Step 12 at a Big Book Study in Geneve, Switzerland

Welcome back. Thank you. Thanks. My name's Simon Clark. I'm a grateful recovered alcoholic.

Hi. Hi. Hi. Hi. We're gonna go to 1 on this session, I think.

Right. Exactly. Yeah. So we've got about an hour and a half, and and there is nothing that I would rather talk more about than working with others in the 12 step work and and sponsorship. Throughout the book, if you read the big book, and I've seen some of you reading it, even right from the start, in the very very early chapters forward to the 1st edition talks about step 12 step work, forward to the 2nd edition mentions 12 step work multiple times.

Doctor's opinion. In the 3rd paragraph on the doctor's opinion, it says in the 3rd course of the of his third treatment, he acquired certain ideas concerning the possible means of recovery. As part of his rehabilitation, he commenced to present these conceptions to other alcoholics, impressing upon them that they must do likewise with still others, 12 step work. This has become the basis of a rapidly growing fellowship of these men and their families. The this man and over 100 others appear to have recovered as a basis of working the 12 steps, are going carrying this message about the program to other alcoholics.

And he talked about it in the doctor's opinion. Bill's story talks about 12 step work. Bottom of page 14, you know, Bill White says, for if an alcoholic failed to perfect and enlarge his spiritual life. My sometimes come across people and they say, you know, I'm getting spiritual. I'm doing this.

I'm I'm working on my spiritual life. I'm doing that. I'm doing this, and I'm working on my spiritual life. Well, I try not to take this out of context because Bill Wilson says for an alcoholic phone to perfect and enlarge your spiritual life through work and self sacrifice for others. That's how I perfect and enlarge my spiritual life through work and self sacrifice for others.

If he did not work, he would surely drink again. And if he drank, he would surely die. Now there's a condition there. What he's saying is that if I don't do 12 step work, if I don't work with others, I will drink again. You're right.

Also, it's a design for living that works in rough going. See, if I'm not doing 12 step work and I'm having a rough time, what I what I see now is that is that I end up sharing how bad my life is with with you, Tell me what a bum deal I've got. And basically, I'm backing self, but the design for living that works in rough coming is the 12 step work. He said, if many times I've gone to my old hospital in despair, or talking to a man there, I would be amazingly lifted and set on my feet. What I see happening in our politics anonymous is many people going to AA meetings in despair and sharing it, but they're not working with others.

We're right about that a lot. In the chapter more about alcohulism, we we give him 3 examples. We've given Jim the car salesman. We give him Fred, and the other chap who was I don't know this guy's name, actually, the the accountant who who who basically made a decision not to drink until he was successful in business. Everything's true.

It's the truth. It's conditional sobriety. Yeah. The man of 30 doing great illustration. Now if you read these examples carefully, watch what Alcoholics Anonymous do with the individual when he relapses.

Alphalete's numbers continue to work with these individuals. Jim and Carsovsma. And I'll always make reference to this. Because Jim the car salesman, what I understand, he did the first nine steps because his family were reassembled and he got his own, his job back, which to me means he took some action and was getting some results of the action with the family being reassembled. I believe you you worked the first 9 steps, but with Jim Ricasso Osman, he failed to perfect his spiritual life.

Failed to enlarge his spiritual life. It all went well for a time after the next step, he failed to enlarge his spiritual life. How do I enlarge my spiritual life? Well, I just I just explained it what Bill writes in 14 and 15 through work and self sacrifice for others. So it indicates to me that Jim didn't do 12 step work.

To his consternation, he found himself drunk half a dozen times in rapid succession. Now here's an indication of good 12 step work. On each of these occasions, half a dozen times, this guy relapsed. Half a dozen times, Alcoholics Anonymous worked with him, reviewing carefully what happened. He agreed he was a real alcoholic, which which means alcoholics almost obviously qualified him.

Is he a moderate drinker? Is he a hard drinker? Is he a real alcoholic? He agreed he was, which means they qualified him. Time after time, alcoholics Time after time, alcoholics almost worked with him, with with Fred as well.

