Workshop titled "The Big Book experience" in Dundee, Scotland

good evening my name is Scott Lee and I'm a very grateful alcoholic
wow what a fabulous weekend this is meant for me
I don't believe it's possible to give without receiving I don't believe it's possible to receive without giving I believe that spiritual law let's have a few moments of silence one more time
hi I'm asking not to read along just for information I'm on page one fifty three but don't just just listen if you would
years ago in nineteen thirty five one of our number made a journey to a certain western city
from a business standpoint his trip came off badly have you been successful in his enterprise he would've been selling his feet financially which at the time same vitally important but as venture wound up in a lawsuit and bogged down completely the proceeding was shot through with much hard feeling and controversy bitterly discouraged he found himself in a strange place discredited almost broke still physically weakened sober but a few months he saw that his predicament was dangerous he wanted so much to talk with someone about whom one dismal afternoon he paced hotel lobby wondering out his bill was to be paid at one of the rooms to the glass covered directory of local churches down the lobby a door opened on a tractor bar he could see the gay crowd inside in there he would find companionship and release unless he took some drinks he might not have the courage to scrape an acquaintance and would have a lonely weekend of course he couldn't drink but why not sit hopefully at a table a bottle of ginger ale before him after all he had he not been sober six months now
happy could handle say three drinks no more fear gripped him
he was on thin ice again it was the old insidious insanity that first drink with a shiver he turned away and walked down the lobby to the church directory music engage chatter still floated to him from the bar but what about his responsibilities his family and the man who would die because they would not know how to get well yes those other alcoholics there must be many such in this town he would phone a clergyman
his sanity returned any thank god selecting a church at random from the directory he stepped into the booth and lifted the receiver
and reached into his pocket
and pulled out a nickel
which in nineteen thirty five was the price of a telephone call and he made the call that lead him to his meeting with Dr Bob and who's to say that the nickel that you hold in your hand right this second is not the very Nicolette bill made that call with
thank you Scott
what a moments in our history
if if you're alive so hung in the balance it was me
you made a lot of trouble
I have been in the bar
but thank god for bill Wilson and thank god for his dedication to helping other alcoholics
chapter
seven working with others
this is practical experience shows that nothing so much insures immunity from drinking is intensive work with other alcoholics it works were other activities fail
I believe it works were all other activities fail
what I am absolutely insane
and I am getting close to the return of the obsession to drink
and I'm spinning in my head and my emotions are put the screws to me
reading spiritual literature doesn't seem to help and to pass that calling my sponsor doesn't seem to help because he says hearing ang ang and I mean I I can't hear him I don't know what he's saying
going to a meeting doesn't help because I can't hear I can't hear you because I'm too focused on me
the only thing that seems to help but those moments just I need something
if I can't drink that I need something else that will relieve me of the bondage of self
and that's what it says it intensive work with other alcoholics works for all of their activities failed works would pray in fails
it works we're going to meetings fails it works when calling your sponsor fails works when getting laid fails it works when buying a new car fails it works when it works when getting a raise at work fails it works for other all other activities fail
I am of the alcoholic in the bill Wilson variety
when I quit drinking I I suffer from alcoholism I am an everyday member of Alcoholics Anonymous because of the membership requirement in the long form is originally written in the third tradition which said that membership should include all who suffer from alcohol is
I do the things that I do in Alcoholics Anonymous because if I don't I begin to suffer from alcoholism
but when I suffer from alcoholism often I don't know it often it looks like I'm fine but you are really screwed up all of the sudden
and so I do certain things you know call it turns to treat that all holders of
in when Mike my first four years of sobriety I stayed sober
without really much
Morgan the step side made some efforts to do some some inventory work but it wasn't really what it talks about the book I had never I I consequently I could not carry out or even come close to being god's guy it was too wrapped up in me I I had no idea of the what was it like to carry out this decision and step three consequently I suffered from deep depressions on a regular basis even going to fifteen to twenty meetings a week doing two hospital institution meetings a week being on every comedian Alcoholics Anonymous having in calling the sponsor praying every day and I still fell into depression from time to time
and I I think I survived that period of time through a lot about a lot of it tends to work with a lot of other alcoholics it was slow study
I'm telling you for a long time I didn't have a clue why these old timers are hammering me to do service in a hammering me to go back into the detox and try to help the newer people in to go into the into the prison and go on twelve step calls I don't get it yeah I thought it was some kind of pyramid multi level marketing thing of A. A. or something you know like they're trying to the pope up their membership by getting little clones like me to go out and try to get newcomers or something I have no idea why they're pushing me to do twelve step work
but I'm doing it because I'm doing everything they asked me to do
and one one day I come home one evening I come home at night I've been to two meetings that day
I called my sponsor that day I know I prayed that day and I'm sitting on the sofa and I'm sinking into a deep depression
I don't just get depressed
I drink of my emotions like I drank liquor you know I get into it I just get in I mean I just the wall around it and I you know I just really get into it and I'm sitting on the sofa and sinking into this depression deeply pondering my life
I don't know I you know I have never deeply pondered all my life joyously I
hi I just never I have never I've never said to myself I'm just going to go think about me for a few minutes and came away feeling like happy joyous and free it's always I come away just thinking
what's the use you know it's it's always that way it is so important in my life for the more I pondered the bleaker it looks and I'm still a victim of the delusion that we talked about earlier the delusion that I can rest happiness and satisfaction of this world by managing well which you don't that means it means I think I can think my way out of the depression if you've ever tried that it's like trying to dig your way out of the hole you just go deeper and deeper and deeper and the more I ponder my life the worse it looks in no time at all I realize that the job I have is going no where how they're taking advantage of me the relationship by just broke up I'll never find another one I'm going to gripe grow old in the loan nobody's ever going to love it's just it's just you know what I mean just sinking into the you know you start imagining that doesn't matter because I probably have cancer anyway
right
