The 12 suggestions meeting in Hermosa Beach, CA

Welcome to the Hermosa Beach Group's 12 suggestion meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous. Now will you join me in welcoming our speaker tonight, Deandre? Good evening. My name is Deandre, and I'm an alcoholic. Oh, yeah.

Grateful to be sober. First thing I noticed when I walk in the room is there's 2 bottles here to drink from, and now there's only 1. Yeah. Real alcoholic. Oh, god.

It's really good to be sober. Normally, I'm next door. I'm the secretary of the meeting next door while this meeting is taking place. And for the last several weeks, I've heard a lot of laughter from coming from over here, and it, it's kinda interesting to be over here right now. My sobriety date is May 29, 1991, which means I just celebrated, 15 years of sobriety a couple of weeks ago and, doing pretty good.

Life's good. You're looking at the problem, so there's no sense of talking about them. Mhmm. And this meeting is about sponsorship, which is not a problem. And this solution oriented meeting for me, reminds me of my first experience with this topic, of course, with my original sponsor.

His name is Dennis Lee, and I met him at a little small group in Lancaster, California called the Open Door. And that is where I went after I left the psych rehabilitation. And leaving, rehab and and and reestablishing myself in the community after about 11 months of sobriety. I had already started sponsorship in the rehab. I, was working with guys, at night, in the cafeteria before bed, going over the fundamentals of recovery.

Although I had completed several step packets in the rehab, I had not officially gone through the 12 steps of Alcoholics Anonymous. So I really after leaving that rehab, I was really aware of the fact that I was gonna have to be connected to somebody other than the people that I had already been connected to before I got sober in order to stay here. And I guess that's kinda like the running scene, if you will, in this program for sponsorship. It's about being connected. You know, and with that connection comes accountability.

You know, it's hard to wing it when you have a sponsor that's involved in it, And, basically, what happened for me is at a noon meeting at the open door 1 afternoon, I had been enjoying my sobriety for several months, and I wound up sitting through that meeting and hearing this guy share. And much, to my amazement and and being so miserable, he made me laugh. There was some laughter. He made a comment about the floors. He was talking about how the group was a high entry level group, and it really, you know, made me laugh.

I was very miserable that day. I had not gone through the steps like I said earlier, and I went up to that gentleman after that meeting and spoke with him, and he told me who he was. And I talked to him about my experience with AA, that I'd already worked my step packets in rehab. So I pretty much was looking around for a sponsor to kinda help me, you know, I guess, feel more a part of the group, but I really didn't need anybody to really help me with the first three steps because I had already basically kinda perused them. And he told me, that it sounded like I knew what I was talking about, but he wanted to tell me what he knew about the first three steps.

And that kinda screwed me up a little bit because I didn't know what he knew about the first three steps. And I think my my sponsor was an insurance salesman for 20 years. So he read 2 sentences into my bullshit, basically. Dry drunk cometh. And, and so we began to forge this relationship strictly around the steps.

And through doing that with him over a period of time, that relationship, went through the steps and started being connected with me in all my affairs. In other words, he was allowed to assist me in everything that I brought to him. And if he did not have the knowledge, the wisdom, or the experience in those areas, then he would get back to me after talking to some of his friends. And, through that, relationship, what's happened for me is that I've been sober since my very first meeting. I've, so far.

And and I think that when I started being honest with him about those secrets and the money and and and just how much prayer I was really doing, the meditation and the writing, and really getting out of my comfort zone as an alcoholic. You know, one of the really sad things about my disease is that it allows me to feel good while I'm killing myself. You know? And this euphoric recall that I often seek while I'm drinking has a way of metaphorically showing up in my sobriety. And if I don't have someone in my life cross examining my perception of reality, I'm a dead man talking, and I'm usually on the move, ducking and dodging and hiding and running from the things that I don't want you to see or deal with because I'm not dealing with them, so why should you?

So, basically, after forging this relationship and realizing after about 5 years sobriety working with this man that he had character defects, I also realized that he was an alcoholic and, the most harmful thing that I found out about this guy is he needed AA too. And once I recognized that I had a problem with this guy more than the fact that he knew all my secrets. And so I decided based on my own insanity. It was just one day he made me really angry. I went and I talked to him.

