The Primary Purpose Group in Atlanta, GA

Great.

Hey, how you doing? My name is Jeff Spava. I'm grateful. Recovered alcoholic.

Can we open this meeting with a moment of silent prayer?

God hear me to serenity to accept the things that I cannot change, courage to change the things that I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.

Thank you.

Good evening and welcome to the 2nd Anniversary speaker meeting of the Primary Purpose Book Study Group.

This is from the forward to the 1st edition. We have Alcoholics Anonymous are more than 100 men and women who have recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. To show other Alcoholics precisely how we have recovered is the main purpose of this book and of this group.

For them, we hope these pages will prove so convincing that no further authentication will be necessary.

We think this account of our experiences will help everyone to better understand the alcoholic. Many do not comprehend that the alcoholic is a very sick person, and besides, we are sure that our way of living has its advantages for all.

Our seven tradition states that each group ought to be self supporting to their own contributions. If this is your first meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous, we ask that you be our guest.

We're going to now pass the Seven Tradition Basket.

This meeting discusses topics of a very serious nature that are extremely important to everyone in this room.

We are glad that you are here. Please be respectful of the others in this meeting and govern yourselves accordingly

and recognition of this group's two year anniversary. The members of this group have elected to vary from our standard format

of intensive study of the book Alcoholics Anonymous, and we have invited a speaker to share his experience and knowledge with us,

and I'm going to introduce him at this point. When I first came in to the rooms,

I was blessed. God blessed me by surrounding me with a group of men that were

really into this book and really into this program, and that let me know the difference between what I thought my problem was and what my problem really was.

And therefore

understand that what I thought was going to fix me wasn't and I needed something else. And one of the things that they did that my sponsor did early on was he turned me on to Chris. He gave me a couple of CDs of Chris speaking

and Chris's explanation of what this book says

and what alcoholism is. He had just had a way of putting it that really made sense to me and it really was very clear and very simple. And then

his explanation of what I needed to do and what the possibilities of the results of taking those actions would be just got me really excited. He's very exciting person. He's a great, great guy. We just had a really nice dinner together and

I want to introduce Chris Rammer.

I love it when they he's a great guy and he's really handsome. And

God

know you left it out conspicuously. I mean, I don't.

Good heavens. My name is Chris Raymer. I'm a very grateful recovered alcoholic.

Also a recovered attic. I'm just going to mention that throw it in at the top and let it go with that. I I'm honored to be here. I I know a bunch of y'all in here and I've met before and trips to Atlanta and, and

some I know from real seedy bars before that. And so,

you know, that's just the nature of the beast and I'm honored to get a chance to do this. I know there's some patients in here. Do they call them patients here or clients?

Patients? I work at a hospital in Texas, a big treatment center down in Texas, and we call them patients to some places. They get offended their clients and so I don't know what to tell you.

We're I just glad you're here. I guarantee you. I want to mention real quick kind of getting into this as I always do.

I know we, gosh, we got people from all walks of life in here and we all get here kind of the different routes. I know we've got some little dope heads in here and I know we got some little Alcoholics and I know we got some of y'all got here through the treatment centers and some of you got through here through judicial system, the courts. And some of y'all just walked into an A, a meeting and I, I guess got to tell you guys. I long time ago folks, I got sober November 13th, 1987. I'm, I'll do the math for you. I'm a little better than 21 years sober and I a long time ago I got tired of pissing people off from

podium. I don't want to do that. I'm, I know saying that I'm, I'm going to, I'm fixing to do that,

but I'm going to try to crawfish out of it and not do that because I'm going to tell you guys all I want to do up here for I got you for about 45 minutes or so. I just, I want to share my story. I want to share what happened to me. And, and it can be light years away from what happened to you. And, and it that's just OK. You don't have to agree with me. Why is it if I agree with you, we're going to be friends. If I don't agree with you, we're not going to be friends. I mean, that ain't how it works.

This is open and roomy, so I'm if some of the stuff I talk about kind of gets into your skin, maybe you needed somebody to get under your skin. I don't know what to tell you.

I'm not a Big 12 and 12 fan, but I was reading this today to a patient up at the hospital and and he wants to argue with everything. I don't none of y'all are like this guy, but this guy, he always argue with everything. He's only been in about six treatment centers and but he wants to tell me why this one's not going to work either. And so I want to just remit A. A is 12 steps for a group of principals, spiritual in nature,

which if practice is a way of life, can expel the obsession to drink and enable the sufferer to become happily and usefully whole.