that's where I go and I I didn't and you know it that's funny today but I'll tell you something when you're in the middle of that it's bad it's really bad I got so depressed so depressed that I felt like I would wait a thousand pounds can you if you could I don't know if you've never had this depression you will not understand this but I would get physically debilitated almost like I can't get off the sofa as if I just wait however as if everything is saying he
it's horrible it's awful in in you know what I was drinking self pity in depression wasn't too bad with a bottle of vodka but sober it's hideous
and I don't like it really I'm just scared and I don't know where my breaking point is where I'm going to frantically try to drink something or take something to make myself get out of this and I'm sitting on the shelf and I'm scared so I say a little prayer because I don't know what else to do I just said god help me
but I looked at the clock
it's about ten o'clock it's it's about ten minutes till ten at night and there isn't any a meeting at ten fifteen not too far from my apartment up on the strip in Las Vegas is called between the show's group
and I thought to myself if I could just get there and get to that meeting maybe all here so that maybe something would happen to snap me out of this a business
and somehow I don't know maybe through god's grace I I must hold myself off of that so for who I've I was hard to get up but I shuffled out to my car like a mole when I got in the car and I drove up to the meeting there was a there was a parking space right in front of the door to the chapel it was underneath this big bill Billboard on the strip where they do advertising right and that's where all the pigeons hang out so by parking under there I'm going to get my car decorated by the pigeons while I'm in the meeting which will better fit my mood I'm sure
so according to the Billboard like I'm asking for it you know I like to make my car fuel like always fuel you know
then I go into the meeting and I'm sitting in the back of the meeting and I can't hear anything
because everything is so distant because I'm so locked up in myself but what's going on in the meeting is like music in a doctor's office it's so distant it nothing gets through to me and it's like this for a week way back deep inside myself as I look out at the meeting if I I don't like what I see because what I see is a room full of people that are obviously doing a lot better than I
a P. O. room full of people that are great for this subject the meeting was gratitude only
and I just ended a relationship you know and I mean everything was it some kind of cosmic joke when you end a relationship all of a sudden you're in a world of happy couples what's that about you know where does that come from it it's like one of those meetings right in noticed it's horrible and I can't hear nothing
it
since the cross for me in the meeting is a guy
who's in really bad shape he's coming off a drunk and he's sitting there as if grabbing himself like he wants to jump out of the skin is rocking back and forth like he can't take it and then he can't he can't even sit still gets up and he's pacing back and forth like a caged billable behind me
and then there's the door right there to the bathrooms in there periodically you can hearing meetings in there with dry heaving and you know so then I I have a lot of problems here I'm trying to figure out and this guy is annoying the crap out of me I mean I'm trying to I'm trying to figure this stuff
the meeting is over it has not helped me
hi I'm probably worse I I stayed after the meeting to help this guy Charlie Parker who's the secretary the meeting and I'm going to help him with the trash and set up the chairs and clean up the room for the chapel so Charlie and I are the last two guys to leave the meeting and Charlie's on his way to work he works in the store the graveyard shift at one of the casino so he has to go right to work and we're standing on the front door the of this chapel he's locked up and we look over in the glory that was coming off the drunk is laying on the ground in front of my car in a fetal position now I'm going to have to step over him to go home and ponder my life more deeply
which
which I mean barriers to tell you I probably would have done except Charlie's there and Charlie says to me are you going to help this guy and I'm looking at this guy don't look at Charlie at Charlie's got a big mouth if I don't help this guy he's gonna tell everybody in a what a lousy member of Alcoholics Anonymous he'll tell my sponsor he'll tell the people my always you know he's a he's a big mouth one of those people
and I'm looking to try to look at this guy don't wanna help discredit go over to the guy in he PT's hands city smells and I got to put him in my car and I start to talk to him in any cities in bad shape he's afraid he's going to have a seizure
and it had seizures before and I don't know and I said it doesn't have any medical insurance and he has no money and it was a time in Las Vegas before they open the detox that we have now where there was a period of a couple years that if you didn't have medical install specialization medical insurance and you didn't have any money and you need a medical detox you were in a lot of trouble there was no place to go
in what we used to do in those days tonight I'm grateful for that I've had this experience of the old to the tip of the last generation is that we would often sit with guys two guys in a shift for maybe four five six hours and we give them a shot of vodka with orange juice about every hour hour and a half just to keep him from going into seizures and sometimes they go to seizures anyway right funny they just start flopping around better fact back in those days people didn't even think much of that I remember I remember being in a meeting and some guy went into a convulsion in the meeting somebody reached over stucco wall but the guy's mouth and kept on sharing they didn't even stop the meeting was another day I don't think it happens so often right it was it was like at least once or twice a week you'd be in a meeting and some got stark flopping around on the floor was happened all the time now now it'll stop and meeting people wring their hands over god's got cold
we did those days it was just yeah it was part of our part of getting sober
so
so I can't say what the guy round the clock because I get to get up for work in the morning and I don't have anybody to sit you're supposed to do it with another person
and I don't know what to do with this guy there's only one thing left to do
there's a county hospital in Las Vegas and back in those days because they got certain government funding they were required to take a certain amount of ingenuity patience off the street and I'd been down there before with guys and I'll tell you some it was tedious they treat you like a red headed step child you know they would they would they know really
they treat you they they treat you like like we don't we don't want to treat you we would rather we would rather deal with legitimately sick people rather than you self induced alcoholics we're probably going to be back here in three weeks anyway and that was their attitude so what would happen if you go down there with guys and they would often make you sit in the waiting room for five or six hours until they had nothing else to do it out of boredom they take the alcoholic and I know what's coming so I get this guy smelly guy in my car right I don't go down there and I know I'm going to be there all night and I'm in the car and I'm thinking to myself you know isn't it enough that my life is crap I gotta do this too doesn't anybody else up up to the plate in a except me the key word is me right
the school
Hey in this to the guy just drive in and we get down there we check into the emergency room and we signed up on the paper and we're sitting in the in the waiting room and I'm talking to the guy into a tail weird this was people nowadays in the states can't believe this but she used to be able to smoke cigarettes in a hospital waiting rooms years ago and I'm giving cigarettes any smoke in and he's he's like coming apart at the seams and I there was a vending machine there and I go to the vending machine to get these little cans of orange juice and I take a we didn't have any honey because he's to give guys sports you said honey your choosing Caro syrup to stabilize their blood sugar fluctuations so I went to the coffee thing and I got your regular sugar and put it into words you should give it to the guy and you try to keep it down he's sitting there and it's just coming apart