Bear with me. I just need to get to the page. Alcoholics almost worked with Fred, page 39. But Fred wouldn't believe himself as an alcoholic, much less accept a spiritual remedy, gone in the 12 steps for his problem. Alcoholics almost told him what they knew about alcoholism.

Physical allergy coupled with a mental obsession, piling on the hopelessness of his condition. He was interested and conceded that he had some of the symptoms, but he was a long way from admitting that he could do nothing about it himself. We heard no more from, Fred for a while. One One day we were told that he was back in hospital. This time he was quite shaky.

He soon indicated he was anxious to see us. Our colleagues and the numbers went to him. You know, they continued to work with the guy even though he was relapsing. Yeah. My experience has been is is that I get to a spot in in step 10 where the problem does not exist.

I get to a step in step 10 where the problem has been removed, and I have this power. I need I need to give that away. My my sobriety is dependent upon doing 12 step work. And I just speak for myself, I must do it. Because if I don't do it, I wake up, exactly what Vivian talked about in in Bill, with Bill's story, is that, you know, he was plagued by waves of self pity and resentment.

That's what that's what happens with me when I when I don't think of others, when I don't work with others. Now there is a difference I've learned between sponsorship and working with others. I sponsor around 8 or 9 men today, but I also serve groups. I have an intergroup commitment. I have a a commitment towards XA speakers in in carrying this message.

I'm part of the audit team. I'm so grateful for to be part of that audit team for XA speakers, and I and I try and work with others in anything that's carrying the message because while I'm doing that, I'm outside of myself. We have, in our local intergroup, there was a telephone service that has been put up. Now don't quote me on the numbers, but it's approximately we have about 30 English speaking AA groups a week down where we are, with the membership of about 202120 people. That telephone responders list was issued, and there were 6, 6, 7 people out of a fellowship of 200 or 220 people who who volunteered to do 12 step work.

See I learned, and the book goes on to say that we never avoid these responsibilities. I get to a spot called recovered and get given great power. My for me, 12 step work and working with others is not an option. I must do it. I need to live.

I want to live. I have to carry this message. In our local, and I can't speak for here, but in our part of the world, we also, our group, the primary purpose group, we also have 2 detox meetings a month. And somebody asked a question here a couple of days ago, I believe, how do you do outreach or how do you do hospitals and institutions? Well, I can tell you from my own experience that this is what you do.

Telephone your local hospital under either through or with a PI committee in your local integrator. If you can do it that way, great. If you can't, it doesn't matter. Make contact, explain who you are and and what you're looking to do, which is what we did, and that we only want to be helpful in carrying the message to the patients that are still suffering in that unit. We went along and had a meeting with the doctor with a copy of the book Alcoholics Anonymous.

We shared our experience that we we have recovered from alcoholism. Alcoholics Anonymous does exist here in the meeting list. Here are the groups that are that are are working and studying from the big book Alcoholics Anonymous, and here are the groups that are not. And then this doctor started to refer patients to us, and they came into contact with us. And we went to see them, and we sat down and worked with them, 12 step them, qualified them, find out if they were a real alcoholic or that were they a hard drinker or a moderate drinker, and we were able to work with some of these patients within the unit, and, b, the link between the facility and, the AAV group in the recovery recovery community once they left.

It's called bridging the gap. There's a pamphlet out there about that. I won't turn this into an HNI workshop, but I'm just telling you, it needs action. If you want to do it, do it. Just pick the phone up, see how you can be helpful, come out of the book, let them know you wanna be helpful.

And the the the whole reason well, the way that this started for me is because I got through the one step, and I rang Peter up, and I was I was full of self pity. I've done all of these amends. I'm doing all this, but I feel like this. Told you it wouldn't work. Look at it out there.

