Workshop called

Workshop called

▶️ Play 🗣️ Gary B. ⏱️ 1h 19m 📅 01 Jan 1970
6:00 and 7:00 and
as of right now, I don't have anything else to offer on that, so I'm going to add it off to you. Thank you,
because I've stolen this stuff
in back. Chris
thought about the ideal at the end of the inventory. How do you kind of arrive at that? How you doing the sex inventory?
The second all right,
the book talks about establishing an ideal
in your sex conduct.
And you know, the first time I saw somebody trying to write an ideal was this guy that I said, So what does your ideal look like? And he said, oh, about 5 foot two and blonde and,
and I said, I think you missed the point.
At least for us, the sexual ideal has to do with what we're bringing to the to the party.
And that means what am I willing to do in a relationship to make it work?
And so my ideal has to do with
putting someone elses welfare above my own. It has to be to do with being open
and communicating
in kind
and trying to really do something to add something positive to to the other person's life on a regular basis.
I suppose it's a lot like that little short prayer in the book which says, How can I serve the
Yeah, thy will not mind be done. Not always.
My ideal really has to do with
how am I going to act and what am I bringing to a relationship.
And in trying to define that is, is a good exercise because you have to go back and look at it periodically. And if you to see if you're doing what you said you were going to do,
umm, my ideal doesn't change much or hasn't for probably the last 10 years.
And
the last relationship I was in, I was trying to practice, which is a couple of years ago. I was trying to practice the principles that I had
chosen
and I think it was the neatest relationship I've ever been in my life. And it the only reason why it stopped was because there was a compelling reason in the middle of it where she needed to do some other things. And one of which was they have children and I'm too old. I just, I don't want to have children at this age. I think it's unfair.
And I had to tell a lady that I was just
wildly in love with that the best thing for her was to go find someone who was willing to have children with her and then go on about her life. And it absolutely killed me.
But it was the best thing for her. So
you know it,
you're going to establish some principles, some rules for the road in your life. And then the next question is, do you have the courage to live that way?
Do you have to? Are you, are you willing to make decisions which may not be in your own best self-interest, but they may be in their interest,
and are you willing to live like that and then and then not sit around and bitch about it for the rest of your life?
So you know what? I spent a lot, a lot of time thanking God that that woman was in my life for as long as she was.
And I'm not angry because she's not in my life any longer. I'm grateful that I had the time to spend with her that I did. So part of that coming to that kind of understanding
was
writing out a sexual ideal.
The book makes an interesting statement about our sexual conduct. And that is, if it continues to help other or to harm others, we're sure to drink. Listen to that. That's not a lie.
If,
if your sexual conduct
is harming someone
and you decide to ignore it and continue
that kind of behavior, don't be surprised if you got a bottle in your hand one of these days.
And I've seen that happen over and over again. And you know, some people go, well, hell, I can get away with it. Well, that's just like getting away with it with alcohol. There's no such thing. At some point, all that stuff comes home to roost. And so you may want to consider that now. So we're going to talk about 6:00 and 7:00 just a minute.
I came about that from the other end, if you will, that that I,
I had come to see how much harm I had caused with my infidelity and, and chasing after my feelings and that sort of thing. And
when I finished
the 5th step with those guys up in Chicago and I've done those things and that I had to do something about my sexual ideal and that sort of thing, I looked at the book and looked at that and all I could really see was a harm I was causing until I began to try to write down the ideal. But the lie in there was that I wasn't like the rest of those other Alcoholics and I could get away with that and not drink
and probably not a week going by.
From what I see, an alcoholic man go out and fall in heat with some gal and watch the process. They move out of the safe place they're living and then they decide to move in with her.
Was that line I heard the other day? What? What do 2 Alcoholics do on their second date? Rent A U-Haul? Yeah, that's.
And so
the discarding of that line was one thing, but establishing
the ideal was really something else. And
and that I had to come down to that. And so much of my amends to my wife were wrapped around that ideal,
and they really were. So I don't do anything with another woman that I wouldn't do right in front of her.
We had a wonderful woman in Indianapolis named Melinda. And some of you knew her and she and she carried the messages better than anybody I've ever seen it. At times, I think in fact, we would go through Coed workshops together and she would embarrass me because she, she would catch me with my fears. And so she, she'd rub them in, make them real apparent to me if she only did it once for fear. But
it's a great help to me with that.
But one time we ran in each other at a restaurant
and without thinking or anything else, we gave each other a full kiss on the lips. I mean, it was just impulsive. It was just right now. And it seemed like the both of us to be the thing to do. And I didn't think anything about it. Of course, you know, other than that. Damn, that was nice. But
Linda called later that afternoon and said the same thing to me. And so I told her. I said, well, I think we're all right, Lynn, as long as we don't do anything we wouldn't do right in front of Julie, she said. We better not do that again.
And and we didn't but and it wasn't. I mean, that best is what it was, but
with that, so, so much of my ideal had to do with me being what I signed up to be 50 years ago when we got married. And I literally hadn't done it in my Mary Charlotte at all up until 20 some years ago. And I was 24 again.
Not that that's a big deal, but it, it changed my life and it changed it dramatically. That doesn't mean we still don't have discussions around that and how I can be forgetful and how I can be crude and
and all of that, but that's part of me staying within the ideal.
