Workshop on "Questions and Answers on Sponsorship" for Area 36, District 23 in St. Peter, MN

Well, hello again.

Oh, let's see here.

Lunch was very good. I I as well. I'm tired and I'm still thinking about lunch. So

what to expect? What not to expect.

You know, when I first came in, I, I knew very little about AAI, knew nothing about sponsorship. I had lots of demands on a sponsor. I wanted them to love me. I wanted them to give me money if I needed money. I wanted them to bum me cigarettes and buy me lunch. And I wanted my sponsor to invite me to sit to live with her when I was out of the sober house. You know, I had all these expectations, you know, that all had to do with me

and my poor, pitiful life.

Yeah. And obviously that's changed.

You know, I just, I really didn't know anything about sponsorship. I didn't, I didn't know enough to expect anything. You know, as time goes, you know, I look back on it now and I know what I should have expected, you know, but it back then I didn't I didn't expect that.

What I know today is what I what I expected my sponsors that she

she grows before me.

I need somebody who is still growing, still spiritually seeking and she's doing it ahead of me and she's teaching me as she goes. I think that's important. Like I said, you know, the sponsor that I had Kathleen, she

she halted, you know, she was no longer growing before me. And it was funny because she gave me a bookmark on my one year sobriety date. And this bookmark had like the 12 things of sponsorship in one of them was that the sponsor grows before you. So I found that ironic, but

but you know, she, her life happened and she got a little bit busy and, and you know, stuff like that happens. But that's one thing that I expect from a sponsor today is that they grow before me.

Umm, Dustin alluded to it. He did such a good job.

So I don't even know what to say. But I, you know, the things I don't expect anymore are money. I don't expect a sponsor to worry about my feelings. I expect them to tell me the truth because that's what I need to hear. You know, I, I still suffer from delusion today. I still can't see, you know, some of the crazy things that are going on in my life. And when I explain them to them and, you know, like Dustin said, in just the right way. So I hear what I want to hear.

I expect for them to see through that and tell me the truth instead of worry about my feelings and agree with me and, and share in that resentment. That's one thing I've seen in Alcoholics Anonymous is, you know, I was sitting at a, a picnic and an AA picnic and I'm sitting next to a sponsor and her sponsee and they're literally sharing in a resentment together. And I was just like, this is the craziest thing I've ever seen. I hope my sponsor never does this with me,

you know, because it was just the weirdest thing to see that, you know, it wasn't like the sponsor was saying, oh, maybe you should write some inventory on that or let's take a look at that or what are your mistakes in this relationship? They were sharing in this resentment together. And it was, it was an awakening for me at that point because I was like, I hope my sponsor never does that to me. And I hope I never do that with anyone I sponsor,

you know, So I, I think the most important thing to

expect is obviously that they've been through the work and that they can take you through that work in the beginning, but also that they're growing ahead of you.

You know, I don't think that you should spiritually surpass your sponsor. I think that they should be leading the way, you know, but shoulder to shoulder. But they should know ahead of time, you know, to be able to teach you.

Yeah, that's all I have. Thanks.

Now. Now we're getting into the second part of the pamphlet, which is kind of addressed to wanting to be a sponsor.

A thankless job at times, but how does it help you?

Phew, having someone love me enough to tell me the truth and then learning that that was OK to do an Alcoholics Anonymous, that I didn't have to just endorse someone else's alcoholism. Completely delusional and just off the track. It was OK for me to say, like, you know, we may want to take a look at this 'cause it doesn't really seem to match up with

that wonderful stuff you shared in the meeting the other day.

To be able to be truthful with somebody else.

What do I get? What does it help me? You know, it's who. How does it help me? That was what I want to know in the beginning. Well, the accountability that my sponsor told me about when I started sponsoring other men really came to life. Because if I'm going to ask them to go down to the detox, guess what? Whether I want to go or not, I'm going to the detox tomorrow night.

I can tell you right now this is a busy weekend. I don't particularly want to go to detox tomorrow,

but I'll be there anyway because the guys I sponsor said show me how you do this. I said well we go to detox on the 4th Sunday of the month and the 5th Sunday of the month after our Home group. I don't want to go. Guess what holds me accountable to the program of action. Holds me accountable to do what I said I would do because I'm asking them, because they've asked for help

to do what they say they're going to do. You know, the other deal is, is my life is really rich today

because of sponsorship.