You're not gonna get my money I want, and he just said, you better go work with another drunk. What he didn't say was go to a meeting and talk about it and share how you feel. This man understood that my life depended on work and others, and I went up to the hospital, met a patient in the patient ground, told her what I knew about alcoholism, and won the spiritual program of action to her. And this lady was then connecting with a woman's sponsor, and she celebrated 2 years of sobriety, about 2 weeks ago. But I had to do it because otherwise, I was gonna stay with inside of myself and get uncomfortable.

And this is how we do it. We have 2 deep detox meetings a month now, where we go in, and we do something called the foundation meeting that comes from the primary purpose group in Dallas, Texas. And while we're over there, we've got to see that in action. And, Peter wrote the format from, the primary purpose group in Dallas, Texas, and we've now started to work the foundation meeting in these two facilities. And some of those people come and some of them don't.

Some of them walk out and some of them stay. Yeah. But it it keeps me sober. We also offer sponsorship, to those people, and we're able to work with them out in big book, our colleagues, and also free. But that's how you do it, and it's speaking from experience.

Got this thing through from box 459, I don't know whether you you guys get this, but we got this through just a couple of days ago. It says our 12th step, and it's and as a fellowship as a whole, carrying the message, not my message, the message of Alcoholics Anonymous is the basic service that the AA fellowship gives. This is our principal aim and the main reason for our existence. That's why we're here, guys. You recovered.

You you you slipped through. You got well. I got well. Our principal service is to be there for the newcomer. That's our primary purpose.

That's our primary purpose. Tradition 5 says that we have one primary purpose, to carry this message to the alcoholic that still suffers. Now I put that into practice in my personal life, but also at a group level. That's the main reason for our existence. Therefore, AA is more than a set of principles.

It is a society of alcoholics in action. We must carry the message, else we ourselves can wither, and those who haven't have been given the truth. It says here, may die also will die. We get given great powers to recovered members of Alcoholics Anonymous. I get given great power to do this.

And you see here the company's doing a picture. It's a 12 step. And he also says responsibility. Now I've been I've been given, you know, the power by the grace of God in the program of Alcoholics Anonymous. I've Working with others says, perhaps you're not acquainted with any drinkers who want to recover.

He says, you can easily find some by asking a few doctors, ministers, priests, or hospitals. That implies action. That implies not sitting in a meeting and waiting for them to come through the door. What that implies is I've gotta get off my butt, make some calls, take some time out, and see if I can help somebody. And I tell you, as a result of doing that, I walk away time after it never fails, book says.

Never fails. I walk away feeling a $1,000,000. Really? And I'm I'm not longer worried about how much I'm gonna get paid, or is she gonna stay, or is she gonna go, or why does she look at me like that this morning, or what he's doing, or or what this happened to this. Away from there feeling great, empowered, not powerless over people, places, and things, powerful, and that power comes from God as a result of the action in these 12 steps.

Also tells us exactly what to do on a 12 step call. Top of page 90. When you discover a prospect for alcoholics anonymous, find out all you can about him. If he doesn't wanna stop drinking, don't waste time trying to persuade him. You may spoil a later opportunity.

This advice is given for the family also. If there is any indication he wants to stop, have a good talk with him. Have a good talk with the person most interested in, usually his wife. Get an idea of his behavior, his problems, his backgrounds, the seriousness of his condition, and his religious leanings. Sometimes it's wise to wait till he goes on a binge.

The family may object to this, but unless he's in dangerous physical condition, it's better to risk it. Don't deal with him when he's free drugs unless the unless he is ugly and the family needs your help. And this is him, then let his family or a friend ask him if he wants to quit for good, not one day at a time, not just for today, for good, and if he would go to any extreme to do so. If he said yes, then his attention should be drawn to you as a person who has recovered. You should be described to him as part of the fellowship, who is part of their own recovery, try to help others, and he will be glad to talk to him if he cares to see you.

If he doesn't wanna see you, never force yourself upon him. It says, Delabonte here, you might place this book, not living sober, not the pamphlets, because living sober is not gonna give me clear cut instructions on how to have a spiritual experience. And if you're a real alcoholic, that's the only solution for me. This book, Alcoholics Anonymous, where he can see it in the interview in the interval. Tells us what to do on the first visit, and here we go.