It's kind of like a little summation there of what this is about. And I know some people are ready to get sober. And one of the things I see in treatment a lot is that we end up picking people to green, you know, we end up be kind of being triage for folks. You know, you get your your your butt on fire out there and then you come into treatment, let the flames die down, get you some rest, eat a couple of Big Macs and you're ready to go get it again. You know, and it's like, and some of you in here going to do that, but

guys, I know that there's some of you in here, men and women. So there's some of you cats that are so done it's not even funny. I mean, I, I got on planes and I travel I-45 weekends out of the year. I'm traveling someplace not because I like to travel, because every once in a while I'll come across somebody that's just flat done. And, and, and I want to help you hear the solution to the problem.

There's I introduced myself as a recovered alcoholic and I know in treatment that sometimes just kind of heresy, but my big book tells me to introduce myself as that I am a recovered alcoholic. For 21 years I haven't obsessed about alcohol or drugs.

And guys, I so want you to be there. I don't care what you do with the rest of your life, guys, but whatever you're going to do, it's going to be better if you're not fighting the obsession to drinking drug. There's a way out in which we can absolutely agree. A A the 12 steps works for everyone.

Makes sense. I don't care what this moron and you guys watching CNN, they got this little book 2495 from this idiot out in California. You can get it. I got it. I, I coughed up 2495 because I wanted to find out what it is. I mean, I've hell, I've been, I've been working a program for 21 years. Who knew? All I had to do is buy a stupid book rock 2495. It'll tell you how to get well. Then I got to tell you guys, a lot of people are getting well reading that book. A lot of hard drinkers, a lot of party animals are getting well

book.

The problem is it doesn't seem to do much for alcoholism and drug addiction,

which is the problem,

folks. If I'll cause your problem, this place that you're in here right now, this treatment center will fix your problem because they'll get you detoxed and pat you on the little butt and send you out of here. If alcohol is your problem, you're fixing to get well. If alcoholism is your problem, the stuff fixing to hit the fan

about the time you get this stuff cleared from your system, now you've got to deal with the mental obsession. It's going to come back and haunt you forever. And that's all I want to talk to you guys about is the way out. I was talking to somebody the other day. It was introduced myself as a chronic relapser and he, I hate that term. I hate that expression. I don't know what to tell you folks. That's what I am. I'm a cat that could not not drink. I can quit on a dime, but I can't stay quit.

You'll follow. I I

I ought to quit for a month for her. I got to tell you right now,

I was just telling you I would. I'm just what I know me. I know me

a month and three days, she's out on her ass. I can take it.

This is what alcoholism and drug addiction is about, guys. There's a lot of people, most of the people out there can take this stuff or leave it alone. Hard drinkers, moderate drinkers. How many we, I mean, Oh my gosh, I was out on a date when I did some cocaine with an old girl. She says, oh, that was wonderful. Oh my gosh, I still can't feel my face. Let's do that again sometime. And I said, hot damn right now, you know, it's just

she, she, no, that's not what she meant, you know, and it's like

it is the same with the drinking. You know, you go out and have a couple of my little sister. I have an identical twin brother that's an alcoholic. His name is Myers. And some of y'all heard him and, and he and I caught that little old genetic bullet. Alcoholism and drug addiction, guys, is genetic. I mean, if, if you're still sitting here blaming that bad thing for your drinking, you need to come up with a new line because it's not working anymore. We know that it's genetic in nature, but I'm bummed most of us can look up that old family tree and find one or two a little knuckleheads fall out of the top and that's just the way it is.

My twin brother caught the bullet with me and I got a little sister that didn't. We spent most of the 21 years trying to turn her into an alcoholic because we just thought it'd be so much fun. Have another three little guys, you know, she just Lisa drink up, you know she and she'll have a couple of drinks she says and then she'll stop just like in mid drink and says no thank you. Starting to feel it.

Me too. Now let's go.