and he starts to tell me about himself
and he starts to tell me about the shame
in the remorse
did he feels for the things he did to the to the people who loved him
and he said to me that he couldn't even seem to drink it away anymore
and then he told me that for some time he's been wishing he could kill himself and just get it over with and then he really hopes me he's he says to me
he says I don't know why you're wasting time with me
I'm not like you you see I always drink and I always drink again
and he's telling me about me
and somewhere in the wee hours of the morning I fell in love with that guy
not for any logical reason he can't get me a better job there's nothing he can do for me chances are he's not even going to stay sober and give me some kind of credit for something you know he can't do anything for me except
did he suffered from alcoholism exactly like I suffered from alcoholism and I fell in love with him
and it was years later that what I realized is that I fell in love with the me that is in him
apart and an aspect of me that I could never love directly and never accept directly
but I could love it and accepted in him
and I know I could love it I I had a therapist one time
who was big on learning to love yourself and she used to tell me you gotta love yourself and
I love myself
she gave me these positive affirmations you know supposed to stand in front of a mirror and look myself in the eye and repeat over and over god loves me god forgives me god accepts me I love me I forgive me except me god loves me good for you gives me god accepts me well I Love Me I got I got a bunch of crap I just stood there told a planet blew up saying that over and over again and it would not have changed how I felt about myself
but somehow in loving and caring unconditionally about people that are like me
something between me and me started to change
I didn't know that that was happening and they eventually they checked this guy in there
they gave him bad
and I'm driving home in the Sun starting to come up and I'm not worried about going to work being tired
I'm not worried about anything
but I'm Cryin
and I'm crying not because I'm depressed I'm crying because I don't know what my whole life I ever felt more right
more complete
more useful I felt the presence of god move into that car I didn't ask him to come in
but I think what happened is there was enough of me out of the way that something else showed up in my life there's a coveted in Oklahoma synonymous that when two or more of us show up together for the purpose recovery something will be in the midst and something was in the midst between me and this guy something showed up
yeah I don't know if it was god or if it was the spirit of love for this other drug but I know I drove home that morning and I felt better than I'd ever felt
in I understood finally why these old timers were hammering me
to work with others and hammering me to go to the hospitals and institutions and hammering me and pushing me to do twelve step work because they knew something about me that I didn't know
they knew that even the self obsessed self concerned self absorbed narcissistic depressive that I was that if I stayed in that venue long enough one day something would happen
and what happened is you you could probably hear it in Scotland this loud pop is my head came out of my **** and I actually appeared here
and that's really what happened is I got relieved of the bondage of self
through help in this other guy
and I felt as good that morning driving home as I felt on the very best day of my drinking
when when five shots of whiskey really worked I felt that free that complete and not write about myself you know I knew at that moment the this was my primary purpose that this was what I was divinely crafted to do
was to help people that are just like me
I don't know that I can help everybody I can't really but I'm real good for people that are sick like I'm sick
and from that moment to this that has been my primary purpose except for one little period when I was about nineteen years sober and I got seduced by by tremendous wealth in abundance back into a life where I was the center again and consequently got depressed again
it that was the only time in twenty eight well and since that moment
that's the only time where I've been on free
see I
I knew something when I drank when alcohol worked it really worked
I could lose my job I could lose a relationship I can have a bad day I could have a good day in a drink of alcohol did something very magical for me
but I get the same thing out of the guys are sponsoring my commitments in the hospitals and institutions there's a guy that I sponsored the talks about twelve step working he says that's the good dope
I'll tell you something what I drink whiskey I wanted the best whiskey I could get it when I do a I want the best day I can get I want to buy this whole package I didn't go into a bar and ask for a half a beer and I ain't coming here and asking for half a solution either
I want this whole package it if you're sitting here and you're done a lot of the steps in Alcoholics Anonymous but you don't help anybody except yourself
I'm telling you I think you're missing it
I believe that any life or view of spiritual recovery or development it's all about you is an illusion
it's an illusion of self
everywhere in this book the talks about spiritual growth it always talks about things like we turn our thoughts to someone we can help
we ask god to remove the defects in care of character not that stand in the way of you being happy you're rich what are the things that stand in the way of you being useful matter of fact it is the purpose of Alcoholics Anonymous
the very back of the big book
in an obscure section that that most people don't read on page five seventy
this doctor nails us when he says
four lines down he's talking about us and he says they know that they must never drink they help others with similar problems in this atmosphere the alcoholic often overcomes his excessive concentration upon himself
why must somehow find the freedom from myself that I found in five shots of tequila
if I can't find that here then the best I will ever have as a half **** depressive state where abstinence will feel like I'm doing time in there's a loneliness about untreated alcoholism sober it is actually more painful than alcoholism when you're drinking at least when I was drinking I can always have the hope of the Bolivian
I'm treated alcoholism sober is more painful
because you you're you're experiencing the alcohol this and without the benefit of Anna static
it's a bad deal
but if you're if you're depressed you're if you're if things aren't right for you to check your twelve step work
it's I I would not be here
if it wouldn't have been for the encouragement of the old timers for me to do service and get off my
my button go out and try to help other people we have an old saying in a you want to be goosed by the spirit you gotta get up off your ****
and it's really that's why in our book we have a chapter into action we don't have a chapter in the pondering or into thinking are indeed considering figuring it all out into figuring it all out into action and working with others Scott thanks Bob I love the way he does that stuff I don't find the word sponsor or a sponsorship in the basic text but I find the the description of it very clearly laid out on page ninety six men talking for several pages about a twelve step call someone said they might like some help one over there talk to me about my drinking he talked about his we laughed a lot we cried a little I left in the book