At first engaging general conversation. After a while, turn the talk to some phase of drinking. People and I did a workshop for a working with others workshop for our local intergroup, last month, and, it was basically on these chats and sharing our experience along along with this and giving the exact instructions on what to do on a 12 step call. And I think they were the yeah. We're gonna order a load of big books, and we'll take big books out.

And sort of heard a couple of weeks later that there's there's lots of different pamphlets and things that they're gonna give to them instead. Now they're a big book thumper. This has worked for me. I want Dan Shaw on it to work for the person that I'm working with. And why would I withhold the solution from a real alcoholic who's dying of untreated alcoholism?

I have a I have responsibility, one chief primary purpose to carry the message in his purity and integrity to the real alcoholic. Why would I give him something else that's gonna confuse the hell out of him? I would be responsible for his death if I do that. I need to tell him the truth. After a while, turn the talk to some phase of drinking.

Tell him enough about your drinking habits, symptoms, and experiences to encourage him to speak of himself. That's where we share our our war stories, our drinking histories, what what it was like, how much we drank, what happened, how many drink driving bans we got, how many time we were in prison as a result of the consequences, but it doesn't say in great detail either, it says some phase of drinking. This is where we use our experiences. Why? To encourage him to speak of himself.

If he wishes to talk, let him to do so. You'll be thus get a better idea of how you ought to proceed. If he is not communicative give him a sketch of your drinking career until the time you quit, but say nothing for the moment of how that was accomplished. We share our forthcoming histories, and it for this reason, and it's coming up. When he sees you know all about the drinking game, and he sees we know all about the drinking game because we've shared our war stories, we've shared our drinking escapades with him, the minister's described yourself as an alcoholic.

Tell him how baffled you were, how you finally learned that you were sick. Give him an account of the struggles you made to stop. Show him where you've lost the power of choice in order to make the decision to stop. Step. Giving an account of the struggles you made to stop, showing the mental twist which leads to the first drink of a spring.

And they're even telling us where to refer to. Check more about alcoholism. If he's an alcoholic, he will understand you at once. There's the identification. We've spoken about war stories to get him to speak of himself.

We then share ours. He's identified with us. Now we're on common ground. Now we can move forward. Yeah?

If you are satisfied that he is a real alcoholic, Not a moderate drinker. Not a hard drinker. I don't really care what they do. If you are satisfied, he's a real alcoholic. The guy that cannot not drink, the guy that cannot stay out the the crack house, the guy that cannot stay away from the cocaine dinner, the guy that cannot stop, needs to stop, wants to stop, but cannot stop.

Ask him as to qualify, begin to dwell on the hopeless feature of the malady, showing from your own experience how the queer mental condition surrounding the first ring prevents normal functioning of the world power. Continue to speak of alcoholism as an illness, a fatal malady. Yeah. Gives me great instructions I tell him exactly what happened to me, exactly the the progressive, fatal, chronic nature of this illness called alcoholism. That way there's no rooms for opinions.

There's no rooms for middle of the road solutions to come in and and and affect the guy and give him a confused message. We have I learned this from a friend of mine in Texas. We have one shot at these people. One shot. I don't know when the minute of the session in this guy is gonna come back.

I don't know when he's gonna drink again, but I need to make sure that I'm putting in with a vision. I'm doing this stuff properly in order that I may be able to help save somebody's life. Even though your protege may may have entire may have not entirely met in his condition, he's become very curious to know how he got well. Yeah. I bet he has.

Let him ask you that question. Tell him exactly what happened to you. Stress the spiritual feature freely. If the man, the agnostic or atheist, make it empathetic that he does not have to agree with your conception of god, He can choose any conception he likes provided it makes sense to him. The main thing is that he'd be willing to believe in a power greater than himself and that he live by spiritual principles.