Having a sponsor is one thing, but being a sponsor is a completely different deal. You know, what's that? That old adage, you know, you got to give it away to keep it. You can't keep it unless you give it away, man. Carrying this message straight out of the pages of the big book to another alcoholic. And I've read with lots of drunks, I've sat down and started getting into this process with lots of guys. Not all of them have stuck. Some of them went to different sponsors. Some of them got drunk, some of them went to prison. Some of them have left states. You know,

I don't know what it's done is it has enriched my own recovery. It has strengthened the ideas found in the basic text within me. You know, I've talked to teachers and the people that teach things

know it. They just know it because they're teaching it on a regular basis. Being a sponsor is involves a principle that when I give it to you, I get I get a lot more back in return.

I

I love what was said about general service and I love all that stuff

in our area. I see a lot of people who are really willing

because they think it's prestigious to be involved in that stuff.

But you don't see them at the detox, you don't see them reading with guys, you don't see them doing that stuff.

And you know, to each their own and we're all going to have different experiences and we all need different things. And I believe there's a loving God that will guide us in this process. But being a sponsor has done more to

entrench the belief in me that this program works when I have my own experience. I started to wane on it. I got about 5-6 months in and nobody I was working with was staying sober just like, just like what Bill talked about. That's about as close to relating as Bill and I as it'll get. But I could relate. No one was staying sober and no one was staying sober. And I started to get discouraged and I thought maybe I I better go get busy doing other things.

I walked into a meeting one night and it was on the 10th tradition in a meeting that didn't even believe in the tradition. So I'm not really sure why they had people present on them

and I presented on the 10th tradition and I didn't make any friends. I'll tell you that. People stormed out of the meeting. Some of the people in treatment left.

It was kind of an ugly bloodbath deal, really. Love and tolerance of others was not yet my code. Your code, not mine. And there was a guy that I met that night and he was curled up in the fetal position crying. It was like his fourth day in this facility. That brought the people over to the meeting. And

Long story short, he came to find me and he asked me to sponsor him. And I thought, sure enough, this guy is not going to make it. This guy is a dead man. His roommate in treatment, I was also sponsoring him. And he told me this guy's not going to make it. He's doing this, this and this. And I said, yeah, well, that's probably right. You know, that's it's not online. With rigorous honesty. He probably won't stay sober.

The guy that told me that ended up going to prison for four years because he got drunk and got into a domestic situation. And this guy

did what I had told him I did. He did what I asked him to do. He actually wrote the inventory. He actually, I mean, he at this point, my life is getting better and I'm out. Do I got to do a little travel and I'm out of state and he's calling me up saying you need to get back here. We need to do my fist step. We need to do my fist up. And I watched this absolutely destroyed human being

turn into one of the most powerful examples of Alcoholics Anonymous I've ever seen. Of course I'm biased but but he has an integrity and AI just I don't even know how to describe it. He changed. I seen someone change. It wasn't just I changed here. I witnessed God used me to help another human being and I realized I had a purpose

that I couldn't just pretend to have, that I really had a purpose. I really had a way that I could I could be of service to God and the people about me. The words on the pages of the book came to life and I knew that we could recover from alcoholism if we would just work the program.

Not because of my experience, because like I said, you know, I'm completely insane at times, so I could have just fabricated it all. But when I seen someone else do the steps and seen someone else come to life, I knew it was real. I knew it was real. I knew that this program worked and and

I seem to be less inclined to become disillusioned with Alcoholics Anonymous

if I'm working with others, if I'm sitting down and sponsoring men in this program. Because it's real easy if you just go to meetings or even from my limited experience in the service structure, if you're just involved with that, to get disillusioned Because we fight and we're humans. And what I thought was a beautiful spiritual fellowship can oftentimes be a bunch of sharks who aren't exactly well.

Those of you that don't believe that, get a divorce. Let me know how it goes

separate from someone who you've been dating in A and let me know how it goes.