it says in the middle of ninety six oppose your now making your second visit to a man so that was the first one
he has read this volume says he's prepared to go through with the twelve steps of the program to recover so there's the definition of the program again and I love the language here look at me if you would says he's prepared to go through with the twelve steps and be good we'll settle for that we don't get that many eager winds right will settle for that and this is he's read the book restructure have you had the experience of reading and your eyes are moving across the page in your mind is moving across the universe have you had that one if you read out loud you'll stop that I can trap my mind in the moment by reading aloud so that for me to find someone's possible he's made an attempt to read this book he understands the twelve steps are the program and he's he's willing to go through with them great and then for me to describe sponsor in the next sentence having had the experience yourself you can give a much practical advice what experience the experience of going through the twelve steps what advice advice on how to go through the twelve steps their sponsorship in two senses laid out very very clearly and I think anything beyond that is me playing god
I want to talk about a number of little things that just didn't seem to fit real well anywhere else in the talking about sponsorship I believe for the longest time the my responsibility number one to the men I sponsor was to take them through the twelve steps and I don't believe that anymore I believe that's number two I believe my first responsibility is to love them
I'm told that god is love and when I say when I give love I give god it's the highest gift I have the privilege today of loving the man that I sponsor without exception
and then I take them through the steps I've had the experience on a couple of occasions of needing to to change sponsors I told you about a sponsor I had that was sleeping with new women he was married I had another experience why need to change sponsors and I called my sponsor and he's one of the most spiritual men I've ever known that beautiful stuff I think it's beautiful that I talked about in steps six and seven about
about I don't work in my defects of character and self cut bills pushed up on the center that's all from this guy beautiful most one of the most perch amount all over now it was necessary for me to change sponsors and I called him on a Friday I left him a message on his answering machine I need to talk to you he responded to my call on the following Tuesday afternoon I was in the middle of a divorce
the reason I changed monsters was because he didn't have time that I felt like I needed and I think that's a very good reason and and I said ten I've been coached by my new sponsor I said how do I do that he said I want you to drop and I said how do I do that
and he said thank him thank him profusely Mike thank you for all you've given me thanks for the beautiful things I've learned thanks for your commitment in the time that you put into what I'm doing here god knows your blessing in my life but it's only fair for me to tell you I'm I'm changing sponsors
the adults don't have to answer questions
and he didn't ask if he had asked I would have told him I think he knew why
but that doesn't matter because he had a sponsor himself he's got a problem he can go process it there and by the way if he gets angry at that point I've absolutely done the right thing because he got his he got tied up in sponsoring me three years ago I was dropped by two guys both with long term recovery both for the same reason because I I've had the privilege of doing this a lot and I was gone so much and when I'm in town I'm pretty busy they felt like they needed more I think that's a fabulous reason to change sponsors I have a goal for the men that I sponsor and it is that they would outgrow me spiritually I can't think of another worthy goal how can I be unhappy if he did and could move on to somewhere else and get more how can I possibly be offended by that the other piece
and this one's a little bit more controversial is dropping someone that I'm trying to sponsor and before you come to disagree with me and we're not going to go there and look middle paragraph on page ninety five top of page ninety six are very clear about that I do not allow the men that I sponsored to work with men that don't do what they ask
and I don't do it either
and I got that lesson from this Mike I was just tell you about it five years I called on Monday and I said that not to not to not to let down on this guy I sponsor what shall I do and he said dropping
as a come on my come be in serious he said I would be in serious I said I don't believe you
he said what are you asking him to do that he's not doing I said well let's see call me every day look for a job called his parole officer go to a meeting every day and opening closes days following the directions and step eleven I said and how much of that see doing it so he's not doing any of it he said you are not his sponsor he is
you are his fire chief and when his tail feathers are abilities he calls you and siphons off some of your serenity puts out his fire and goes right back to doing it his way and you are not helping him
and then he said how do you feel when you work with him I said that feel like they pull the cords out of my heels in the blood ran out I feel like I've been run out he said a hot and how do you feel when you work with bill K. I said well he likes me up like a pinball machine he said really and what are you asking bill to do that he's not doing so he's doing it all they said aha
this is it about a thousand but you can pretty well tell when you work with somebody whether it's where sponsorship is always a two way street
it's working for one it's working for both if it's not working for one inning working for the other one either so there's always a two way street he said you are currently co signing a lie you are allowing the man to think that he has a sponsor and that he's in the program of Alcoholics Anonymous and he's not he's in the fellowship
but he's not allowing you to coach him into the program
and your cosigner ally
and he said he said could you stay so run the program he's drinking he's working and I said no I don't think so he said can he I said I don't think so he said you are probably right and when he drinks again
I want you to be able to sleep knowing that you told him the truth because he could go to prison for a long time or kill somebody there's no telling what he could do when he's drinking and I want you to be able to sleep knowing that you told him the truth
and with heavy heart I went to this guy the telemarketing sponsored anymore
the last time I saw him he bounced off of both sides of the clubhouse door coming in so drunk he couldn't stand up and was arrested out of that meeting his car was parked up against somebody else's car in the parking lot as the last time I saw him
the other reason that I must tell him the truth is that the next time he wakes up in a jail cell in a pool of his own blood in vomit I wanted to have three options and those options are to continue to live that way
to commit suicide
or to try the program of Alcoholics Anonymous knowing he hasn't tried it because I told him the truth if I don't tell him the truth I've signed his death warrant
I had to do it twice this year I picked up two new men to sponsor this year I had to drop them both
it broke my heart I have coached every man I sponsor through dropping someone at least once and I or a guy and his grand sponsor told me that they couldn't get his sponsor he'd had to do it is guts were on fire I said great
I hope it tears you apart I hope it does every time but he's not you're you're not throwing away his chance he is