The 12 steps. And I don't I do this today, and it's effective because it's a message of depth and weight. For the emotional appeal seldom suffices, and it's the instructions here to speak to him about God. And we hear it, you know, all the time. Look.

Don't mention God on the first visit. You're gonna scare him away. Fine. If that's what we need to do, fine. But alcoholism will kick him back in if he's lucky.

Main thing is that he'd be willing to believe in a power greater than himself. I've had, you know, talks of calls where people say, I'm desperate. I'm dying. You know, I don't know what to do. I can't stop drinking.

I go through the deal with them in in this book, and I qualify them, speak to them about my understanding of this power called god. No way. Sorry. Can't help you. You.

Maybe they need to go back more down the crack house and make some more crack cocaine or keep drinking again, and maybe then they'll be slightly willing to believe that there's something out there. But I can't waste my time with people who who do not want this solution. But the guy that the guy the real alcoholic that does and is willing to do it and is willing to go to do anything to get it, I give him night and day to let this work because I know it works. Page 94, we're still on the first visit. This is outline the program of action.

Explain how you made a self appraisal, step 4, how you straightened out your past, steps 8 and 9, and why you're now endeavoring to be helpful to him, step 12. So on that first visit, on the 12 step call, once the guy has asked me what did I do to get well, I'm now speaking to him about God and the 12 steps. And the first visit, before he's in a meeting, before he had a chance to read any other conference approved literature, before he gets, you know, he he's bagged full of share magazines, box 4, 5 nines, and gets confused. I'm not knocking any of that stuff. I'm just saying, but for the newcomer, we need to keep it simple.

Before any of that happens, we speak with him about godly the 12 steps. It's important for him to realize that your attempt to pass this onto him plays a vital part in your own recovery. Make your claim that it's under no obligation to you that you only hope that you will try to help others. We're only talking to the guy about God, the 12 steps, and him doing 12 step work on the first visit. And now I'd sit in the area meeting to where I'm from, and I hear you're not you're not so good enough to work with anyone until you've been sober 2 years.

Sorry. Not what my big book says. Thank god. Peter didn't say that to me when I came back in 5th time around. Thank god.

I I will not be here today. So just how important is he placed the welfare of other people ahead of his own in all 12 step work. Oh, god. Maybe you've disturbed him about the but it also says here, if your talk has been so quiet and full of human understanding. Please forgive me if my talk hasn't been so quiet and full of human understanding.

I do have a tendency to get passionate about this stuff, but maybe you've disturbed him about the question of alcoholism, says this is all to the good. The more hopeless he feels, the better. He goes on to say your candidate may give reasons why he'd not follow all of the program. No kidding. He may rebel at the fort for drastic housecleaning, step 4, which requires discussion with other people, step 5.

Don't contradict it. Tell him you might feel as as he does. But he doubt whether you've made much progress had you not taken action. On your first visit, tell him about the fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous. If he is interested, lend him your copy of this book.

And this is where this is where it's important that I make the clear distinction between the program of of Alcoholics Anonymous and the fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous. You see, Ruddock says that no human power can relieve my alcoholism, and the fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous is human power. Now I'm not saying the fellowship's not important, but the fellowship on its own won't keep me sober. I've experienced it 5 relationships in 5 years. Just relying on fellowship and service.

Lots of meetings, our problems is where they meet in order that the newcomer may find this solution. And in the early days, what they had was step studies and speaker meetings. And all of these people in in those early days in those first meetings have recovered, had a spiritual experience, and were carrying this message to the newcomer. Further on it talks about electric environments within working with someone else. I explained the fellowship of our colleagues and all of us.

And also, I I I I'm truthful enough to to to let them know what groups are giving this deal and what groups aren't, and I also let the person know that in some meetings he may not hear this message. Why would I deny another alcoholic the truth? Wasn't denied for me. I make it a responsibility for me to do that. And then the book, give them a copy copy of this book.