But when I see the hand of God move in another man's life, to quote the book, which which I just, that's another thing that that I've gotten from sponsoring a lot of people. I just, I'll talk and things from the book will just come out. I, I'm not a page quoter. I can't tell you what page they come from, but I, I just ideas from the book, just, I just have them because I've read with a lot of guys. I've read the book a lot, not sitting around trying to figure it out, but reading with a guy who's trying to not drink.

You know, totally different deal.

It has

enrich my life,

you know, and more than that, we love to talk about gratitude in our meetings, right? You know, open topic, which I don't make it too much of those anymore for a reason, because I'm too mean at times.

And well, let's talk about gratitude. I'm thankful for this. I'm thankful for this. I'm thankful, I'm so grateful, I'm so grateful. I'm so grateful. You know, I've experienced gratitude by by giving my hand to another person. I've experienced gratitude by taking time out of my busy life that God gave me. God gave me a real full life

and I can't forget that. Part of that richness in my life is because I've been just

adamant about shaking the newcomers hand and trying to sit down with them and give them away.

Give to them what was given to me. You know, someone who's had the bona fide spiritual awakening or spiritual experience that the big book talks about. You don't have to convince them to sponsor other people. That's all you want to do is just give it to somebody else because it's the coolest thing I've ever done. And I have stuck things in my arm and I have drank things that that will do weird stuff to your consciousness.

Seeing someone else come to life is still the coolest thing I've ever seen. It is the coolest thing that any of us I think will ever get to experience. Because I'm not doing the help. I couldn't even help myself. But but I'm putting myself in a position to be helpful. I'm putting myself in a position to be used by whatever this power in the universe is called. Man, that's a good deal.

So with that.

Which question are we on?

How does it help you? Is that what's going around? OK, I don't have a thing in my table anymore. So, OK, how it is being a sponsor help you.

You know, when I first got through the steps and you know, my sponsor said, OK, now you will start to raise your hand and start to help people and, you know, start sponsoring. And I was terrified. I had so much fear surrounding it. Like I somebody would ask for my number and I give it to him and I pray they wouldn't call.

Was like, oh please don't let this person call. I'm gonna have to help them. I don't know what to say. I don't know what to do,

you know? What if I kill them? What if I say the wrong thing? What if they drink again? It's all my fault. I mean, I was just terrified. And then I realized that it wasn't my responsibility. My responsibility was just to be there

and then if you have a big book between you, it's between them and the words and it has nothing to do with me. One thing that my sponsor told me recently was Kelly, you're the only one that's responsible for your sobriety.

If you lay it on my shoulders,

I will fail.

You're the only one that's responsible for your sobriety.

And

that really hit home for me. She, you know, she made it very clear that it was my responsibility to do these things, that she can make suggestions, that I can read the book all I want, but if I don't take the responsibility to take the action, it was pointless.

But so how does being a sponsor help me? I think as we all know, it gets us out of us.

When I'm out there working with another woman,

I'm not thinking about how I'm going to fix my relationship or how I'm going to get the promotion at work or how I'm going to balance the checkbook or whatever. You know, I'm there with them and I'm present to them and therefore I'm not thinking about me and how I need to fix me and all the things that are wrong in my life.

Another way that being a sponsor helps me is like Dustin said it, it ingrains these principles in me. It makes me accountable to do the work. You know, if I'm not, like I said, I want to, I expect a sponsor to grow in front of me. If I'm not growing in front of my sponsese,

that's kind of a ridiculous,

but so it keeps me accountable to do those things. It it keeps me accountable to my Home group because I say this is my Home group. This is where I'll be every week. You know, I would love to see you there, you know, so that that means I better be there if I'm expecting them to be there.

You know, I, I never give my sponsee's advice. I never make a suggestion that I don't do myself.

Umm, you know, it's funny because, you know, we're not all well here. And I was getting advice from this lady

at one point. I was asking her questions, I was asking her for advice. And she'd give me some advice and I'd try it and I'd call her back and I'd be like, it didn't work. And she'd be like, gosh, yeah, it never worked for me either. I'm just like, then why are you telling me to do this? Like I was very frustrating, but you know, I

but she was there to help and, and she did a wonderful job of that. And some of the advice she did give me did work, you know, and it didn't work for her, but it did work for me. So you just never know what what's going to come through you. But like Dustin said, it's not about what

It doesn't rest on us. It's not from us. It's through us as sponsors. And it wasn't from my sponsor, it was through my sponsor.