you're telling him the truth you're making it easier for him to come back he can set on bar stools and say don't work for him but he'll know what's a lie because you've told him the truth you may have saved his life and I hope it tears your guts about all the tears mine up every time because who am I if it doesn't
and I had a fellow that that I went and I said okay I'm I'm dropping you know there was a notable please don't I'll do anything I said okay I read the first eight pages of bill story look up one word on every page kami nine eight fifteen phone rings a fifteen you look up the words the rock and roll for about two weeks and then I realized I put more into his his recovery than he has since I'm dropping snow no I'll do anything I don't know how many times we went through that little deal and finally my sponsor told me he said this is the last time when you're not going to warn him and the next time you go to drop him he stand dropped and I said yes Sir and I went to I said Jerry a drop is no no says it now I'm gonna last change into your grave
I'm through and I hope you get with someone who's done these twelve steps and allow them to culture through this work and he got with another long time member of my home group that day and surrendered to him and he will tell you today I saved his life that day so important we gotta god shows up in my group about every six months he was just a couple of months ago and he comes in he says now look I know the last twelve times I was here that I I said I do anything you said in your get me to sign and I didn't do it but I'm really serious I really really mean it this time would you sponsor me as a sure read the first eight pages and bill story look up one word you know whatever's assignment like that but something with a look up the words they can't fake that
tell me nine eight fifteen he don't call and he doesn't think he's got a sponsor I don't think it does either and I'm not throwing away his chance he is because the next time he does that in calls made eight fifteen with the dictionary we're gonna rock and roll
it's a it's an interesting approach to this thing but it's it's so important because if I don't do that if I don't follow the directions in the book and drop those people I'm betting his life on my amateur psychology
and it makes me sick to have to do it
and I hope it always does
that's one of the hardest things I've got today
do you know the difference by the way between a good habit a bad habit
I'll tell you good habits are easy to break
that's the difference yeah if I'm going to have good habits I'm going to have to pay the price to keep them because they won't stay on their own the this is a gift from a girl in my home group she said she'd been tells us in a meeting when it should have been to a dog race and
the little mechanical rabbit takes off and they shoot the gun to K. just pop up the dogs take off and she said that the whole the mechanical rabbit malfunction in the first turn and stopped
and the lead dog his tail over tea kettle with this mechanical rabbit into the ditch I thought we were in the world is she going with this and then she said I'm just exactly like that dog I'm check I'm shot out of a gun chase in some bad go mechanical rather than going to be what I want if I can catch it
I said wow
and she said you know that dogs smarter than I am
the retired that dog no matter what they do he will never chase another mechanical rabbit
he only has to catch one of him he'll never do it again not me maybe I'm after the next one
boy that's the truth how
I got here as a take a minute taker all my life
and I thought I was going to transition from taker to giver
not so
because a taker can't take anything worth having I had to transition from taker to receiver first and for me the differences a receiver it knowledge is it someone else gave and says thank you had to give up the John Wayne thing
and and I'm humbly say thank you and may I have some more having done that for a while puts me in a position to be a giver but I can't go from taker to giver and then I believe that it was my willingness to give that was going to keep the channel between me and got up and I do believe that it does but the big pieces my willingness to continue to receive because that contention melody when you're hurt and
and I find out about it I get to love on you I get this wonderful feeling of closeness to god by giving
when I'm hurting
if I don't let you know I block your chance to get close to god by giving
I I have a pretty good working knowledge of this book in our program recovery I've been around a long time I've sat at the feet of the sages
the most important things I take my home group or my pain and my mistakes
because it makes it okay for other people to be real
and it it it puts me in a position of receiver
so that you can have your chance to give so important that I keep that piece in place
I was up I was in the kitchen of the Woodbine club us over about two years and I was having a discussion with another member now not being as spiritually developed as I am you might have thought it was an argument
and there's something really important like alarm a recovered alcoholic recovering alcoholic something really need to be hammered out and I don't know how many newcomers came through that we missed while we were doing that and also be walked in and showed been sober since about a month before the earth began to cool and
he was very intelligent which clearly puts him on my side of this burning issue which I still came about it was and I pose the question to Joe and I said what do you think it Joe said
I am not allied with any sect denomination politics organization or institution and I wish to engage in any controversy neither endorsed or opposed any causes my primary purpose is to stay sober help other alcoholics achieve sobriety by which time my opponent I were laughing pretty hard it took me awhile and I had what I call a revelation sponsors recognizes a revelation revelation is when I figure out for myself something you've been trying to tell me for six months or longer
right right
it's a revelation
and I were told Jonah said you meant and he said oh yeah
Joe B. who is living a a preamble the most peaceful man I've ever known in my life
you could not get him into a controversy he wouldn't come he had a primary purpose was to stay sober and help others achieve sobriety and he would not let anything get between him and that nothing
what a powerful example that was for me
I I asked my sponsored about six months I said I'm hearing people say spiritual side of the program this is spiritual side of the program that if there's a spiritual side of the program's going to be at least one other side what's the name of it he said there are two sides there's a spiritual side on the drug side pick one
you may have noticed Bob and I giving our last names here
in keeping with our tradition of anonymity
if that didn't make any sense to you I'd like to recommend the book Dr Bob in the good old timers page to seventy and the pampered understanding anonymity
anonymity in part is about protecting me from my own ego and protecting the fellowship for my ego our our friend cliff says that the twelve traditions or set of principles that are designed to protect our college anonymous from my very best motives
and I believe that's right
so part of an anime is is so that you can find me my name is Scott Lee I live in Nashville Tennessee look me up in the phone book if you're coming through I'm looking for your call especially if you're a new comer I made it so somebody in my home group goes into the hospital so I walk up to the reception desk and say excuse me can you tell me what room chainsaw Mike is in
choose pardon me ma'am do you have is Jennifer from another planet at this hospital
so I think it's important we be able to find each other and I think that there are people who need to be remain anonymous we know some federal judges that are in the fellowship who really need to be first names only and there are there are exceptions but I believe that generally the rule is that it's a violation of a tradition to not get my last name in a meeting time understand the other side of anonymity is is about anonymous giving it's about not doing something good for somebody else and not getting caught no that's not my style