Go now, you know, let's go. And she, and she says, no, you don't understand. I don't like the way that makes me feel. And I'm just like, don't, don't say that out loud. I've got a reputation to uphold here. She she just can't, I've seen her drink all her life. She has one or two little glasses of wine if she likes it and she sets it down and that's it. Given sufficient reason, she can stop, leave it alone altogether. My twin brother and I couldn't do that. And I, I, I just, I was in the food business. We were talking at dinner with Jerry and some of the guys in the business

and I was wanted to be a chef all my life. And I'm not so sure because I like to cook or because I like to drink and get away with it. Because, you know, the kitchens, they just as long as you showed up and did the job, they didn't give her what you did. They just come on. And in fact, I, I lived here in Atlanta for a short period of time in the 70s at, at Omni when we opened up Omni International Hotel and I worked in the kitchens there

and loved that business, loved the industry and,

and eventually couldn't work in the industry because I was drinking too much. And

I remember telling my dad one time, he said, you know, you drink, it's kind of freaking us out a little bit. And, and he was a drunk and he knew what one looked like. And he said, you know, you, you kind of need, he said, I, I said, dad, if it ever starts affecting my career, I'll quit, don't worry about that. And it did and I didn't.

Makes sense.

I get crazy with people that think that this is willpower or a behavioral problem. We see it in treatment all the time. You know, if you loved your kids, you'd quit. If you, if you loved your, you bite me.

That's like going up to somebody that's lactose intolerant and said, you know, buddy, if you really love me, you'd drink that milkshake.

It's like what, what we wouldn't even consider doing that, but we do it with Alcoholics and drug addicts all the time. It drives me absolutely nuts. I, I couldn't stop drinking folks. And I'm starting to see a doctor because I know that there's some problems. I'm seeing shrinks like psychiatrist doctors. I'm nuts. And, and I, and I don't understand because I pull all my willpower together and I'm going to quit for her, for the job or for something. And I, and I think I can manage it this time. And I

could put together a few weeks and then I, then I, I drink again and well, there's got to be a reason. So I'm seeing the shrinks and of course they're all agreeing with me. Chris, you're drinking because you're clinically depressed. You're and I, it makes perfect sense to me. I says, Oh my gosh, when I drink, I'm not depressed. And, and so I here's an antidepressant brand new on the market. I did the test studies on most of the antidepressants that you little kids, you punks are taken now

that you can thank me for.

We were laughing with Larry. One town there used to be an antidepressant Suppository didn't last too long. Didn't last too long out there, but it was a who taken. I got to tell you it was,

I think I'm kidding. I'm taking antidepressants by the handfuls folks. And it's just, and then you go to another dog, Chris, you're not depressed. It's not that it's just your bipolar, you're a little high strung. We're going to give you these medications. It'll it'll help you with us. I'm taking that and the antidepressants, your adult detention deficit disorder, you got that. And I'm taking this and I'm saying, guys, I'm going to tell you, I spent most of my life so medicated. I didn't have to worry about gaining any weight because I couldn't eat. You know, you just, you have to be absolutely whole food in your mouth and swallow.

I'm just, I'm just a mess. Doctor prescribed medications right now is what we're seeing in our hospital more than anything else. It freaks me out. What's coming towards us. This this pill epidemic that's hitting this country is going to make make the crack epidemic look like kids play. And it's worse. It's nastier. It takes longer to detox from and it's it's it's going to be horrible. If any of you guys are chipping with that stuff,

chip something else because it's going to be nasty.

Doctors ain't fixing me and I'm going nuts. And I got married because that was going to fix me. Put some roots down up in North Texas and

I, we have a little domestic disturbance in a, in a cop's. Do you know how that goes? And I ended up back in therapy with a guy and he's this low rung counselor and, and he just says, Chris, I don't know about all this other stuff. I have all these disorders. You'll follow your clinical this, your BOP that you're all that.

I don't know anybody any of this. I can tell you by looking at your chart, you're a drunk.

I was absolutely offended to hear you'll follow. It's borderline. Schizophrenia will get you laid. You know that

a drunk will get you asked to leave the premises. It's just I don't know what that's about. So the little young guys come to our hospital. I'm a drug addict. I'm a drug addict. No look in your chart looks to me like you're an alcoholic. I am a drug. A It just sounds cooler to be a drug addict than an alcoholic.