I just thought I'd throw that in there. I
mine came as a result of becoming aware of all the harm, all the pain I'd caused not just to her but other families and and everybody else.
Let me say something quickly about shooting baby ducks.
Do you know what that is? I dare you to say it. It's screwing a newcomer,
so
there's a misconception there. We had a lady that joined our Home group
that was a former runner up for Miss Whatever some state, and she was
very, very attractive woman. And when she came walking in the door newly sober
and there was a guy in our group with about 15 years of sobriety that immediately thought that was easy pickings and that he was going to go give her right on his motorcycle
and and she went along with it. And not too many days later, they were off together and
and I went to this guy in my Home group and I said, you see what's going on there? And he said, yeah. And I said, now what do you think's going to happen? And he said he's taken advantage of her and that she's going to, she's going to suffer from the the consequences of that. And I said, you got it backwards.
That guy is going to go out and she is about 3 grades above anything he's ever had in his whole life.
And one of these days she's going to turn around, look at him and say, well, that was fun and good luck.
Can see people who just come through the door of Alcoholics Anonymous aren't looking for a relationship. They may be in lust, but they're not in love.
In about three months later, she turned around one day and said that was a lot of fun. So, you know, let's be friends and I'll see you
and it above killed him.
And so
this is not a right the right thing to say it in a a group. You know that looking for a partner in Alcoholics Anonymous is like shopping in the Denton Can aisle.
That's right.
What the hell would ever possess you to go looking for someone who obviously has some level of insanity?
That doesn't mean you aren't, and it doesn't mean you shouldn't. It just means that the odds aren't that much in your favor.
And if you go to someone that's new and Alcoholics Anonymous and think you're going to be in a relationship, you're not, you're going to be in a hostage situation.
So,
you know, there are some people who get together and Alcoholics Anonymous and it'll last forever and they really love each other. And there are, there are legions of examples of that around. But the real truth is, if you're looking for a partner, come on,
why are you doing it here?
The answer to that, by the way, is this where we spend most of our time
I so
I'll just put another twist on that. You've got two totally self-centered people thinking the other one's going to fix them.
It's it's crazy.
Is that what you want to?
I have another question kind of since we're bringing up the
seating stuff
issues not worded as flaring. What we need to talk about
outside. Don't like therapy
that work with moldings of healthier relationship to yourself within a lot of stuff out there. Do you guys have any experience with that as far as integrating with the work you're doing? I'm in that business.
You should never ask me about therapy because I
do. You know, I used to train the parole officers in the state about how to communicate. And so I trained all these parole officers and and the woman who runs the parole division in Colorado came out to me and she said, what do you think about getting involved with therapy? Because we need a good provider and we really like doing business with it. And I said, well, I don't believe in it
for myself.
I, they, you send me to psychiatrists when I was a kid and, and I showed up at my psychiatrist's office one day and I said, oh, I haven't, I have an appointment with doctor so and so. And the nurse looked at me and she said, oh, didn't you hear? And I said no. And she said he committed suicide this week. And I went,
all right, something's wrong here,
you know, of my psychiatrist is committing suicide. I wonder what the hell is going on. I, I think that there are people who truly benefit from therapy.
Umm, and I'm one of the largest providers of therapy. My company is in psychiatric care in Colorado for the Department of Corrections and
and I think a lot of that, at least from personal observation, because I'm no therapist,
is the intent of the therapist. And if if they have a good heart, I think it has a tendency to heal people who are looking for a solution. And some of them are well versed in whatever,
whatever kinds of therapy they're supposed to be doing. But
you know, if you have a like a real mental illness,
and I deal with people like that every day,
the people who are bipolar or schizophrenic or someone with a real mental illness, that
there are real things to do about that.
Which brings up the idea of medication.
So as long as we're talking about everything else,
fucking rape,
there are people with real problems that need real medications. And if you're going to stand there and tell them not to take medications, you got your head up your ass.
You know, unless you're an MD,
leave your opinion out of the God damn meeting, OK? And so
there there are also.
There are also
millions of people in this country who don't like to feel bad.
Not even occasionally,
you know, people go well, I'm depressed. Really, How long?
And you know, if you get, if you're always depressed, you ought to go see a doctor about it.
If you got depressed this week because your job didn't go right, live with it,
all right? I I am even in the business, even being this sober this long, am occasionally depressed, seriously depressed.
Do I go get medication for it? No. What did people do 50 years ago?
Nothing.
They had nothing to do, so they just felt depressed. You know, I have psychiatrists that are working for me and they go, you seem depressed and I go, I am. That's very observant of you.
And they say, well, I can give you something for that. I go, no, you can't.
Yeah, you know what? It's part of life,
so so you do what you want to do, but I want to see life as it is and I want to get as close to reality as I can get. And I want to get as close to the truth as I can get. And so I don't engage in it. You have a right to do anything you want to do, but don't take yourself out of reality just because you don't like it.
So what's the truth? The truth is, some people ought to be Medicaid,
some people shouldn't. And there are both kinds of people that we're going to run across in Alcoholics Anonymous.
So
if you see someone who is continually, profoundly depressed, it's not the worst thing in the world for them to hear from you that they ought to seek medical help. I've told people that I sponsor to go find medical help.
