It's a very, very strong service oriented group. It put the legacies are in place. Absolutely. And and so that, that's what I mean about an action thing. It's not just getting jazzed up about something. It's, it's about putting it into motion, you know, really making it come alive. And

so I know they just after we met for two or three weeks, the guy that was the chairman of the newcomers committee,

she's a nice guy. He's a very slow, I mean he's a Mitt Sharp guy. He's a high tech computer guy. Just kind of burned his cells a little. So he slowed and he came to what did? He said,

we ain't got no newcomers. And I said, yeah, you know, I noticed that. And he said, well, what do you think we ought to do about it? I said, well, I said, I'll tell you what, let's start a newcomer meeting. And he said, didn't you hear what I said?

We've got no new covers? I said. I said, yeah, I heard that, but let's start a newcomers group. He said, well, that's the dumbest thing ever. I said, well, do it anyway. Just humor me a little bit. Well, if you put newcomer on the door, you better be prepared

because I guarantee you everybody that's got alcohol is captured anywhere. That is like saying Mecca is right over here, you know. And so the first night we had that new cover group that overwhelmed you went over 20 people the first time we met. And, and so you just went from there. But to me that you have that. That's that's why I like to, to get into a real action mode with this kind of thing. You know, if not, I like to I like a workshop

over a study. You know, that study is ongoing. You obviously study for rest of my life, but I like a workshop because it puts legs on it and it gets me into motion if it gets me moving on stuff. And so that by the way that that I mentioned the other day that the that that newcomer thing has been a marvelous thing. We've had only one single to purpose problem in 14 years, because automatically

most of the people who come in with confusion about what they are and this kind of thing

are new in the program. And so the natural thing is they're going to the newcomer program. They're prepared to help work that through if they have a different kind of a problem to help them find that floodplain service. It works out just great. You know, that's that's a long filibuster on that. Yeah,

what? And then Dave, you got right here.

I've been putting as spiritual tools. I know a couple of them, like when I'm, you know, upset with someone, pray for them. I say, God, this is a sick person. See me for the enemy that will be done. What are the other spiritual tools that like maybe I'm overlooked in the book

or, you know, use

yes, for this spiritual tools in the book that you program.

Well, it's what our program is is spiritual too. You know that you have in in that preface to the 12 and 12. It's got a little blurb in there. That thing really says it. Well, you know, I I stepped for a group of principals, spiritual in their nature, which is practiced as a way of life will expel the obsession to drink and enable the sufferer to become usefully whole. And to me that's that's enough. You know what, what tells me exactly what the steps are and we got tons of spiritual principles,

but I like to keep focus on the steps. You know that if I if I take practice those steps as a way of life, you know, it will help me deal with all the Vista huge of life. You know that. So I don't I don't need to carry around a lot of those things. I mean, God knows we got enough slogans that we can cover the wall with them and and things that put it in succinctly deals. But but I I really like to use the steps if I have a specific things like we talked about last night. That tradition is extremely useful to me in terms of how we deal with

because most of the time the things that come up like you're talking about, they have to do with relationships. And you have what we're trying to do is build relationship with us and the world around us. And so I like to use those straight line tools like that. You know that that my my method as well, like I have limited capacity in my mind. Have to be careful, David.

We talked about Rules 62 and the question is when, when is it appropriate time to use

the so-called Rule 62 and and when is it an inappropriate time? Do you love to quote that particular rule? And what was the purpose behind a real intent behind Rule 62?

We're not a glum lot. It says somewhere, but we can get awfully morbid sometimes if you're doing it. So yeah, Yeah. I, I think it's important to, to, to, to enjoy life, you know, to enjoy life. And so and I'll, I'll inject a little humor in something because it just sort of makes stuff flow better, you know, and it makes it a lot more pleasant. Yeah. If you just get into some trim kind of hard driving lecture, stuff like that, it, it'll wear you down. Yeah. And so there's just times in a, in a, in a meeting where.

Just a little offhand remark can just break attention, you know, like in a business meeting, something like that. There's some little thing, but that that's all it is. Just don't take yourself too seriously. That's that's what the rule says. I don't want to get all caught up in the fact that every move I make is going to be cataclysmic for the Earth. You know, it's it's not only take what's happening. I want to enjoy life. Come on in. I'm serious. Is a heart attack,

but I hide it fairly well, you know? And yeah, follow up to that

than what you're saying is the rule 62 is, is not an official. It has no bearing in the it's just something to throw out as a as a way to play attention. Yeah, yeah, that's that's it. Yeah. If you get too serious about you screw it up, you know, And so you got, you got to got to relax and be natural, you know, and if you get into that, you'd like somebody to do it. Talk to somebody one time. There's a movie person that neither telling me that