They come back six months later. I'm an alcoholic. I've been out there doing a little research. I, I got my,

I went to my first a, a meeting in the early 80s folks and, and,

and I didn't have any problem with it. I mean, I bring it on anything to stop doing what I'm doing. You know how this thing works

if you're an alcoholic, I've got this physical phenomena called craving. When I put the crap in my body, I can't guarantee you how much I'm gonna drink. And then you got this little middle obsession thing that tells me that you can put the first one in your body. So it's kind of a little round and round, like a, you know, squirrel cage chasing your tail. It's like my mind keeps telling me I can put it in my body and my body knows it can't and keeps OK. But underneath all, we've got this little thing called a spiritual malady. And I want some of you guys that been around the fellowship, you

may not, may or may not know that expression. The book talks about it, the spiritual illness. And, and it's something that seems to be avoided in in hospitals and in especially in Alcoholics Anonymous. Nobody wants to talk about it. The spiritual malady is the internal condition that makes me nuts. The spiritual malady is my proof that that alcohol is not the problem.

This malady looks like this. I'm irritable, restless and discontent. Pretend this is the alcohol. When I stop drinking,

no bad beer, no more alcohol. What happens is internally starts to come back to depression and the low self esteem and the feeling of uselessness and the fearfulness and the anxiety. You're with us. This is in the big book. This is what it talks about. This internal discomfort is why we always end up going back. You want to blame Mama, You want to blame the job, You want to blame all this other happy horse hockey. That all exacerbates the problem, but it's not causing the problem. How many of you guys in this room play with us? How many

drank a drug when life was great? Raise your hand,

all the hands up, how many you drank a drug when life was crap?

Good job.

Come on. Yeah, Yeah,

if you're just drinking cuz you got a bad job, quit the damn job. You all understand that? Good. Great relationship,

Crappy relationship,

same hands. We could do this all day long. You with us. The poor therapists are running over, working overtime trying to figure out what's causing me to drink. If if something out there is causing me to drink, I'm not an alcoholic. Y'all need to get that straight right now. Make sense? That's heresy in here. Somebody's going to get pissed.

Guys, alcoholism and drug addiction is not causal. Why do we have so many wealthy people in recovery?

You with us, good church people in recovery, good people with lots of, well, good upbringing. We want to focus on the little bad stuff, but that's not what causes. There's no more drinking in that than there is in that. This internal condition, the spiritual malady guys, is what's kicking our ass. And so I come to a A for the first time and the guy says you got a problem with alcohol. The closest anybody for seven years ever came to qualify me as an alcoholic and an addict. They didn't even do it in treatment. You know how they qualified me going into treatment

in the 80s? It's not like that now. It gets different now in the 80s, this is how they qualified you. You've got any insurance?

Yeah. Welcome to Alcoholics Anonymous. Jesus. Unbelievable what we did to people back then. I was a part of the industry, guys. I'm telling you, I know exactly what we did.

I went in and he said you got a problem with alcohol? And I said yes. He said welcome. And we sat down and then it's the last. We talked about alcoholism for an hour. We talked about this lady's was having a problem with her husband and we talked about her husband's problem. Dig.

I said. Shit, I don't know, maybe I missed something, but we didn't talk about anything. My wife asked me. She said, what

went back the next night. You with us? Well, the lady was gone, so we didn't have a problem to talk about there. So we went around the room and tried to scare the bejesus out of Chris Raymer. Everybody told their little war stories. Guys, I'm going to tell you, I talked all over the world and we talk about this and I know some of you get grindy because you like to tell war stories and you love to fix people's problems because you haven't, you witnessed it just makes you feel useful. I'm going to tell you something, folks. We've gotten so far off the page it's not even funny in our fellowships because Alcoholics Anonymous is not a therapy group

and it's not time to be talking about your chicken shit day.

We just read it in the book Alcoholics Anonymous as a Spiritual Program of Action. We're going to work some steps. We're going to get connected spiritually and we're going to have a spiritual experience in the obsession to drink and drug is going to go away and we're going to turn around and go help somebody else. You're cool with that because that's what it's supposed to be. Get a little outside myself there a little bit. Yeah, because I'm sick and tired of watching our fellowships get watered down by a bunch of well meaning people that should know better and don't.

Spit guys, I sit in front of a computer all day long and I get emails from all over the world. You know what they hate about a a war stories and all the pissing and moaning about your day. Do you need to tell a war story? You better believe it in a 12 step call. You're having trouble staying sober. I'm going to slide up next to you. I need to tell you some stories about myself and you're going to share some stories about yourself and I'm going to get your confidence and then I'm going to hook you into this program. I'm going to, I'm going to sell you on this idea of the spiritual experience, but I'm not going to be able to do that till we tell a story

or two or three. You with us? Do I need to talk about my day? You damn right. It's called sponsorship. It's called good therapy. It's called having some friends,

but I'll be damned if I'll sit up here and say it's OK for you to come into a meeting and say anything you want and anybody here wants to argue about that afterwards, you can just come on up. We can take care of it now. Got a little fried pie coming in the back door. And all he wants to know is can I wake up anytime soon and not obsess about alcohol and drugs? Can I get well from this? Is it possible to ever recover? But we're not going to get time to do that because we're too busy talking about your stupid weed eater one more time.