And are there other people who are
just such profound weenies
that they can't stand a little pain?
Yeah. There you go, pussy flipping around. Yeah,
just be a little judicious how you use medication.
I watch people who are on medication all the time. Some of them work and some of them don't
and some of them do just exactly the opposite of what they're supposed to do in people like us have had serious suicide rates on things like Prozac and Wellbutrin. So often some of those things that that doctors who work for me regularly prescribe, but they, they
just
just understand that that that feeling bad or feeling depressed is part of life.
And just statistically, at any given moment,
1/3 of the industrialized world is clinically depressed.
So, you know, it's not something that just came out of the blue and you're the only one that had ever happened to.
So please understand that some put some things are part of life and that we don't have to get stupid through too much medication
to survive it. Sometimes it's just get through it.
That's an opinion which means you can throw it right out the window.
Should have never got off.
Step six. One more
I really like the comments about the ego.
Ego and self esteem.
I I don't know the answer to that. I think
he was asking if there any any distinction between the terms egocentric that Bill uses in the big book and self esteem.
That's primarily the ones you mentioned in it. Those are the two two terms you mentioned. Number of years ago I was taking a young man through the through the book and he was reading
and the line that reads in that where Bill says egocentric, as they like to count call it nowadays, this kids reading along and he go he bumps right to it and he says codependent, as they like to call it nowadays. And hell, he'd gotten two more sentence passed it before I heard what I said. I said just a minute. The hell do you say he said that? He grinned. He said I said codependent and I looked at that and he says doesn't that mean the same thing?
And
apparently it's pretty close
and I don't see that at all as part of self esteem. Egocentric. I think it could be self seeking. We're being led around just to feed our ego. But I.
Don't get too caught up in a single term in the book. It's really not work. But most of us have now have found out that if we're talking about something that's selfish, we're talking about something that's mine and you can't have. And if I'm talking about self seeking, it mean it's something that yours and I want it. I'm fixing to get it
with that, but don't spend too much time on that because we got enough head games with that without
step 6.
Go ahead. You got a better story. OK,
that. So we come out of the inventory, we come out of the 5th step and then
wow,
then were directed to go home
and take the book down from the shelf
and review the 1st 5 proposals. See if we've made mortar without sand.
And then in the sixth step, we're asked to become willing to be rid of all of those things which kept us from the sunlighted spirit.
And are we willing?
I had mentioned to you before that there are two places in the Big Book where I throw myself at God's feet without reservation.
And here's the other one. The other, actually the other ones is 7th step. But I have to find the willingness in the sixth step to throw myself at God's feet again and without reservation. And that means that that I'm willing to accept anything that God has in mind. And so
when it describes the 7th step, it talks about I'm now willing that you have all of me, good and bad. But my problem is that I don't know which is good and which is bad.
And it says in that prayer, and I don't want to get that far ahead of myself, but it says that I now ask God to remove every single defective character which stands in the way of my usefulness to you. And my fellows you will. You might have noticed at some point during this thing that I'm very opinionated.
I'm also very candid
and and that means that I'm going to tell you the truth if I think you ought to hear it.
I always thought being in that aggressive was a character defect.
You know, the, I, I mentioned last night at that meeting that my, that I was working with inmates and that my ex-wife said I'd finally found a job that suited my personality. And,
and I always thought, see, I was a bill collector in Chicago. I just, you know, I used to kick in people's doors and put them up against the wall and scare the, the junior out of it
and, and just be almost sociopathic. In fact, probably sociopathic in the way I I went about it, which was why I was so good at what I did.
And
and I always thought being that almost that angry and aggressive
was a terrible part of my personality. And I have been asking God for more than 36 years
to that I am now ready that He takes all me, good and bad, and remove every single defected character which stands in the way of my usefulness to Him. And in my fellows,
you know, and I have said that with with real willingness to be rid of anything that he would take away.
He's never done that.
And some people will say it's because you don't want to get rid of it.
OK, I want to get rid of it if God wants to take it, but I have to be willing to lose any part of my personality, any part.
And, and one of the biggest
challenges in being willing to get rid of those things is that's the way we defend ourselves.
The reason why I'm, why I am so direct
is because I've always defended myself that way. Then people will be afraid of me and they won't challenge me and all the rest of that. See, so, so those things that and a lot of things that I am today are things that I have defended myself with for years.
And am I willing to drop the defense?
One of the first things I said to you was stop defending yourself.
If you're living a spiritual life, what the hell are you defending?
I don't have to defend myself. You don't like me? You write inventory. But
I'm going to go to bed tonight and sleep like a baby.
So finding the willingness
to lower my defenses,
to stop defending myself
is a pretty scary proposition.
And all of those things that I've developed for all of those years to protect myself from you,
am I willing to drop the whole deal and to be vulnerable?
Are you?
Are you willing to drop your defenses? That's what the 6th step is about.
Am I? Am I willing to be anything that God chooses? Again, just like the third step, So,
so,
so I have asked God for years, for as long as I've been doing it to take away what he doesn't think works. And I'm still, and I'm, you know, I'm still direct and I'm still aggressive and I, and what I suppose one of the big reasons is because of the population that I work with,
because I, I don't know whether I'm
too oblivious or too stupid to be afraid,
but I'm just not afraid.