And, and I think that's just such a cool deal.

Umm, you know, and it does keep us busy. Like Dustin said, he, we live a extremely full life. We're extremely busy. It's not always convenient. It's not always the thing that I want to do. You know, I, I'm at home, I work from home, by the way. So, you know, there's days where I, I don't have to get out of my pajamas and I don't necessarily want to. And my sponsor will call me and she'll be like Kelly, you know, can you come by today? I have some free time from 3:00 to 5:00. You know, I could really use, you know, some help on this and this and this.

And I'm just like, gosh, you know, I've got all this crap to do. There's dirty dishes in the sink. There's laundry to be done. You know, I haven't seen my husband in like a week now, you know,

really, you know, but, and I don't say that to her. I say, yeah, sure, you know, 3:00 I'll be there. Okay, sounds good. You know, and and we live a very, very busy life.

You know, it was six months into our relationship before I think we ever actually had a date. Yeah, No, it's just,

it's very, very busy, but it keeps us out of us. It keeps me out of me. And and I think that's the greatest gift that that it gives me. Thanks.

When is someone ready to be a sponsor?

The very simply the way I was taught is, uh,

well, you know what? I'm going to. I'm going to go to it

if you go to

right after the the infamous promises on page 84 in the big book.

It said that they will always materialize if we work for them. This thought brings us to step 10, which suggests we continue to take personal inventory and continue to set right any new mistakes as we go along. We vigorously commence this way of living as we cleaned up the past. You know, the deal is once I, once I, I got up into the 9th step and I actually started knocking on doors and making phone calls and, and, and doing my best to make a first approach.

That was when, you know, my sponsor sat me down and he said, well, it's time to go help people,

buddy,

you need to go to a meeting. You got to have a year to sponsor anybody. I don't have a year of sobriety.

And

he pointed this chunk of the book out and we talked about it at length. And as I'm out making amends, I'm starting to live a life, this way of life, this way of living, starting to do 10. As I go through my day, as I go through my day, I continue to watch for I'm selfish, I'm dishonest, I'm self seeking, I'm frightened. I start to apply the principles of of the first nine steps up into my daily life

and then, you know, I'm prayer and meditation. I'm seeking a deeper relationship with God. I'm seeking that conscious contact with God. I used to think when it talks about that part that a man properly armed with facts about himself in this solution, that the solution was the big book. And what I found is that's not the solution. The solution is God, very plain simply, God. I don't, I don't care what you call it. I don't, it doesn't

don't even care. The solution is God, so

I need to seek that power.

Unfortunately, I can't just sit around and bask in the glory of my experience

because I'm selfish, self-centered by nature, and we talked about going out and helping somebody else.

So I have to start doing this stuff as I get to that point. So as I'm making amends, I'm starting to live life in 1011 and 12,

and that's a plain and simple thing. Well, how long does that take? I can, I can tell you honestly of the guys that I've sponsored that have stuck. We got through the step process on an average of 60 days from the day we met.

They were out making amends, they were working with prayer, meditation, they were doing that stuff. And I come from a school of thought that that's as it should be.

I have friends that think that's way too long.

The steps were never intended to be a tedious, long drawn out process.

We can always go back through the steps. The line of sponsorship I'm in, we work and rework the 12 steps. Why? Because selfishness, Self centeredness still the root of my problem. I'm still, I'm still a a a victim to the delusion that I'm right.

So the short answer to this stuff is as I get through the first run, through the through the amends, I need to start being willing to be helpful.

Now people say you can't sponsor for a year. That guy I told you about who's a completely transformed human being. I mean, I seen him the other day kneeling down and hugging his his two little girls that he was absolutely terrified to be around prior to work in the steps.

If that was the rule, that guy would be a dead man

by his own words. Not by my opinion, by his own words. He was going around looking for sponsors down in the Twin Cities. I was still living up an hour N he came and tracked me down because of what he had heard me share on the 10th tradition. He tracked me down, asked me to sponsor him. I was like 6 months sober. If I would have said I can't sponsor you until I'm a year, I don't know if he'd be dead or not. He thinks he would.