the side I think you should know me better especially by do something good I think you should be informed about that but I had an experience a couple of a number of years ago where I actually did that did something good for somebody nobody else found out about it
and the feeling was like it was a piece of sunshine about the size of a golf ball at lodge itself in my chest and I could think about what I'd done anytime of the day or night listening with glowing skin light through my whole body
I think I see some people know what I'm talking about
and so I never told a soul
for about six months
and when I told the thing got out and I'm gonna tell you because there's another lesson that came on this and what happened was I had one of those magical in my business day was over at noon I had nothing to do fishing gear in the trunk I go to a park I'm fishing in the stream there's a family having a picnic they got a seven year old boy it looks like you're not going to fish together today I'm going to cast he's going to everything else had a really good time met the family no fisherman in the family he clearly is one I was at a place in my life where I had time I got to know the family I took this young lad on a number of very short fishing trips just to be sure and when I was convinced he and I launched on that buffalo river of Tony about put a canoe on that river flooded five miles off in about ten hours coat over a hundred fish that day
it caught a four pound smallmouth bass they got my fish is what happens
about a mile from the takeout suddenly this guy's black and I hear the thunder and we're gonna get it there's some trees in a kind of parallel park this canoe up under these trees I'm about to pray to did you happen to notice by the way Seitz got down there the boy and he got my fish about to do this prairie city and this beautiful little boy looks over shoulder many says is it okay to fish here
and that's the question
yeah I prayed the third step prayer in a minute and I forget that
and when the skies in my life black and I hear the thunder and I know I'm fixing to get it I think that's a problem supposed to take my father
is it okay to Fisher
because like Bob I think that's my assignment
and I'm I'm strangely designed to be able to do it is miss Linda says god's will is a good deal
I I told you earlier about those who were here last night I talked about flying high performance airplane it's this one if you wanna look when it's over
I took off on my last flight and a high performance playing a level at forty thousand feet three and a half minutes after break release
I'm eighty miles west of Jacksonville Florida
and they gave me a barrel it's called it's a thirty mile circle around a point on the ground and an altitude block as you're going to play at seven hundred miles an hour they have to give you some room it's a good it's a good rule and the
and they gave me more out to to that I was supposed to happen that was back in the days before the radar told your altitude
and
and I just wondered out height would go now they told us a couple of times a week not to go above forty five thousand feet this airplane they said there were two reasons one is that you could die the the other was that you could get killed very quickly and you would owe them an airplane those are the two reasons not to go for about forty five because they're things that can happen and I'll do that you will not recover from
but I was young and immortal and
right so I pull those up a little bit rolled into about six fifteen degrees a bank and I started climbing in the circle
at military power which is everything short afterburner
and and nine tenths of the speed of sound not supposed to be about forty five at fifty two thousand three hundred she was done
she's not going up anymore and I have done an instrument climb I've been looking at my gauges I've not looked outside I rolled out on a northerly heading and I looked up for the first time
it's nine thirty in the morning on a clear day the sun's coming up over my right shoulder in a bubble canopy
above me this guy is Jack black at nine thirty in the morning on a clear day at fifty two thousand three hundred
and I looked out to the west of saw the curvature of the earth and I didn't see it a little bit and in nineteen sixty seven there weren't many people that had seen it and I was one of them
this this the horizon was bent and this thing where writing is this magnificent blue ball just floating in space and I believe it's Heller my love I shouldn't say anything else just login and I sat there and looked at eternity
and I had a feeling like something warm had been poured over me and slowly ran down and I can't explain that
in the poem high flight the author says I reached out my hand and touched the face of god
and I did that that morning
and I sat there for a minute or two very dangerous set there for just a moment or two and look at that look at eternity and eased him back and brought it down and shot one approach and landed and
I couldn't tell if I totally believe me I get court martialed and I might have been the town drunk I'm not the village idiot I don't dalam
and
and I never told the whole time I was in the Air Force and bre Carlin was one of my A. mentors get one of Burke's CD's and I spoke at his twelve year birthday when I had five years and I heard myself telling that story for the first time
and and I can I can remember saying I don't know why I'm telling it and course you know I got to the end of the store and realized that that was my first experience
you can't do something like that not gonna do it again
for over thirty years I want to see the curvature of the earth again
I used to send their plans and said other pilots I can't believe they pay us to do this and yet I walked away from my dream with five years
alcoholism took away any chance my head of my dreams have come true
and Alcoholics Anonymous bottom all back
it brought them all back four years ago miss Linden I chartered ourselves a Lear jet
and I didn't drive I send back that particular leader will go to fifty one thousand feet
that's close enough yeah
I've learned to dream big
I serve a big god I hope you dreaming big
we serve a big god I'd like to publicly thank that god I asked you and our first couple of sessions to invite your got to join us hope you did last night or this morning I'm not sure which I invited you if you don't have a got to borrow mine if you did and you got touched by him again I I sit here before you in stocking feet I take my my shoes off I did last night when I spoke
because weve invited got here and my feet could be on holy ground
and I've tried to care that my partner hope ahead of
and how they ask him to use me how we did
and
my great mentor died about three years ago and may
and I've spent his last thanksgiving with my wife and his wife and we were sitting down and I like this and the women right here and they didn't see this happen and I was finally able to ask the man the question of needed asking for so long I used to take him the unanswerable question and he always had a principle based answered that I knew was correct Hey I was amazing guy this is one of four men that took eight Russia was astounding guy
and I finally asked him the question
I said don Porter guys like Scott gonna do when guys like don are all gone
and this humble man cupped his hands and leaned forward at me like this and he looked in his hands and he said I have been bringing you hands full of water go to the river
he said it won him
that he had made contact with the power and the wisdom far beyond his own
and he'd only brought me small portions of that and that he believed it was possible for me and I believe it's possible for all of us to go to the river