And you know, they, they, they locked me in a room full of inmates
and or lock me in a room with a serial killer. I don't care. I just, I refuse to be afraid in any way. The book says that I can go to the most sordid places in the world,
and I can.
I went into one of the dingy as bars in Denver and pulled a Hells Angel out of it
and and I walked in there. This was I don't know whether Gary Everett met this guy was named by Iron Mike was a Hells Angel and he had been on top of a three story building having his way with some young lady and they got throws a passion and he rolled off the roof.
And when he broke his leg, he really broke his leg
and he was having trouble getting it to heal in any way. He went into a bar down on 17th St. in Denver and got his nose full of cocaine and and got drunk and
called me and asked me to come and get him. And I went down there and got him, and by the time I got there, he changed his mind
and he said I'm not going anywhere. And I said, like hell you're not. If I came all the way down here, you by God are going somewhere
and he said you can't Get Me Out of here. And I said look, you either start heading for the door in the next 3 seconds or I'm going to kick you in that leg you broke and I'm going to break it again and then I'm going to drag your ass out of this bar. Now you got a choice.
So he said OK,
and we went over to York Street and had a cup of coffee.
And I don't know whatever happened to him, but the point of that whole thing is you don't have to be afraid.
Where's their Samoan buddy? I was telling him last night. Yeah, wake him up. Hey, Kimo, wake up.
I was telling him last night,
yeah, I was telling him last night that in Denver,
people
say you better get your shit together, you're gonna wind up with Bob Olsen as a sponsor. And you know what? It's because I'm not afraid. And you don't have to be afraid, OK? This stuff either works or doesn't
if you're willing. If you're willing to just drop everything and stop being afraid and stop defending yourself,
life works a lot better.
One of the biggest challenges in life is, is not spending all of it in fear.
So
so is at least as it relates to the 6th step to stay on that it has to do with am I willing to drop my defenses? Am I willing to stop defending myself? Am I willing to get rid of all of those things that I have protected myself with for all of these years and to finally turn to God and say you're the one that needs to protect me. OK. So thanks,
I think
Dolphin is not. Anytime I've written some inventory time I got to the 6th step and took a good look at it. I've been dealing with things I was really sick of
and ashamed of and the idea that that maybe there was a way that that God could take him. It was
really good news. And that's happened most of time. But there are times when I went ahead and thought already and said the 7th step prayer. And then I went through some periods of behavior that would have said that I probably didn't want those defects to leave and behave that. And I don't know if you remember this, but
I'll give you a couple of because I had taken this, the 7th step we've done. We've gone to the 7th step together
and
you know, I figure I'm on a spiritual plane at about right here and and no trouble and two things happen to to kind of let me know that maybe I have more to do. And you remember back then, the Denver Broncos had a sorry quarterback name of Steve Tense. And I'm watching the game one day and he fumble and I kicked Julie's antique fruit wood
coffee table
and it broke into several pieces.
And
I pick them all up before anybody sees me
and, and I run out behind the house and I got my tools back in there and all that. And I'm trying to glue this thing back together. And the girls came by and say, how, how'd the table break? Dad, what happened to the table?
I don't know what I told him I'm sure wasn't the truth, but it might have been.
But so much of my life had been one of these violent outbursts. Boom. And
quarterback dropped the ball and I kick a table and break it to pieces. And it might have been the same week I'm out in the backyard
cutting the grass and I'm on. This really dates me, Bob. This is before microwaves,
and I remember I'm hungry, and I remember there was a brand new package of Bologna in the refrigerator.
And so I go looking for it and it's frozen in the freezer.
And so I threw it, and I threw it hard enough that it buried itself in the sheetrock on the wall,
stayed right there.
And
there was one other event when things didn't go my way and it might have been the same week and I tore the closet door off.
And if you need that explained to you, we'll do it later. But
that was my first experience after having done step 6:00 and 7:00,
and to this day I don't know what I'd have done differently.
I really did want those defects to be taken away, and maybe that was me being exposed to them. To see how it ain't that is that I stopped doing them. I don't know that, but surely there's a better way. Man,
I broke a lot of stuff that needed fixing and
but that was kind of my experience with it. Just a little bit of different thing. I said the prayer and
as far as I know when I said it, I was as honest as I could be about wanting to be free
of all those defenses that I've had. But boy, they sure showed themselves as it was my experience.
Those guys in Chicago that I talk about will end each each very often. Some of them will just have a conversation on the phone and they'll often end end their conversation saying the 7th step prayer together
over the phone. And the first few times I did it I hadn't had it memorized yet. I felt kind of stupid but
and that that happened again when I swapped fist fest with Laramie with Larry the guy in Douglas, WY. We decided we couldn't leave till we we said the 7th step prayer again right then and there and we did it together and.
So now maybe I'll ask him if any of them are gone yet.
When I had
you get more to say about seven, only one of the things that my sponsor used to tell me, when I would tell him,
I'd say what
I'd say something and he'd he'd look at me and he would say, how the hell would you know?
The first time he said it,
I was offended because I thought I was smarter than he was.
And, you know, somebody looks at me and says, how the hell would you know? It sounds like I'm smart and you're stupid, at least to me.