Maybe God would have provided someone else, but God provided me and he asked me

and I would. I just said yes and we sat down, started going through that process. It's got nothing to do with time. I don't need to shoulder the entire responsibilities of that human being. That is not my job. My job is literally to to provide an adequate presentation of the 12 steps. I don't care if you like the meal. I don't care if you want to eat it, but that is the deal. This is our 12 steps. This is our program. It's the only program of recovery we got

and I know it. It's sucks,

you know, let's be honest here, paying back all the money is not fun, but the promises that come true as a result of making the approaches on my amends are worth it. So buddy, you need to go help somebody else. Once we get to this process, it's time. Now I've sponsored guys who nobody really started asking them to sponsor them until they were a year, year and a half sober.

They were willing the whole time. They carried the message into the detoxes and the jails and all that stuff.

But if you're getting through the steps, it says in the 12th step, having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we try to carry this message.

That's the deal. Once you get up to that point, it's time to move. And once I get into the 9th step, it's time to start doing that. And it's a

varying opinions on that. You know, there's varying opinions on when we start sponsoring.

But, and I'm I'm sure that Paul could get you in touch with the history, but our history is the guys that were barely sober at all were out going to the hospitals and the train stations and dragging drunks off the bar stools. And they were immediately into 12 step work. They were brought through the steps rapidly. And I think we lost that in the fellowship. I think we've lost that. It's like you're going to die if you work a four step too soon. Never seen that happen.

I've seen people go to prison and people drink and people who are going to die any day now because they would not write a four step or because they waited too long.

So the responsibility, I believe, as a member of Alcoholics Anonymous is to know our history.

You know, I don't think when they said if you want what we have, they meant Joe Blow talking about his trailer hitch across the table. I think they meant it in the the way that a textbook would outline it. If you want what we have, as in the writers of this book who are describing to you this experience, then you'll do what we did rapidly.

Use phrases like next at once, immediately

now

so the deal isn't get well and then go help somebody see because I thought I was going to get well and then I would be a service. The deal out of my experience is if I go help others, I start to get well. If I sit around in these rooms and try to just get my share down, I'm a dead man walking. I'm a dead man walking. I I need to be in action. How can I help you?

How can I help you

so with that?

Well, I think Dustin covered that very well. I am going to share one quick thing. I have a sponsor right now who is, she's through the stuff. She's making amends like a mad woman, but she's under the restriction of being in a halfway house. And so she can only talk on the phone like three times a day for 10 minutes at a time. You know, she can only go to minimal meetings and it's very hard for her to,

you know, raise her hand for sponsorship. She just cannot take on that responsibility right now.

And it was funny because what I got to see happen was it's the same woman who's going through this custody battle and she got very, very sick. She went like two weeks of thinking all about her and she got very, very sick. And she was just fighting and fighting and fighting. Like I had seen her just change rapidly. And then I just saw her fall apart and

I brought her to a meeting the other night. And the speaker, you know, very clearly was talking about how,

you know, I stopped fighting and I help others. And that's how I stopped fighting. And it's just the light went on and she's like, Oh my God, that's exactly what I needed to hear. You've been telling me that for a week. And so I talked to her today and she's like, you know, I've been, I've been trying to help out a lot lately. And I wake up every morning and I see how I can help. And I just, you know, I do the chores around the house and I've been, you know, helping the other girls and just listening. And, you know, I, I'm, I've stopped fighting and she's like, and everything's OK,

you know, And it was so cool. I was just like,

that's so cool. It was so neat. And it, you know, she had an experience with that. And even though she wasn't able to sponsor anybody, she was able to be of service to the women in her house and and get through that really, really tough time.

But the next question we have here are what are the responsibilities? Is that the one and what are the responsibilities of a sponsor? And I think the,

the biggest responsibility we have is to be available.

If I'm not available to sponsor you or if I'm saying, oh, next week or, you know, tomorrow, oh, sorry, I can't do it today, tomorrow, next week, blah, blah, blah. This person's not going to. They're going to get drunk before I ever get to him.