and I want to close my portion of this weekend by saying thank you and by telling you what I think is the single most important thing that has been said this weekend here are the steps we took which are suggested as a program of recovery Bob J. Scott
I am Bob still no garlic
I have been delighted to be here this weekend I've got to talk to some of you have gotten connected to quite a few of you I hope I hear from you in the future
Scott twenty does these workshops takes you shoes off because he feels like he's on spiritual
round I always wear thick short soled shoes or boots because I feel like I'm going to step in it
it's
my approach
prone to step in
you know
I I it does appear that I wish we had more time
and we do next summer there this chapter working with others is a blow by blow description of how to work with the newcomer how to sponsor someone even how to give it a a talk
it tells you what to say when to say it what to do when to do it what not to do and why you shouldn't do it
and unfortunately I three started throwing myself into twelve step work before I ever read this chapter
I didn't have I didn't go to my sponsor for direction I just was like a cowboy who in a a loose cannon
and consequently I did probably as much damage as I did good
because I think is an alcoholic where carriers were either going to carry the disease are going to carry the message you're going to carry one of the other and I think a lot of my early sobriety in my twelve step work I carried the disease and I didn't even know any better
it cautions this in this book to never put our work with the new man on a service plane
then if we start to do that he will start to rely on us and he'll clamor for more help and more of this and more of that what our ultimate goal really is to take him through the twelve steps so that he can connect with a power greater than himself which is his alternate reliance
and instead of doing that I started I came to twelve step work with an ego
in an inferiority since it became all about me and I was going to get these guys over even if it killed them because if they drank again I'm gonna look bad to the old timers
and so I'm doing everything wrong
and I'm trying to fix their problems I'm getting guys jobs it I have no right not there an employment counselor getting jobs because I have a friend in a as the company goes to work for the guy in a mini stroke and robs you right
there was a guy that I was sponsoring
who
I really didn't want to do a a but I'm so my ego so tied up in the sky stay in sober and I can't get him to do anything I should if I didn't know what I know today I would have fired him day to
he won't do anything the only the only way to even go to a meeting is I got to go pick him up
right he won't even go to a meeting on his own in any then in the car to the meeting he just whines to me non stop about these warrants out for his arrest in another state and it I really cute just depressed I don't know what should I do it would probably go to jail and you know on and on and so I go to a guy named Roger in the fellowship was a federal judge
I didn't really understand Roger went to meetings I went to an Roger really liked me and we were we were good friends he was sober a long time I had no idea what a powerful man he was he was so powerful that if you come he died
about twenty years ago in the name of the federal building in the state of Nevada after him
and to this day you go there and you'll see that federal building and has his last name in big letters over the entrance to the federal building is a very powerful federal judge and I went to Roger and
I could get into his office and you couldn't even I didn't realize that you even the governor needed an appointment to see Roger but I could just go into his office because I know him from the meetings right and I would I wanted to Rogers office I said can I talk to you and he cleared his she said yeah and he called his secretary when I sat down and they said I guess I need your help and I lied to him
and here's what I told him I said Roger I'm working with this new guy so and so when he really wants to be sober
well that's not really the truth here's the truth the truth is you know I'm working with so and so in all I really want him to be sober that was the truth and then I lied to him again and I said and Roger he he wants the really isn't doing that he's really doing well he wasn't doing what was true is I really wanted him to do a a and I thought that if I could get him some help on these warrants that maybe he would realize what a blessing ELCA holds enormous is become a stellar member get a year he mentioned my name might get credit would be really good
so I I told Roger about these warrants out for this guys arrested I gave him his phone the guy's full name and where he was born to social security number sector and
and Roger said let me see what I can do Roger picked up the phone and made some phone calls in that guy's police record disappeared
he was drunk within a week
and to my knowledge he's never made it back to Alcoholics Anonymous
you know something I think it would have been better if I would have stuck a gun to his head and pulled the trigger
I sed I robbed him of the most important thing he had going for him the thing that brought him to the table and was keeping him in Alcoholics Anonymous in keeping at least calling me
was his desperation and I fixed that
when I fix that he didn't need god he didn't beat us and you didn't need recovery anymore
he very well this died of alcoholism in the ensuing years I know that I've never seen him in a meeting since the
and I know I knew that one point he was drunk and he was he was living in the this place called Saint Vincent's
there's an old adage that said if you says if you give a man a fish will eat for a day
but if you teach him to fish will eat for a lifetime
and if you're new you've probably been clamoring to the old timers for fish and they keep wanting to give your fishing license and you don't know what that's about
tighten your belt take the lessons
take the fission lessons
and maybe you'll you'll eat for a lifetime
I would have read something
two things will close in one of my favorite passages
in the twelve step is on page one hundred it's a brief paragraph but it's it's a vision of exactly what we find in Alcoholics Anonymous and its vision of spiritual growth
in progress
and it starts out the first paragraph it says both you and the new man
must walk day by day in the path of spiritual progress
I think any view of spiritual progress has to include someone else in other words the admission to the dance is to bring somebody to the dance
you don't get it alone
both you and the new new man must walk day by day in the path of spiritual progress in if you persist
remarkable things will happen
you know what those things are
those are the things we talk about a coffee after meetings
when we talk about to just see Susie got her kids back
Juno did Jim got a doctorate degree from the university remember when he couldn't even read chapter five
did you know Joe remember Joe lived in the bushes out behind the a lot of club you know Joe bought a house
mopey used to come into the meetings and wine and so depressed all the time did you see him with his group of sponsors he's after that meeting and he was laughing and making fun of them did you see the light designs
remarkable things will happen
boy they do I'm telling you we see stuff in Alcoholics Anonymous that Hollywood would want to make a mini series about and we see it every day matter of fact I think most of this become blase about the miracles we see today we take them for granted I mean I would think about it you get a Cup of coffee some guy comes up details about a homeless guy buying a house you go yeah yeah where's the sugar I mean you know it's just great
remarkable things happen the remarkable things
we are we live in a not only a fellowship but we live right in the middle of an age of miracles right around us and we don't see it most of the time
it says when we look back we realized that the things which came to us