And I would, you know, I, I'd call him up in tents that something say my, my employer is really angry with me. And he'd go, how the hell would you know,
and go, well, that's what it looks like. And it goes oil. That may be what it looks like, but things are rarely what they seem to be.
And he asked me that question over and over and over again,
and it was one of the best things he ever did for me because it made me question everything. I think
in the real truth about this world is that things are rarely what they seem to be. And in my inclination is to take a piece of information, take it to the worst possible conclusion, and then start living there.
And I'd go, everything's going to hell in a hand basket. And he'd go, how the hell would you know?
And he was right. You know, most of the time when I think thought things were awful, they weren't. So I can walk around making my day miserable thing and being completely wrong about anything.
And one of the things that happens even after you've been sober for a long time is that we suffer from faulty perception.
And so for most of the time, I don't think that we know what the truth is.
So anyway,
after I had
gone up to Chicago and taken fifth steps with those nine guys,
I was instructed go to this restaurant over in LaGrange and had lunch with some of them before I go back to Indianapolis. And I thought it was all over and, and I was tired and, and I had learned a lot and felt a little beat up on.
And we went over there and
had lunch. And after lunch, one of them said, Gary, get your pad and your pencil out. We'll help you with your immense list. And like I said, they had remarkable memories and
and so we did. And so I went down and I listed the amends that we talked about in the inventory. And then Paul asked, how about those amend you owe that you didn't have any resentments at?
And so we listed more out on inventory because a whole lot of money. I've been lying about money and everything else all along with that. And we come up with the immense list and the guys that are three and four years sober and, and one of them that was, that was at that time in his 30s, I guess,
uh, said, how the hell have you stayed sober this long
doing it? And they really believe they were asking a very serious question because that was their experience and they didn't believe you could stay sober doing the way I did. And they're right. I don't know why I did, but but
we went through that list and it became real clear to me. It's just sitting right there with that, that
this is probably my only shot and making this deal
and I don't know why why was so different at that time other than I didn't want to hurt anybody else.
And so took that list and most of the amends on that list at that point in time were financial.
I had lied and cheated my way through life about finances up until that point just completely, I, I had borrowed money. Well, that's what I said it was. I'm borrowing the money to pay you back. And then of course, I never paid you back. And it was,
it was huge. It was just a amount of money. I couldn't conceive me ever being incapable of making enough money to pay him back. I couldn't do it. But I knew the time was as we had to sit down and try it and one of the guys gave me some coaching on how how to set that up
with that. But I, I
I will still make it. I'd still do anything they told me.
Being willing is one thing and
I don't matter. We were. I was listening to Mike
the Sinus one time at this point and he says, you know, that willingness has a sound, you know,
and that's the sound. There can be a doorbell ring. It's not an e-mail, and it may not be a letter probably, but you need to be talking to anyway.
I went together and I went home and I put together a list
on an 18 column column or pad where I lifted everybody I could think of that owed the money to.
And then you went down the pad and see. And then you get a payday and you went out as far as you could make that payday stretch. And then you get another payday and you stretch that one out until it's fresh. And then
at before the end of the day, on payday, you were broke again and you had enough money for gas and groceries to get you through to the next payday. And
that went on for a long time. But that was probably
the only physical evidence I'd ever had about my immense that I was willing to do anything,
because I hadn't been willing to do any of that.
I had. I had made as soon as I couldn't regard, made all the amends I could
that didn't involve money
up until that point. There's one out there that's still out there and
don't know where. Tried quit
definer and that but I can't do it I guess and
so I'm just down to the financial amends and I literally got a list of them going across and many of them were family but not me. I don't have a big family, but my parents and Julie parents and and Julie brother and we were talking about Dick last night owed Dick money and
and all these businesses that were out there and and these debts went back before sobriety and after sobriety. Just because I quit drinking didn't
seem to be necessary to stop lying and cheating.
But
that's what I've done,
and that was my first
real physical vision of the harm I'd caused when I could list them right there in front of me.
Many of them were people that needed the money
that went through that and so I went through that for years and that was a big part of my immense list because most of them were financial
and I was held accountable by Paul.
Seemed like about it was about every Friday and you'd ask me who did you pay this time? I don't know how he remembered them all to this day. Brightest guy ever saw.
Somebody said to me one time, I hope I'm as sharp as Paul is when I get that old and I said, shit, I wish I was that sharp right now.
From that point on, the day finally came what was clear to me. I didn't see an answer other than continually going through that process for the rest of our life,
and I guess I should have thrown into the lottery for a boat, but
I found a different one, found a better one. I
went downstairs one one night after trying to do that and discourage broke again. I'd had a paycheck 3 hours before that. Here we are back in the same boat again and
really feeling sorry, Mark, for myself. And I told Julie, I said, you know,
I don't think I can live long enough or ever make enough money to pay all these bills. I just don't see it happen. I don't have any idea how to do it. And and I sat down the chair and tried to pout and she ignored me. And then
the next morning she said she had an idea.
If you got one of those wives and they say have an idea, watch yourself
if you don't know what's going to happen. But her idea was that we had been living in that house for longer than we lived anywhere, and we had equity in the home. I'd had the same job for longer than I'd ever worked anywhere.
What if that's still true?