I said, I heard the speaker. He said that he after 5 years of sobriety, that his head came out of his ass, and I said, Dennis, I have 5 years of sobriety. You've been telling me that my head is up my ass. I'm 5 years sober now, and now my head is out. Right?

And he says, yeah. Your head is out, but your mouth is hanging out. And I did not think that that was And I did not think that that was very funny. So I went to look for a new sponsor. Just because of that, that was the reason why I got mad at him.

And I I searched for about a year. I went to the rafters. I I really searched far too. I went straight to the rafters, you know, and started talking to a guy named Jim Buckley and work with him for a couple of months, but it wasn't the same. And I knew it wasn't.

And I knew that, I had lied to myself, And I don't think it was because I had this self discovery. I think that Jim Buckley was so humble in his connection to AA that it was okay for him to let me know where I really needed to go. And I think that is so important around here because I've done freelance sponsorship from years 6 through 9 where I didn't care if I was your sponsor, I was going to sponsor you. And you could come up to me and ask me about a job or an application or a prayer or a page or anything, and I automatically assumed that you needed my sponsorship. You know?

And I began to advise you on everything, not just what you asked me about. And that that sort of got kinda crazy, you know, because people were coming to me, these other peoples because sometimes I think in AA, we're sort of looking for that cosigner when we're all done talking. We need I personally, when I'm living in self will and I'm not moving forward spiritually, I need someone to cosign that, you know. And I think that's what I was doing and, you know, Jim wasn't having it. You know?

And he just told me, man, you need to talk to your sponsor because the conversations would always go back to that, you know, that ass. You know, he said that, and, Jim was telling me that if I didn't deal with that resentment, that basically nothing nothing that I thought he had for me was gonna be there for me if I didn't get rid of that dishonesty and that fear. And, and I and I eventually went back, to Dennis and and asked for more help. And, we work with each other for several more years, and then a job opportunity, granted me the luxury of moving out of that area. Now I still use him as a spiritual adviser, but my new sponsor now for the past 3 to 4 years has been Jimmy Moss, and he's been sober for 22 years.

And Jimmy, has done for me what I can't do for myself, and I believe that my higher power uses he and others in AA to keep me from, you know, sponsoring myself. And I was taught in early sobriety that the ism of alcoholism is I sponsor myself. You know? And I know that today. I am the worst sponsor in the world for me.

You know, I do not have what it takes to love me through the steps, because I will hide from steps 4 through 9 until hell freezes over. And with, active sponsor in my life, you I can't escape those steps. Those I call them the stomach steps. So where I'm at today and getting through these relationships with these people and being a little bit more transparent than what I used to be, and there's a long period of reconstruction ahead, I'm sure. But getting to where I am now in my sobriety, I'm more involved with sponsoring people.

I sponsor men and women. I don't believe in men sticking with the men and women sticking with the women because it doesn't say that in the book. In fact, it's italicized over doctor Bob's story that he worked with about 5,000 men and women. And I believe that if I have something blocking me from being able to assist any alcoholic that I need to thoroughly have that inventory and possibly taken away by the grace of God. That I ought to be able to sponsor, gay gorilla training prostitute from Transylvania based on where I come from and where I've been in my life, which has been very short by the way.

I got here pretty young. And the hell and the torment and the insanity of, 15 years ago should not be blotted out, by my little feeble attempt to segregate what God has allowed me to be a part of, and I believe that's AA. One of the things that I've also learned from sponsorship is that when a newcomer is ready, there's not a damn thing you can do wrong. But when a newcomer is not ready, there's not a damn thing you can do right. They're not gonna buy this crap.

And, I can stand up here and tell you that being a sponsor of a lot of people makes me feel good. It makes me feel important. It makes me feel that people are really listening to me, but the basic connection that I have with really wanting to be an effective sponsor is because of God. It is not because of my own self will or my desires, because getting those phone calls and listening to those inventories and hearing someone's perspective on a lot of stuff with less than 30 ways of sobriety is not very enlightening on certain nights, evenings, and holidays. Okay?

But I believe that he did that for me. He did that for me. I called him from work, home, and play. And he always said something about AA to say, And I believe that it's my responsibility ethically and spiritually to try as best as I can to do that for other people. So if you're a newcomer and you don't have a sponsor, I don't really believe that you've made a full connection yet.