Why? Because the book is the program of Alcoholics of Violence. There's 2 things going on, there's the program, and then there's the fellowship. If he doesn't mind talking about himself don't worry about it, you're welcome give him a chance to think it over. If he's sincerely interested and wants to see you again ask him to read this book in the interval.

After doing that, he must decide for himself whether he wants to go on. He should not be pushed or prodded by you, his wife, and his friends. And here it is, if he is to find God, the desire must come from within. And it works doing it that way. I've seen it and I've also experienced it without knowledge of being properly on with the fact of trying to pull newcomers into meetings and just come to the meeting, just come to the meeting.

Sure. Come to the meeting, but if the meeting isn't carrying the message about the spiritual experience in the program, the guy's not gonna hear how to get well. That's why tradition 5 is so important in our environment. Even if we take the guy to the meeting, let's get the guy to a meeting where he's gonna hear how to get sober. Let's take him to a meet let's take him to a meeting where he's gonna hear about the the the absolute life changing, deep, and effective spiritual experience as a result of working the 12 steps.

Let's take him to a meeting when there's some guys that can sponsor him immediately. I would also add, I've got on on a 12 step call, I also qualify my need to find out if I'm dealing with a real alcoholic or if I'm dealing with a real drug addict. Because if the guy is a drug addict, I do not take him to a meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous. We have a thing called dissembleness of purpose. I respect him.

I'm a membership of both fellowships, Coca Coles and Alpha that's enormous. I believe in singleness of purpose. If he's a real drug addict, can't control it once he starts, can't stay stopped, we get him connected to the CA guys where we're from and into the CA meetings. If he's an alcoholic, we get him connected to a group that are doing the deal. He said he must be pushed to a point.

Why don't I chase him? I let them read the read the first 164 pages of of the book, decide for themselves whether they wanna go through with the program of action. If I get the call and say, yeah. Okay. Let's go.

Now on the first visit stuff, it also says here a couple of things I've high highlighted is we find it a waste of time to keep chasing a man who cannot or will not work with you. If you leave such a person alone he may soon become convinced that he cannot recover by himself. Working with someone, a couple of months ago and this individual had been had been in and out for a while and it was amazing. We were actually in in the states at the time last year in New York attended the conference and where where we're from, primary purpose group is is kind of, woah. That book, those people, don't go there.

But the interesting thing is is that the mainstream fellowship, once they get a real alcoholic on their hands, they're on the phone to us because they don't know what to do. They don't know what to do with an Alcoholics Anonymous wife from does not know what to do with the real alcoholic. But all of a sudden, our food becomes very popular when they don't know what to do. Work that one out. Happened.

We worked with this woman for a time, it remained a good beginning, and then she went away and she came back and she went away. We tried to work with her, and there were some other other complications involved. And, I was called up a couple of months ago by a friend of her. I went along with another woman, who was doing the deal as well, and we we went around and saw her, and there was a friend of the family there. And my first question to her was, are you done for good and for all?

And she I mean, she was a mess. She looked up at me, the apartment was in in it was just dark. It was messy. It was horrible. I mean, the home was was drunk.

And she looked up at me, and she went and shrugged her shoulders. And I said, bye. Nothing I'm done. And then the friend of the family said, that's a bit rigid. Why did you do that?

And I took her to this page in the book. I said, it's a waste of time to keep chasing her, but she cannot and will not work with you. If I if we leave her alone, she may become convinced that she cannot recover by herself. Well, I think that's very tough. Sorry.

It's what my people tells me to do. Never phone me yet. Never. But you see, what happens is, you know, someone who's not properly armed armed with the facts will will meet her, and they'll they won't waste time driving her from here to there to be sure they're manipulating her. You know, to their own little room, their lover why it's not working.

You know? These guys have dedicated a whole chapter to working with others, a whole chapter so that we don't make the same mistakes that they may have done, so that we're clear on how we do this stuff. 2nd visit, he's read this volume and says he's prepared to go through the 12 steps of the program of recovery. 2nd visit, still no AA meeting yet? 2nd visit.