I think that is one of our biggest responsibilities is to be there and to be responsible to that person and to be there when we say we're going to be there.

I think the other responsibility we have, like I stated before, is to

do what we're asking them to do, to continue to stay accountable to ourselves so that we're doing what we're asking them to do. So that I've done a four step and I've done a fifth step and I'm continuing, continuing to take personal inventory and I'm praying and meditating on a regular basis. And I'm involved in my Home group and I'm being of service. And, you know, all these things that

that are on this spiritual path that we're on. If I'm not doing that, they're sure as heck not going to do that. You know, they're like, well, you're not doing it, why do I have to do it? So I think that as well as a huge responsibility of us, but you know, it's up to them to take the action. You know, all we can do is show them the way.

You know, I can't, I can't make anybody do anything. And it's,

it's discouraging at times. You know, I went to my sponsor not too long ago and I was like, why, why aren't these women doing what, what we do here? Like nobody's sticking. You know, they'll, they'll look like they're ready. You know, they're, they're eager, they want to do it all, blah, blah, blah. You know, and then you ask them to do something and they won't do it. And they have every excuse in the book not to do it.

And she said, Kelly, are you sober today?

And I said, yeah. And she said that's all that matters.

And, and you know, that was huge because I, I do get discouraged at times. You know, when I came in, I was ready. I, I didn't care what you told me to do. You you could have told me to eat.

Who knows what. I'm not even gonna say what just went through my head and I probably would have done it. You know, I I didn't care. I wanted to get better. I was so sick of being me that I could have cared less what you told me to do as long as I didn't have to be the way I was anymore. And, you know, and I just did it, you know, it didn't matter what they said. I just did it. I was like, OK, no questions asked. Sure. Great. Sounds good. Let's let's do this. What's next? What's next? What's next?

And it was just very, very recently that I got a girl into my life that is the same way. She's always like, what's next? What's next, What's next? We got to amends and she's making amends like a mad woman. And I can't believe it. I'm like,

you made amends to your PO for real? Like, what did he say? Yeah. I mean, it's just the coolest thing to see and

you know, and she and she's excited about it and, and that wouldn't have happened if I wouldn't have stayed responsible to this program and to this action into our primary purpose. I want to be able to see that. And she made it. She may not be here today.

So I, I think that's our greatest responsibility is to, is to be here. So thanks.

If I'm going to ask a guy to not only work these 12 steps and to, to get informed about the traditions and why that's important and, and, and to take a look at service and, and to do this stuff. If I'm going to ask a guy of that and then ask him to practice these principles in all of his affairs,

I think it's important that I invite them into my life enough for them to see how I'm actually doing with that.

In the beginning, it's pretty brass tacks. We're going to go through the big book. I'm not your buddy. I'm not your friend. You want to call? We're going to talk about the book,

you know, it's just the way it is because that's the way it was with me. I didn't need a friend. I needed a guide. I didn't need someone to sit there and tell me what I needed to do. I needed someone to show me how to get better in Alcoholics Anonymous,

but you become joined in a way that I don't know of any other way to do it. You become joined

in just this relationship that I didn't even know I could have with another man

by working that process together, by going through it. And the guys in my life that I sponsor today are invited into my home. A joke from Edward, who's here today is my sponsor, invited me into his life and showed me how to live because I'm a human being and I make mistakes and I get angry and he's seen that. You know, my responsibility in the beginning, I believe, is to be a rock, is to be a foundation, is to be a man with a real answer like the big book says. But as we

through the step process, my role starts to shift a little bit and it becomes about responsibility, but it also becomes about showing that person my flaws, about showing that person the mistakes that I still make about being being free enough in my life to show them the warts. Because if I don't, I'm going to set an unrealistic expectation about what Alcoholics Anonymous is. I am going to, I'm going to set an example that is out of some sort of some sort of

pride or this false humility or

this, I'm going to set up a life that is different than what's actually going on. And I think I got to be willing to let that person come in and see me make mistakes and to share those mistakes with them. In the beginning. I ought not do that. I talked to the guys I sponsor and asked them if it's OK to share these experiences anonymously, but and they said yes. A guy I sponsor, like I said, was facing charges and all this stuff and, and he's year in change sober and he's living with his, his dad at the time and he's getting

out of there and he's going through early sobriety. Fun stuff, you know,

and he's telling the guys that he's sponsoring this stuff. He's telling them when they, like within the first couple weeks of working together, how screwed up his life is. He's not being a man with a real answer. He's talking about getting kicked out. He's facing charges. He's doing all this. And guess what? That guy was like, you know what? I think I need to get a different sponsor.