Furthermore, if you have been here for a while and you are not sponsoring anyone, I believe that you better start looking at some stuff, whatever that may be. I don't really know, and I'm feeling really enlightened, tonight. I, spent some time over at Jay's house this evening. I, I I was thinking about having a free meal at Bill and Ken's house, but I think I've used up my meal ticket over there. So I went over I went over to Jay's today, and we ate and talked and, and I and I love you, man.

I mean, I really you know, I can talk to you for 15 minutes, and it reaffirms 15 years of sobriety. It's amazing. You know things about me as well as certain people in this room that my own mother and brother don't even know. And that's what connecting myself to something real, is all about. You know?

Getting out of the problem, me, and then there's a solution which is you. And, sponsorship also real quick, and I'll try to summarize all this and be quiet. I love the question part of the format. Kinda reminds me of being at the podium at the White House. You know?

So those for myself in that, but, the the final thing, coming around the corner with this is that, you know, Bill, we went we did something very spiritual with this Hermosa group, the men's stag, the guys, Bill and Karen. They they took us all out on a field trip, basically. We had a little buddy system, and we all went down to see this little play in Hollywood, several months ago. And, boy, I really love that. That that was just something that I hope I never get drunk enough to forget.

We went down there and they just sort of they they they they showed us basically in a brief synopsis on what actually took place historically and and and realistically with these people that we all come from. We all come from that. And, when I saw my little weird perception of of of the play was that this stuff really works. It works all the time. It works real slow, and, and it's here.

It's kinda like being at a smorgasbord, and seeing all the food out because I like to eat. And you you see all you know, it's fried chicken and food, you know, and it's a big and and and you see people just aimlessly walking around the table starving themselves to death, not taking in any of this just plethora of of nourishment for not only not drinking, but being a real asset to the community. And and just being at that play that night and and watching all the guys that we interact with in that Monday night meeting and whatnot and some of the women from the Tuesday night group that were there, the husbands and wives and all that, it just made me feel that not only was I being sponsored and I sponsor other people, but it just made me feel like I was in the middle of AA. You know? Instead of hanging out on the fringes, judging people that are doing all the work, I felt like I was in the middle of Alcoholics Anonymous that night.

And in the play, however, one of the the unique things that I I I saw too that they because I tried I've done a little theater myself, little community theater when I was growing up. I used to be a part of this, this community theater group in Watts where I grew up, and that was the Westminster group. It was kinda like the little rascals on crack, basically. Basically. And we would, you know, we we we we would we would do that.

We would do these little plays and stuff that I I remember just seeing the the the way these actors and stuff were just sort of the but the guy who impressed me the most was the guy who played doctor Bob. I mean, the actor who played that character in that play. He just because I've read some other books and whatnot and not to the extent of Jay. Jay has a whole, you have to develop your own relationship with him. I know the secret.

But these kind of stuff over there and but I remember reading about doctor Bob, and I just I just love the fact that doctor Bob was just like, you know what? If you don't want this thing, that's really okay, but we gotta have it. The the the the men and women that are convinced. We gotta have it. But if you don't want this thing, that's really okay.

And I got that from the character, and I got that out of the play. And I guess that's what I wanna kinda end with is, you know, a lot of times, Jay and I were talking about some of the nicknames that that they give people in AA that are really involved with AA and not just sitting around agreeing with AA and say and staying sober based on that agreement that you agree with AA, but you're sober and congratulate, but you're not doing AA. And, one of the nicknames that I've been given in the last year or so is cult leader. I am the I I am the leader of the cult that said I go around and we take blood. And we are evil and we're bad, and we want people to read the book and work the steps and pay back the money and do the prayers.

That's that's the extent of our cult group. And and I and I it's just you know, it's amazing. It reminds me of, like, the bar, like, the bar room stuff. You know, seeking lower companions, coming into an AA to seek a lower you know, looking for a drinking buddy. I'm looking for someone that's gonna allow me to sit to stay exactly the way I am.

You know, and I just don't need that in my life right now. It's a very dangerous place for me to be. I I need enlightenment. I need change. I need the grace of God.