And he's prepared to go through with the 12 steps of the program. Great. Let's go. Having had the experience yourself, you can give him much practical advice. See, I can't do this effectively if I haven't done it myself.

We have clear cut instructions on how the 12 step are real alcoholic yet. I need to have had real alcoholic and I haven't had the experience myself, The message that I carry to him, is he gonna have depth and weight? Is he gonna have confidence in in my ability to show him the solution? Am I gonna harm him with opinions that I picked up up along the way in the middle of the road out there? Probably.

One shot at these people. Says let him know you're available if he wishes to make a decision, step 3, and tell you store, step form 5. But do not insist upon it if he prefers to consult someone else. This kind of goes into a kind of sponsorship deal from here because the guy read the book, prepared to go through the steps. Some instructions about working with homeless people.

Both people and I worked with homeless people a couple of couple of years ago now. And he was a street drunk, had picked up wonderful techniques in in in getting what he wanted out of people and convincing people that he must have a roof over his head and he can't get sober until he has this. And and I'll be honest with you, subsequently at the time, I hadn't had as much experience as I have until today. So I made some mistakes, and I found myself paying for him to stay in a hotel room, emptying out my wardrobe with lots of clothes and trainers that I didn't use anymore and giving them to him. And, I mean, he was he was kinda going along with us.

You know, he was turning up at meetings, and he was praying. He was praying and trying to do some of the work, but I've kind of got it the wrong way around. And but afterwards, you know, Peter pointed out that maybe I should read 96 and and says, you know, he may be broke and homeless. If he usually might try to help him about getting a job or give him a little financial assistance. He says, but be sure to lose your discretion.

Be sure that that he's not he will be welcomed by your family, that he's not trying to oppose upon you for money, connections, or shelter. Permit that in your own heart. You'd be making it impossible for him to be insincere. And he goes on to talk about what what I call life in the trench. Never avoid these responsibilities, but be sure you are doing the right thing if you assume them.

Helping others is the foundation stone of your recovery. Kindly act in a one in what what isn't enough. You have to be a good servant of Marron every day. Now these are what I can 12 step work promises with life in the trench. It says it may mean the loss of many nights sleep.

Bring interference with your pleasures. Twelve step calls while I'm on week's holiday. Ugh. Had to do it. See, my conscience won't let me turn my back and not do it.

If I can do it, I can't turn my back on it, and I did it. God doesn't send real alcoholics on my doorstep, you know, at the most convenient times, but I have one primary purpose to do it. You may mean sharing your money in your home, interruptions to your business. That's daily, for me currently. Counseling frantic wives and relatives, innumerable trips to the police courts, sanitary rooms, hospitals, jails, and asylums.

Here it is. Your telephone may jangle at any time of the day or night. Your wife may sometimes say she's neglected. The drunk may smash the furniture in your home or burn a mattress. You may have to fight with with him with these violence.

Sometimes you have to call a doctor and administer sedatives under his direction. Another time you may have to send for the police or ambulance. He says occasionally you will have to be in such conditions. They're not kidding me. And and occasionally, some some of them more regularly, but occasionally I have to meet these conditions.

But 12 step work is exciting, guys. See, you laugh, but those of you who haven't done it don't know. It's exciting stuff. You you you stop doing this stuff in your life, and it'll change your life at a level you cannot believe, you cannot imagine, it is absolutely life changing doing this stuff. Absolutely life changing.

Says on page 98, and I'll just say a couple of things here, and I'll I'll hand it over to Peter on this. It says it's not the matter of giving that's in question, but when and how to give. That often makes the difference between failure and success. Here we go. The minute we put our work on a service plane, the alcoholic commences to rely upon our assistance rather than God.

Remember the ABCs? No human power can relieve my alcoholism. God couldn't what if he were sore. He claims for this or that, claiming he cannot master alcohol until his material needs are cared for. Nonsense.