See, but he didn't need to get a different sponsor because because this guy had had the spiritual awakening. He no longer obsessed about drinking. He was a changed person. He just had drama in his life that wasn't that newcomers fault for run into a different guy. I would have two of my sponsors, like my wife's completely screwed here, let me help you. I ran too. But see, we weren't here for all that external stuff. We've got one primary purpose.

Our primary purpose is to deal with alcoholism and how to get free and clear of that.

And if a man's got an experience with the 12 steps and he can transmit that to somebody else by way of experience,

he's got all he needs to be a sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous. He doesn't need to have his entire life in cute little boxes all in a row.

He just needs to have a way out,

and you know that my responsibilities are

initially an adequate representation of the 12 steps, Plain and simple. If we're not going through the steps, it's not sponsorship. That's my opinion, and it's a pretty good one

because that's all we do here.

That's the solution. That's the program of recovery. You can disagree all you want,

but I got friends who didn't help me get sober. When I was drinking. I had all sorts of friends. I didn't need a friend. I needed a guy. I needed someone to show me this. That's my responsibility. If I don't know the book, if I don't know the traditions, if I don't know the concepts, it's my responsibility to know that stuff

because this person is willing to put their life in my hands. It's not my hands. It's God's responsibility to carry that person through. But it's my responsibility to be as informed as I can be, to have real experience with this stuff. It's my responsibility.

I'm not a perfect. I'm not and I'm not one to be

to feign humility to pretend with these guys. I just try to be as honest as I can't. Some of them buy the whole package, some of them don't. Not my deal. There's guys that actually are paying back the money. Hard to believe there's guys that that are actually willing to show up at service commitments and be of of help to new guys and detoxes and stuff on a regular basis. Hard to believe. There's guys that are interested in knowing what our traditions are in our concepts and involve to be, you know, willing to be involved in general service.

It's hard to believe. And there's other guys that are like, I got mine

and then they're they're just going to have theirs. And you know what? I see them have theirs and I get to see a reflection, like I said, of my good ideas playing out in other people. I get to see what happens when I take what I want and leave the rest. I get to see what happens when I take from a A and don't give back to the people walking in the door.

Works for me.

My responsibility is to tell them the truth. They've had enough people try to soften it up for him.

I don't want to write inventory. You don't have to. You'll die probably if you're a real alcoholic. Unless you want to find some other way, then go find some other way. I lay before it. We even sit down to read. I lay out what we're going to do, what sponsorships going to look like. Yes, we're going to go through the steps. Yes, you're going to show up my Home group. Yes, we're going to do this. You're, you know, I don't care where you do your fist up, but I want to hear it too.

And so say, well, you can't say that. Why do it all the time? I say it just fine. It works. They're asking for what I have. If they want what I have, I'm going to tell them what I do. If they don't like it, they're free to go somewhere else. I'm not territorial. I don't own my pigeons or my babies or any of this absurd stuff.

They're just guys that God brought in my life. He just brought him in and I'll just do what I can. They don't like it. They're free to go elsewhere. And I'm not afraid to tell guys, you know what? You're not working the program. You're not involved in the fellowship. You're not doing what you said you were going to do. And we sat down and line this deal out. When I explained to you from the best of my knowledge what any lengths was going to look like, you're not doing it. So I'm going to ask you to do one of two things.

Either start doing it like you said you were going to, or, you know, go find a different sponsor. It's not firing a sponsor.

What it is, is being realistic. You're not doing Alcoholics Anonymous. And if you drink again, which I think you're going to, I want you to know deep in your heart that you didn't do a A, that you were doing something else. You were doing a, a light or half strength or half measures or whatever. I want you to know that. And I don't want you to know that to be cruel. I want you to know that because when you drink again, there will still be an answer for you here. You won't be like me crying because a A doesn't work