I tell you where we got off the page. It's a little thing called a Grapevine article. In the late, late 60s, early 70s, there was a series of articles and it talked about turning this wonderful meetings that we were having called step studies. We're going to turn some of these meetings into open discussion meetings. And that's what we did. Open discussion. Hell, you'll follow guys. It's like triage. You get here to this fellowship and your butt's coming undone. We need to get you connected spiritually so that you can get well and then you can turn around and help somebody else.

But if we waste your time trying to fix your day, you're not ever going to depend on God. You're going to start depending on the group.

Make sense

guys. Go find a therapist, go find a friend. Let's all go to Denny's and talk about the weed eater.

You've got to be a short conversation.

A lot of misinformation out there. Guys, I'm in a a for seven years and can't get sober and I'm in and out and I, I am proof positive that meeting makers don't make it like so many of y'all in this room, 90 meetings in 90 days. Just don't drink, go to meetings. Everything's going to be OK.

You know, again, I'm going to say this again, they might be. If you happen to be one of those guys that could get sober reading that idiot's book out in California, you might be able to do that. I know people that just come to meetings. I've never worked any steps and I've been sober for 50 years.

Rock on.

What? You're a loser. Absolute loser.

The fellowship, the love got me sober. You are not one of us. You are not an alcoholic. If love was going to get me sober, folks, I had no, no, no short supply of it. Counselors love me. My family love me. You with me. Women love me. I wonder where the counselors are sitting. Because every eye in here is over here in these countries. Who? Where is the counselors in here? Because y'all are getting the B lines. Everybody. I'm stirring up a hornet's nest for you, I'm sure. Sorry,

you'll earn your living tomorrow.

Hey,

here's what a misconception looks like, friends. But here's what a misconception. You know what a misconception is? Misconception is that I can look at something and see something and believe it's that, but be completely wrong. You with us. How many of you guys have ever done that in a bar? She'll go out with me

and then find out

when hell freezes over, she might go out with you. Y'all, y'all understand that it's a misconception? And This is why I just get just rabid from the podium sometimes. And I get I get cranky in treatment centers sometimes when we're when we're teaching so much stuff that's disguised as recovery and is not.

Treatment centers are the best of the bomb. They can teach you how one, they can detox you with the right way, Safeway, and then they can teach you some cool things in early sobriety that will keep you on a straight and narrow. But a treatment center is not going to fix your problem.

The treatment center will not fix your problem.

The spiritual experience gets you connected spiritually and that thing called God. Whatever we believe is God

fixes the problem. Makes sense,

but I don't believe in God. Where would you be willing to work the steps anyway? Because if you do, you're going to believe in something, I don't care what you call it. No, I won't believe in God. I don't believe in spirituality. I don't believe. I'm not willing to believe in any of that. Rock on.

There's this book for 2495.

Because here's what we've done in our fellowship. What we what we've done is we've gotten embarrassed, almost embarrassed. We're we're almost apologetic about talking about God from the podium, the higher power. We don't want to talk about last resort. We're going to broach the topic. We're going to broach the subject. What do we only have one thing to sell in a A? It's a spiritual experience.

Makes sense. 5th tradition tells us you got the traditions up

right here.

The 5th tradition tells us we've only got 1 primary purpose. That's the carry the message to the alcoholic or the doping that still suffers shall follow in subsequent of the other fellowships. That's what we're supposed to do. Ask somebody the other day what's our primary purpose? It's to share our experience, strength and hope.

No, thank God it's not.

Guys, I got to tell you, I've been so blessed by the fellowship of this program. I, my sitting in here talking, saw Larry when I walked in. We've known each other for years. Just, just I, just the fellowship. I am so blessed by the people in these rooms and the stories they told me and the lives that you've shared and the information I've been able to glean from that. But guys, I'm going to tell you something. The program of Alcoholics Anonymous is what saved my skinny little ass

by actually getting past my arrogance and my selfish and self centeredness and actually doing some work with the 12 steps I got spiritually connected.