when we put ourselves in god's hands we're better than anything we could have planned
the things that came to us I didn't make them happen I didn't manipulate them I didn't manufacturing matter of fact this is a very good definition of god's grace unmerited gift they just call
they just came to me only as a result of putting myself in god's hands and it says they're better than anything we could have planned
most people that I know that sober over ten years if they would have made a list when they were sixty days sober of what they would like to see happen in their life over the next ten years
and they looked at the list ten years later they realized in there to mislead that if they would have gotten what was on the list they would have short change themselves
it's better than anything I could have played the thinks of of of real substance in value in my life I wouldn't have even had the I wasn't even known weak enough to ask for them or even even at one
I didn't know that the most valuable things in my life today was how I feel about myself and how I feel about others I wouldn't know that one of the most how would I know that the most valuable thing in my life was the security
and the comfort that comes in knowing that I am in the hands of the creator of the universe that I'm safe and protected to know that I'm part of the fellowship that is there for me where I am part of because of who and what are you the nice fit here I would have never asked for that I might have asked for some money in a car and maybe a girl with big ma'am mammary glands are some
shallow you know I just because I wouldn't know I wouldn't know what to ask for
better than anything you could have planned
follow the dictates of a higher power and you will presently living in new and wonderful world
no matter what
your present circumstances no matter what
your freight you're gonna go to prison
it doesn't matter
here Frazier in a year you've dug yourself into a hole that you will never get out of doesn't matter
you think it looks hopeless stick around here take the fission lessons realize that you're wrong about all of that also
the impossible in a a just takes a little longer that's all
it just takes a little longer
are you for all my sobriety I've resented people who
read
holds in a a meetings it's tacky tacky it's do you know this really rhyme in the sings ISIS it's tacky
I'm going to risk being one of those people
to read
a poem that was written by one of bill Wilson spiritual advisers when he was new in New York
a guy by the name is mentioned in a literature frequently is name is the Reverend Samuel shoemaker
and Sam was the one of the leaders of the Oxford group in New York City
and you got to remember if you know historically about the Oxford group not all of the Oxford group like the alcoholics some of them referred to is is the drug squad in fact there was a big falling out between bill Wilson and Frank Bachman the founder of the Oxford group because his bill Frank Buckman wanted bill to leave these drugs alone go down to Wall Street bring into the Oxford group some of those captains of industry they'll swallow our coffers still give us credibility and build
wanted to go down to the mission on Skid Row the Calvary mission and he wanted to work in towns hospital Knickerbocker hospital he wanted to work with the hopeless he wanted to work with guys like me
in Salem I believe fell in love with bill for that
and I don't know that Salem wrote this poem about bill in the early members of AA but I suspect he did because it's really about us it's called I stand by the door
I stand by the door I know either go too far in your state too far out the door is the most important door in the world is the door through which men walk when they find god there's no use my going way inside and staying there when so many are still outside and they as much as I crave to know where the door is and all that so many ever find is only the wall were a door ought to be they creep along the wall like blind been with outstretched groping hands feeling for a door knowing there must be a door so I stand by the door
the most tremendous things in the world is for men to find that door that door to god the most important thing any man can ever do is to take hold of one of those blind groping hands and put it on the latch the latch the clicks and opens only to that man's touch
men die outside the door as starving beggars die on cold nights in cruel cities in the dead of winter die for what is within their grasp they live on the other side of it and they live there because they have not found it nothing else matters compared to helping them find it in open it and walk in and find him so I stand by the door
go in great saints go all the way in go way down to this cavernous sellers and way up into the spacious addicts it is a vast roomy house this house where god is going to the deepest of hidden casements of withdrawal of silence of sainthood so must inhabit those inner rooms and know the depths and heights of god and call outside for the rest of us how wonderful it is sometimes I take a deeper look in sometimes I venture in a little further but my place seems closer to the opening so I stand by the door there is another reason why I stand there some people get part way in and become afraid lest garden the zeal of his house devour them for god is so very great and he asks all of us and these people feel a cosmic claustrophobia and they want to get out let me out they cry in the people way inside only terrify the more somebody must be by the door to tell them that they are spoiled for the old life you see
once you've tasted god
the nothing but god will do anymore
somebody must be watching for the frightened to seek to sneak out just when they came in to tell them how much better it is inside the people too far in do not see how near the start to leaving preoccupied with the wonder of it all somebody must be watching for those who have entered the door but would like to run away for so for them to I stand by the door
I admire the people who go away you know how but I wish they would not forget how it was before they got in then they would be able to help the people who have not yet even found the door or the people who want to run away from god
I guess you can go into deeply and stay too long and forget the people outside the door as for me
I should take well to custom place near enough to guide to hear him and know that he is there but not so far for men is not to hear them and remember that they are there to wear outside the door thousands of them millions of them it's more important for me one of them two of them perhaps ten of them whose hands I am intended to put on the latch so I shall stand by the door and wait for those who seek it I'd rather be a doorkeeper so I stand by the door
and from the bottom of my heart to the men and women of Alcoholics Anonymous who've given of their time to go into institutions and detoxes and county jails on the odd chance that they might find one guy like me and for the men and women who stand at their home group and they're awake enough to see the new guy like me coming in the door who's scared and suffering is about to run away when you reach out to me I want to thank you for my life Sheesh
we're going to close in a very unusual manner
we're going to push for the lord's prayer together I'm gonna ask you to remain seated
I I'd like to note that the last word in the prayer is a man I get sober before the chanting
and I'd like if you would after the a man to have a fairly long moment of silence and wanted to see if you can feel it's in this room I'll let you know when I was over if you would like to have a few moments of silence in honor of those that carry this message to us that are gone
larch prior Arafat
okay okay
hi
yes it happened to us this day
and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us and lead us not into temptation
Ross
it is the kingdom and the power
all right
god bless us all safe travel thank you I think you heard this