He nodded. You think it is
and I had, I had 401K in the retirement and all of that and she said, you know Gary, we have all that. Then you have that it appears that that we could maybe sell a house, cash in the four O 1K and all the retirement
and pay off all the amends and a little bit of current debt we have and by
a used trailer house.
That sounds more dramatic than mobile home
trailer house. And, and I thought, oh, she can't be serious and got it. She can't be. And I knew she was. And so I, I, I ran out to go to work. That's what I did to get away from it. And, and
so when I got back that night, I told her, I said, let's call Paul and tell him about your idea and see what he says. And I'm sure he's got a way out of that.
So I call him and I said, now you've listened to some of my stuff for a long time. I said, we have an idea here that maybe we could cash in all the retirement and sell the house and take the proceeds and pay off all the Amanda some current debt. And then there'd be enough left to buy a used trailer house to live in. Said how crazy does that sound? And his answer was, he said that was the same as saying he heard me say in 20 years.
And he said, was it your idea?
And
and I said no, it was Julie's. And he said he thought so
often said that he was Julie's biggest fan. I think that
and so did to go on it. The day came where we did sell a house and all those amends did get paid and, and, and we, we did, we found
trailer and we move into and
the truth of that was, is that's pretty nice living. It's pretty easy. And on our part of the country they call it winterizing your house. That's when you're caulking windows and putting plastic over them or whatever it is to keep it out and keep your pipes from freezing and all of that. Those trailers you, you crawl under, it may be that far and you take this big long extension cord that they call heat tape and you plug it in.
It's winterize you're done
on.
And what came from that?
Try not to go into all of that. There were people that aren't harmed greatly. Julie's folks. I had even signed notes that I'd pay him back, and they were really proud of those promissory notes, but they hadn't meant a damn thing to me. I hadn't paid him a time with that and when we got him paid. But that was only part of the amendment.
And so I had to tell Julie's dad that that
biggest part of mine was my man. He may have thought the finances, but for me, it was for me to be grateful for the kindness he had always shown me because of the way I had treated his daughter and his granddaughters. And that sort of had to worry him no end, Had to drive him nuts with that. And so when I called him on that, I told him that.
And before I got around to the Bunny and I made the mistake of telling him that I loved him.
And he said, oh shit, he gave the phone to grandma.
And so I went through the whole thing with Julie's mother. And we get to this point and I ask her, have you any idea how much money you've given us over the years? And she said right down to the last penny.
And so we made arrangements to pay that back and
then later we sold the house
and the hence we got the money for that
few years later, quite a few years later.
Well first the day I called and Julie's dad answered the phone was a Tuesday. The next Thursday he was out using a snow blower and had a stroke and died.
Stupid, huh? I should have been done a long time ago.
Give him some peace.
And so then a few years later, she died. And for some reason, his mother, her mother died. And for some reason, Julie's brother wanted me to do the. What do you call it when you say nice to eulogy? Yeah. And,
and so
I told the story about effectively what I just told you and about Julie's mom saying right down to the last penny and,
and that because I thought it was indicative or hurts and all that, this is the same grandma that always had candy hidden in the kitchen cabinets and, and all that stuff.
This is sweet. A woman that you'd ever want to know
with that. And so I shared that
at the funeral and out there, I don't know what they do here, but the funeral in Wyoming and that sort of thing, you don't have a wake at the Funeral Home, but after the funeral, everybody goes to the home of the survivors and brings food and you have a nice time in there. And Julie's brother disappeared and and he said, and he walked up and he gave me the promissory note that said paid in full
and stamped on it. He says I didn't know what this was about, he said, but I sure don't need it. And he gave it to me.
That's just one of many with that. And I can hardly tell the story just about the amends without going on through that. But
what do we want to do? About time now? I hate to do that to you.
You need a break?
Go ahead. They said no,
I said
went through my inventory. The book says it made a list of all persons we had armed, became willing to make amends to them all in the next line in the book as we did it when we took inventory. So most of my men's is on my inventory
and I sat down with Don and started going through this and he had asked me to take each one of those people on the inventory and write down what the harm was. And I asked him why I was doing that
and he said because I don't want you wasting people's time without knowing why you're there.
And just walking in there and saying I'm sure I harmed you because I am who I am
is not going to fill the bill. And some mumbling apology isn't going to isn't going to do it either. So we we went down through the list.
I told you I was a bill collector in Chicago and back then you and there were those things got physical periodically and
and he said, what are you going to do about those guys?
And I said, you know, some of those people threatened to kill me,
and things got pretty contentious. And if I have to go back and make amends to those people that I had harmed when I was out collecting money, I'm liable to really get hurt.
And and he looked me right straight in the eye and said God either is or he isn't.
I don't like the answer
in And then he said. What are you going to do about your dad?
And I said nothing.
And he said, why not? And I said, well, he was the one that caused all the harm. I mean, he was the bad drunk that was beating me up when I was a kid and doing all that stuff, and why the hell should I go make amends to him? And he said, didn't you tell me that he called you every year on your birthday? And I said, yeah. And he said, what'd you do? And I said well when he called he was so drunk I couldn't understand what he was saying
so I had to hang up on him
and he said why would you do that? And I said cuz he was a drunk. And he looked at me and he said you're drunk.