Fast forward seven years. I can't stay sober. I cannot do this and

I I'm working for my twin brother up in North Texas and I can't cook anymore and picked up a stack of return checks and a 12 pack of beer and went to my little apartment and that my sister-in-law had to Co sign for me. You'll follow

unwrapping these return checks bankrupted another check in account. I'm 35 years old and I'm broke again.

I'm sitting on the floor because my dope dealers got my furniture.

Probably still got them today. Bastard,

I boy, I tell you. I don't know how to explain it guys.

I got about 40 lbs on me and it's all right here and I got a big full beard and I'm health is really bad and I'm puking blood. I can't stop drinking and I'm and I'm just crazy on top of all the medications I'm taking doctor prescribed medications. I'm drinking like a son of a gun and I'm doing a bunch of other outside issues and I am I am not well and I'm managing to go to work every day. I drive an old beat up pick up truck and I

God I'm just sad. I'm just, I'm sick. I remember

when I lived here in the mid 70s working for Omni and I, I went to a park over here. I don't know where the park was, couldn't take it take you there today. I don't remember where it was, but I remember it was a Sunday afternoon and I didn't have to work and I had a 12 pack of beer. And I'm sitting, I had old busted up Toyota and I'm sitting in that park and I'm watching all the families play with their kids with us dogs out there. Typical Sunday afternoon families are out there having a good time. And I'm sitting in that car figuring out wonder where I could get a gun so I could finish this job now and get it over with. Because I know I'm never going to have

family and I'm never going to have a dog. I'm never going to have anything that those people are having. I mean, it's not about just feeling sorry for myself. I'm so sick and tired of this is not who my dad raised. I didn't intend for this to to to be like this.

You mean you can make in all the excuses you want rationalized until the cows come home while you ended up like this? The bottom line is

the booze had everything to do with it.

I can stop drinking for periods of time, but I don't get better. I get worse and the voices start to come back and my head starts to scream and I have to I have to drink or off myself. I'm sitting in this apartment cold in November night up in North Texas and I it's November the 12th. It was the the

cold Thursday night and I heard a voice that night as I'm eating those pills, I'm trying to commit suicide. And I heard a voice that said, don't do this. Go back to a a couple of times. I heard that voice that night and it wasn't like I thought, you know, Chris, you probably ought to go give a, a, another shot because I didn't want to go give a, a, another shot. I've been in it for seven years. I picked up more desire chips. If you had ever desired chip, you know what I'm saying? You couldn't put them in my pockets tonight. The numbers I picked up and I

every time

didn't understand because of the misconceptions. I'm going to say this and move real quick on because I'm, I'm, I'm going to get well within two weeks of this suicide attempt,

I go into a A and this guy over here would be saying, you know, Chris, you really need to kind of get on this 12 step stuff because you know, there's kind of a sense of urgency here and he's got an old beat up big book you'll follow. And so I'm kind of interested in he kind of flips it open and this lady over here is watching and he's going like, no, she catches me in the coffee bar. Listen, stay away from that guy. Listen, what you need to do, buddy, is you just to just need to keep coming back,

'cause right now all you can manage to do is keep coming back.

You follow. Now which am I going to listen to? This guy over here wants me to work the steps, and this lady over here just wants me to keep coming by.

Anybody in here, I love and respect you. I'm going to tell you now that the best you can come up with for one of these newcomers is keep coming back. Shut up.

You're welcome. You're welcome.

You don't need to worry about the big boot. You just need to do this. You don't need to. No, no, no. You haven't been sober long enough. You can't cheer me. You can't make coffee. You can't go work with others. You can't do jacks. You just need to get your feet on the ground and everything's going to be OK. You'll understand this. And yet the big book says exactly opposite. Work with others, help others. Get out of your head, Go do some work. Make sense? But nobody's telling me that because they're so they're tiptoeing around me trying to, Oh my God, they're so concerned that I'm going to leave the fellowship.

Jesus, guys, we only have one message. Work the steps, have a spiritual experience, Recover, go help somebody else. That's what we do.

Jesus, You can't sponsor anybody till you've been sober a year.

God, where does it say that? Jesus help us.

Can't chair a meeting until you've been sober 6 Why does it take a freaking degree? You have to be a rocket scientist.

Jesus,

I'm on a tear. Misconceptions. Guys, I want to read something to you real quick. Some of y'all are going to get

y'all like the Grapevine.