And not only do I need sponsorship, but I need to really understand that without AA, there's nothing. For me, there's not AA and then this. If I'm not allowed to take this way of life into any affair that I'm about to walk into, then I don't need to be there because these principles are universal. They're not circumstantial. And and and Alcoholics Anonymous has not only allowed me to make sense half the time, but it gives me an opportunity to make sense to other people as well.

People that say, yeah. Okay. I'll do it. And my sponsor taught me that if it's not unethical, immoral, or illegal, get it done or prepare yourself for another run. You know?

And that's how I was trained in that relationship. So, anyway, I think my final point that I'd like to make about this this topic is that a lot of times, I I feel as though that people think that there's like a a a choice in the matter. And, and those are the people who don't usually sponsor. They believe that they can do this other stuff and that sponsorship is just something that the real smart people like Jay or Bill, you know, that that that somehow if I just go ahead and do this kind of a commitment over here that it kinda weighs out as far as, trying to love somebody through these principles, and I I don't wanna get into a debate or anything about that, but all I know for me is that in the in in the chapter working with others, it says that when all these other things fail, which gives me the impression that they will come to a failure, not in a sense that it won't be a part of AA, but that when it comes to me not drinking, that something's gonna have to happen between me and another alcoholic in order to get to that higher power that could keep us both sober.

And if I don't have room for that in me spiritually, in most people's case, physically, because I know we're all of us are so busy, you know, doing all this stuff. But if I don't have room for that, I think what it does, it just it just makes my sobriety a little because I've gone without sponsoring people before. It just makes my sobriety feel a little shallow. I'm sober. I'm going to meetings.

I'm raising my hand and I'm sharing. I'm looking for some sort of a spiritual awakening as a result of my sharing. Really, I am. I'm doing all this stuff, but with the absence of trying to get somebody to help themselves with their family, the community, getting through the work, when I don't do that, for some reason, it just feels a little empty for me. Now everybody may not get that.

You know? I I don't I can't speak for everybody. I just know for me that I don't I don't feel real good when I'm not trying to fish out a newcomer and help them. I just feel kinda weird. Feel it feels like, you know, my head starts making room for doubt about other things when when I'm not sponsoring and helping as best as I can.

So, anyway, I'm grateful to be sober. I'm grateful that this group is here, and I'm grateful that Alcoholics Anonymous gives us an opportunity to help each other for real. There was a topic the other night at a meeting where the topic was service and everybody was sharing about it and I didn't get called. I'm sorry. I'm making up for that here.

He where they said that everybody would, you know, everybody talk about service. And for me, it's like when a normal person is not of service, it really probably doesn't kind of matter the way it matters for us. If we don't do it, we wind up drinking and killing ourselves. If they don't do it, they just sort of feel their way around other things and do other stuff, and that's really okay. I mean, I don't wanna be normal.

But it's just that this is something that really, really, really makes a big difference if you plan on being around here for a day or so, and that's all I wanna say. Thanks. But I just have a question. I, as a solo woman, she was my new friend, I could not identify with my own gender. And I and I know that I am not that's not uncommon that modest women can't identify with And if you're sponsoring a woman, don't you feel that that might be denying them?

Or is it just transitional? Or or is it just like you The question the question is, how in the hell are you sponsoring women? Is that is that is that is that is that basically because Steve told me to repeat the question that to prove to a living. Right? Well, you're allowing them to hide Okay.

I'm allowing the women to hide out. No. You're lying that they came to a friend of mine. And it's it's my Okay. Alright.

Well, the way that I look at it is, god and where they're hiding, most of them under certain circumstances. And I believe that we're, doing pretty good. I I don't really know how to answer the question except to say that more will be revealed. You know? Maybe in a year or so now, maybe I'll say, you know what?

That night that Karen called me on that, she was right. You guys go find women now, you know, or whatever. But something's gotta happen for me in order to go no when it comes to anything in AA. And I one last point on the question is, I was listening to Bill c tape number 3, I think it was, 3 or 4, and he made reference to people coming up to him after the meeting with, you know, 9, 10 plus years of sobriety saying, I don't have what you're talking about. Will you please help me?

And I don't recall if it were if it was men or whoever, but saying yes is more important than finding out who you're sleeping with, in regards to AA. And that's that's basically what I got to say about that. What about you, sir? Hey, Rick. Hey, Rick.