Compelling argument.
And he said, are you willing to see that you've held your dad at arm's length your whole life because he was an alcoholic and you didn't know what that looked like till you were an alcoholic?
And he said, he said, do you have any idea how difficult it is for a chronic everyday Skid Row drunk
to remember one day a year to call you,
to try and touch you?
And I said, I guess so. And he said, well, that's what you're making amends for. And I said, well, let me tell you the rest of the story. My dad lives in in an old Army home in Wisconsin, stayed home
and he had a stroke and he's not supposed to be capable of any kind of continuous thought and he's living in a wheelchair and he's not. But his mind is supposed to be gone. So why should I go all the way to Wisconsin to make amends to somebody that isn't going to understand anyway?
And he said this because this is about cleaning off your side of the street and it doesn't make any difference whether he understands or not. You get in your car and drive to Wisconsin and make amends to him.
When I mentioned you before that we weren't given choices about doing this,
that's the way it was. It was just like, either do what it says or get the hell out,
right? That seems like kind of a
strict position to take, but we're not. We're not dealing with the common cold here.
So. So I went back to Chicago
and made some amends there than people that I could find anyway.
And some of them I said, what can I do to make that right? Because the making amends is really about balancing the books
and those people that I did get to see. I would say, what can I do
to make that right? And I got a variety of answers,
some of them where you can't.
Some of them were stay the hell away from me.
And some of them were glad that you found a solution.
Umm, you know, I went into that thinking I was done. I mean, I thought I'd walk into somebody's house in Chicago and they go, hey, you Remember Me?
And I take a bullet for it.
And then I went to make amends to my dad. I drove up to the Grand Army home in in went inside and I said my name is Bob Olsen. I'm I'm looking for my dad. His name is Bob Olsen too. And they said, that's him sitting over there in a wheelchair.
So I walked up to him and I stood in front of him and I said, hi, I'm your son, Bob. I hadn't seen him in probably a decade
and he looked at me and I think he got it. He looked like he got it anyway. He couldn't say anything
and I said I need to talk with you. And I, I took his wheelchair and I wheeled him off into this empty room and sat down in front of him and I said I'm an alcoholic. And when I said that, he got really sad.
And I said, but
I don't drink anymore. And I'm a part of a fellowship called Alcoholics Anonymous. And the reason why I'm here is because I've harmed you. And I want to try and do the right thing. I want to try and make that right with you. And when I told him that I didn't drink anymore, he looked elated.
And I knew something that there was some measure of understanding and what he was hearing.
And they said I've harmed you and I, I don't know what to do to make that right.
But I want you to know that I'm all right now
and that I understand that you were making an attempt to touch me every year on my birthday, and I regret having hung up on you.
And
I just didn't know what was going on
in UMM,
And then I, I left, went back to Colorado and he died.
He died. He had adult onset diabetes
and they his only other living relative besides my sister was his brother, my uncle.
And they called my uncle from the hospital and they said he's losing all the circulation in his extremities
and they said we're going to have to amputate his foot.
And So what they said we need your permission to do that. So that my uncle life gave him permission to amputate my dad's foot. And so they did. And it wasn't too much after that that they call my uncle wife and told them they were going to have to amputate his other foot
and then they were going to ask to amputate one of his hands or his fingers and then another piece of his leg. And back then they couldn't manage adult onset diabetes. So you just would eventually lose circulation in your extremities. And if they didn't amputate it, you get gangrene and die.
And after about the 4th call,
the doctor said, you know, we're going to run out of pieces to cut off here
and you know, we need to ask you a very difficult question. And that is, should we just let him die,
or should we keep taking pieces off?
And it was my uncle's opinion that they ought to let him die.
And I don't question that. I mean, it was his decision. I don't don't know one way or the other.
And so they made the decision to not do anymore surgery
in. At some level my dad knew
that they were going to let him die and he had nothing to say about it.
And so when anyone would come anywhere close to him,
he'd scream.
He had no other way to communicate. He just screamed.
Can he do that out of despair, which is one of the the four horsemen of alcoholism, terror, bewilderment, frustration and despair. So he would scream
and that's the way he died. My dad was married nine times
and the only one that showed up at his funeral was his brother.
I, I was told, my uncle said. Look, Bob, I know how you felt about your dad,
and we're just going to have a simple ceremony out behind the hospital in the cemetery there, and we're going to bury him. And you don't need to send any flowers, and you certainly don't have to travel halfway across the country to be here to see us put a dead body in the hole.
So,
you know, I just wanted you to know. Now, I'll tell you something about all that.
When my uncle called me and said, your dad died, I said, really? And he said, yeah, and we're going to have this funeral and da, da, da. And I said, OK. And after I had that phone conversation, my wife was watching at the time, was watching me. And she said, who is that? And I said life? And she said, what do you have to say? And I said
he told me that my dad died and she went
Oh my God, I am so sorry. And I said, don't be.
And she said, what do you mean? And I said, you grew up in a family where everybody loved each other and you all got to spend a lot of time together and do all the rest. That when I grew up, I got beaten up by my dad and I was glad he was the hell out of my life.