I hate it. OK, here

the awareness that this is Grapevine's statement of purpose. I'm not knocking the Grapevine,

Tiff. Of course I am.

The awareness that every AA member has an individual way of working the program permeates the pages of the Grapevine. Throughout its history, the magazine has been a forum for the varied and often divergent opinions of AAS around the world. In other words, do it any way you want.

You axe make sense. Bill Wilson wrote

great little book called A A Comes of Age. Unless each a a member follows to the best of his ability, our suggested 12 steps of recovery, he almost certainly signs his own death warrant. Drunkest drunkenness and disintegration are not penalties inflicted by people in authority. They are the results of personal disobedience to spiritual principles. We must obey certain principles or we die.

You'll see. And we can do this all night long. Bill Wilson, Rigid. Come on, buddy. If you don't want to do this, you don't have to do this. Go away. Have a nice life,

but if you want to do this, you deserve to at least hear what the solution is.

People come in here and they sit on their ass for 90 meetings and 90 days and they don't stay sober. And then they come back to treatment of six months from now, barely, barely alive and say, I tried AA, it didn't work.

You didn't try, Jack. All you did was come to some meetings. Make sense? It's like me going to a gym every two. Never mind

you all understand you don't work. You mean you? I have to sweat.

I made myself sick that night and I laid down on the bed, passed out. And the next day I, I woke up the next morning, I had to go to work and I called a doctor when I got to work and I got some doggie Downers at lunch and I kept working because that's what we have to do. I'm living from paycheck to paycheck. Some of y'all in here know exactly what that's about. You don't work. You live on the street. And I've lived on the street. I've eaten out of dumpsters in Houston, TX. Thank you, but no thank you. There's nothing much romantic about that. And

Oh my gosh,

I'm running late at 6:00 at night and I was going to go to this meeting in a town close by where I used to date this old girl. I'm going to go see if I can chum up a friend and and or a date. And

I'd gone back to this other meeting. I knew where it was and I went over because I was running late and this guy that had 12 step me three years before had driven me by this meeting. He said, see that room right there? He said, yeah, that's that's where them A and aers meet. And I said, I'm going to tell you something, buddy. These a a guys, These ain't the little meeting maker. Make it kind of guys. This is if you don't want to like actually do the work, don't go to this meeting because they're kind of militant. You'll follow. And of course I'm rolling my eyes like like, thanks for the warning. I mean, because like, I'm never going to

door you'll follow. I'm dying of alcoholism, untreated alcoholism. It's killing me. I'm I'm coming a part of the seams. I'm less than 24 hours away from a suicide attempt. Not just this, I think I need to commit suicide. I mean a bona fide I'm going to die suicide attempt. And here I am arguing with myself. Less than 24 hours later, my ego is rebuilt to such a point that I'm I'm judging this group. I'm not going to go in that group, that big book thumper group you follow.

You know how God works though. But I'm coming a part of the scenes. I'm detoxing like a big dog. And I said, well, I'm going to go and get this over with and I'm going to go on home and chill out for a while. And so I went to this 6:00 meeting and I walked in the back door

and it was one of these old longshot meetings with six foot tables down the middle. You know, the kind of cigarette, it's back in the day, guys. You all remember that they some of y'all don't even we could smoke in meetings back back in the day and back in the day. And when we and we all did, there was six or seven cigarettes out of my mouth.

We just messed it up for the new guys coming in. If we'd all smoked 1:00, we'd still be smoking in these damn meetings. But we ruined it for you guys, I'm sure sorry, but it was it was good while it lasted

and the ceilings dropping. But I walked into this meeting guys and sure enough, I'm looking and everybody's got a big book and I don't have a big book. You with me. So I'm feeling self-conscious and they're laughing and I know they're laughing at me and I'm instinct. I'm checking my zipper and I, I got this. Some of y'all might not have noticed that I have a black eye patch. I wear this eye patch.

You know, I wasn't on this in this building. 10 minutes and somebody came up says oh, can I see your eye?

What is that?

Can I see your tits?

What is that?

Why would you ask somebody that just takes their breath away?

But I'm sitting there and I've got this, I'm just kidding, guys. I'm sorry. I was inappropriate. And I'm sitting there like this. I it was and I'm walking into this room like this and I get, it's like, you never know with me whether I'm wearing an eye patch or an ear muff, you know, because it's, it's like it's always sliding around crooked, you know, and I got this big full beard and I mean, I am a mess, guys. I'm so self-conscious.