Says further down, we simply do not stop drinking as long so long as we place dependence upon other people ahead of dependence on god. Our one primary purpose, even the sponsorship on this guy, I'm working with this guy. My job, based on him reading this and based on me qualifying him and based on him wanting to do this deal, is to get him through these 12 steps as quickly as he can so that he starts relying on this power rather than human power. I can't fix all of these problems, he's arrogant and selfish to the core if I think I can. I have one primary purpose, get this guy through this work to have a deep and effective spiritual experience so we can recover so that he can then start depending on God.

I cannot take on all the problems of my prospects or sponsorship is not tiring if it's done correctly. It gets tiring after you've been up until 4 AM, 3 AM, 3 nights in a row listening to 5th steps. That's tiring. I cannot take from all all the job. My my only job as a sponsor is to get him connected to God through working the 12 steps, teach him about the fellowship, teach him about the traditions.

Sure. I'm available if he wants to talk and visit and do some step 10 stuff overnight or morning. Absolutely. Not that callous, but I can't take him up. If I start taking all these problems and giving him my opinion on what I think he should do in that relationship, or listening to, you know, to, you know, David, oh, so and so's got an issue with this.

Resentment is probably a good word for issue. No. Thank you. It's the truth. The truth.

You know, so and so suffering from this mind talk. I told them to go and wipe some candles and have a bath. Stop that. I don't understand that. You know?

This has burned the idea into the consciousness of every man that he can get well regardless of anyone. The only condition is that you trust in God and clean house. Trust in God steps 1 through 3, clean house steps 4 through 9, and go work with others. Remind the prospect that his recovery is not dependent upon people. It is dependent upon his relationship with god.

Back to the ABCs again. Also says here, you know, and this is what I'm learning at the moment is both you and the new man must walk day by day in a path of spiritual progress. The teacher and and Peter both said to me that once you wake somebody up, you walk with them for a while. Once you wake a baby up, you don't just leave it. You attend to it, you walk with it for a while.

You know? If somebody's had a spirit of truth, which proves it, it's all these steps, I need to walk with them for a while. Guide them a little bit. A bit. When we look back, we realize that the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands were better than anything that we could have planned.

I'll share this with you. Page 101. In our belief, any scheme of combating alcoholism which proposes to shield the sick man from temptation is doomed to failure. If the alcoholic tries to shield himself he may succeed for a time, but he usually winds up with a bigger explosion than ever. We have tried these methods, these methods to do the impossible have always failed.

And I speak with your experience from this and it will be the last time I mention this now but it's a consideration not a judgment or an observation but isn't 90 meetings in 90 days some kind of shield? My book says is that we need to get this person connected to God quickly through working the 12 steps. That's gonna give him a deep and effective spiritual experience. My experience with that is that 90 minutes to 90 days did shield me, but the internal condition called the spiritual malady was eating me alive, and I was constantly thinking about drinking or getting drink inside of those 90 days. Well, I didn't get better as a result of doing that.

I went to treatment. I was in treatment 7 months. That was a shield. I was locked up for the 1st 8 weeks. Wasn't even allowed out.

Couldn't even go buy sweets or diet Coke at the shop. I was given £10 a week to live on. Couldn't even move. 7 months in that facility, learning a lot of lot of information about recovery and about addiction and about triggers enabled with dysfunctional families. 40 days out of that facility I was drunk.

Chill. These attempts to do the impossible will always fine. This is why this works, guys. This is why I get so passionate about this. This is why I've been spending so long, so many years struggling with this, listening to all of these middle of the road solution for a guy like me, you know, reaching the point of desperation and becoming humble enough, being graced with some humility to finally do what somebody suggested me to do straight out of this book, take certain action that I didn't wanna take but just do it, that I've recovered.

And that's why I put myself on the firing line and I try and carry this message wherever I can. Sponsorship is a different deal. Pete can kinda go into that, but just touch on it gently around, sponsorship. Working with others, it really is is anything that can can carry this message. You know, we've got public information committees, we've got HNI committees, we've got, you know, literature commitments, treasury commitments, GSR commitments, welcomer commitments, secretary commitments, literature and chip commitments, anything.