And then later in life, I learned a lot of other stuff about it. But see, my relationship with my dad was one where I didn't want to be anywhere near him. And so when he died, it was like somebody down the block died,
didn't have anything to do with me. And I went around wondering what the hell was the matter with me
mean. Aren't you supposed to feel something? I never shed a tear when my dad died
and after that.
And the only reason why I'm telling you this is because I'm sure that some of you and that are here today have had this same experience. So I think I'm wired badly, OK. And I was saying to my wife, I said I don't feel anything. I don't feel remorse. I don't feel regret. I don't feel anything.
I made amends. I did what I was supposed to do. He died. That's the end of it.
No tears, no nothing.
And I said, but you know what? When my mother dies,
there's going to be tears. And then my mother died
and nothing happen.
Didn't shed a tear.
You know, I lived in foster homes when I grew up, and I got to know my mother better later in life.
But when she died, the same thing happened. And I'm thinking, how come I can't shed a tear when my mother dies?
And it's because I just didn't grow up like a lot of people. I didn't grow up with any sense of family. I didn't think I was part of anything
and one of the reasons why I always felt like I was damaged good goods was because I had no sense of that. And people would sit there and compare me to those to both my mother and my father and and I had this bad opinion to myself. See, and I,
I finally,
I found out because I chased it, that if you don't grow up in sort of normal family situation, you don't have it.
Now I'll tell you what, I got five sons
and two grandsons,
and I would jump in front of a bullet for any one of them.
And heaven forbid anyone of those guys goes away.
But, you know, sometimes we grow up in situations
dead don't provide us with some of the emotional things that other people have.
And that's just what happened.
And people go, well, you really had an abnormal childhood, but you want to know the truth. If it's the only one you have, you think it's normal.
OK, so so if you can't dredge up tears, or if you can't become emotional, or if you can't feel an overwhelming sense of sadness because someone dies in your life that you weren't close to, don't feel bad about it.
You aren't
you aren't prepared to do that.
And, you know, I just, we can either spend the rest of our lives
bemoaning our circumstances or we can get on about it now.
Took 3 1/2. No, it took, yeah, close to 3 1/2 years, I think, for me to pay financial amends.
I went to my uncle and I said my uncle is a banker
and I went to him life and I said
I owe all this money. I don't know what to do.
And he said, how did you get into that deep in trouble? And I said, well, I'm an alcoholic and I needed to drink and I ran a loan company and I know how to manipulate money.
And he said, well, all right. And I said, you know, my concern in about how I got into it. My concern is how do I get out of it?
And he said, well it's fairly simple. And I said good.
And he said here's how you do it. And I said I'm listening. And he said you start paying now and you pay till it's paid.
Could you give me another solution? Yeah.
So what I did was I took 30% of my net income and I paid amends with it every month for three years.
And all of a sudden I owed out of all that money that I owed, I only had owed $2500 after that. And Gary was making a joke about it before
I grew up in Wisconsin and, and there's a lot of lakes in Wisconsin. You know, the Minnesota license plate says 10,000 lakes, but they really got closer to 20,000 up there in Wisconsin is 10,000 lakes.
And so when I was a kid, because we we didn't have any money, I lived in a little house that was up on cement blocks that had three rooms in it. And it's a bad neighborhood. And people would throw a dead dog or something under your house and you didn't even know it was there until it smelled so bad you couldn't go in to get it
anyway. It was not a great place to live in. I,
I used to go down by this river and Madison
in watch guys combine boats and there is a lot of lakes right there. And these guys would look like they were having a great deal of fun. And I'd sit on the riverbank and watch all these boats go by, whether they'd have families in them and all this stuff. And I would sit there and say, when I grow up, I'm going to have a boat and I'm going to have a family and I'm going to do all this stuff.
In all my life I wanted to vote and I never had enough money to get it.
And when I was almost done paying my men's I, I paid so much of my income that for three years we really didn't go out much, rarely went to restaurants. I had two sons and and a wife and, and we almost never went to restaurants and almost never did, you know, anything beyond the most meager
kinds of things you had to do for your life. And they had a boat show in Denver and I went over there, took the kids there and I said, I'm, you know, we need to at least go out and do something. So I said, would you like to go to this boat show? Boat, boat travel and whatever the hell it was? OK, two minutes
and in the Bass Masters were in there with a raffle
and they had 10 bucks of my money before I knew I had had it out of my pocket. I felt like Jack and the Beanstalk, you know, when he gave the cow away for a handful of beans
and I had three lottery tickets and they called me the next day and told me I won the boat.
It's a brand new Rebel Bass boat
and I went down there to look at it and made the mistake of taking my two kids with me and they're climbing around in the boat going, oh, is this going to be fun? We're going to go fishing and are we going to go water skiing and do all that stuff? And I went and asked the Rebel Bass boat dealer with this in 1973
or next 1975
and and I said how much is that boat worth? And he said 2500 bucks wholesale.
Oh, So what do you do? Keep the boat, keep paying off your men, sell the boat. What is it?
It's a spiritual life is not a theory. We have to live it. I had to tell my kids they couldn't have the boat and I sold the boat to some guy from Texas for 2500 bucks and paid off the rest of my amends.
I promised my kids they'd have a boat and three years later I bought a 17 1/2 foot Cobalt with a Boss 302 Ford V8 in it
that you could troll at 60 miles an hour.
Thanks. There's a break.