The stomach steps 4 through 9. Yeah. I love the description. Mhmm. Because it happened, I think, maybe not that.

I know what's happening. But it didn't go in my can you describe a little bit? The stomach steps? Yeah. Well, I mean, the first why do you call that?

I think I know why. Question is, the stomach steps. Talk a little bit about that 4 through 9. What do I mean by that? I don't know.

It's like the first three steps can be done on LSD. I mean, the form of alcohol. You just sit there. Oh, I have no power. There is a God.

You know? Please give me more. But when it comes down to the causes and the conditions of what make me thirsty, you know, It really bothers me because that's where you're gonna really show me that I have no power, that this stuff has been kicking my ass to a fairly well for a long time. And and a long time could mean 4 or 5 years on a guy or girl that's, like, 15 or 16 years old. It doesn't matter.

I mean, the way steps forward through 9 shake me, keep me really uncomfortable about not moving forward. And if I don't get with somebody and get rid of that stuff, I'm gonna block out the first three steps. So when I when I call him the stomach steps, it's like, there was a guy at Jay's house, before I got there, Dave. He and he was saying that they run this little group where it's like, God is here, and then we have all this stuff right here that's blocking us from getting to here. And I guess that's what I'm kinda saying metaphorically is that if if I don't deal with this stuff here, I'm never gonna get to here.

It's gonna be I gotta hang out with certain people in AA. I gotta work a certain job. I gotta have these fears that are set up for me. You know, the white man is keeping a brother down and all of that. You know, it's just this garbage that has nothing to do with how God's gonna take care of me and you.

It's all boogeyman stuff. You know, when I first got sober, you know, I moved to Lancaster. There are no black people in Lancaster in 1992. There are none of them. And the ones that are there, they're in CA.

We called it colored anonymous. You know? And if I would have waited around for my ethnic gender to show up, I would not be standing here with 15 years sober. So I I'm talking about that blockage in in in that gut stuff, the secrets that I ought to be able to share with anybody honestly anywhere in private to help me move forward and and and hopefully, the other individual that they're not just digging around in my life to be nosy and find out who I'm sleeping with, but to really make some sort of a spiritual connection with something that's gonna keep me from drinking and and and not be such a liar and get thirsty enough to wanna drink. I haven't wanted a drink in quite a while now.

I thought about it, but I try to keep clear enough to not really want 1. Saves my god a lot of work, I think. I saw 2 more hands. It was Curtis and then some what about, Curtis? I've had a lot of I've had a little bit of trouble, finding a I do 2 things.

I do a prayer, and I ask God to put someone in my life that needs to go through the steps. I don't ask god to put someone in my life who I can help. I work with autistic children. I mean, I'm doing that pretty much every day. But that one prayer, I asked my higher power and the second thing I do is after the meeting, I talk to the people that ain't talking to nobody.

I don't run up and talk to the people that are talking to people. I run up and I talk to the people that are alone, that are by themselves. You know, if a newcomer identifies in a meeting as a new person, if they're in a healthy meeting, they're gonna be slammed by 5 or 6 guys automatically. Women are gonna be running over. You know, they're gonna be but when I try and most of the people that I sponsor now, I'd say over half of them are people that I talked to that were alone at the time.

What nobody running up to and saying, hey. I'll help you. And it's usually people that have time sober. Jay was telling me that today about, you know, having the establishment of, you know, having all these people in your life and everything. But when you're real when I'm really dealing with something that I really don't really wanna do if I'm hiding from something, you know, a lot of times, I won't say anything.

I don't care if a man, woman, or bears in front of me. Me. I'm gonna I'm gonna lie. I'm gonna practice some self dishonesty, and and and I just thank God for the people that are able to just kinda see that, you know. And I I'm also a behaviorist, so I watch people and I pay attention to what they're doing.

I've listened to people all my life. I I I don't mind listening. I'm not really good at it, but I'm more into watching because I'm not because I'm nosy, but because I'm afraid and I some you know, I I I have fears and I wanna pay attention to what's going on. So in answer to your question, I do 2 things. I do that prayer, and I talk to the guys that are standing off alone.

And I don't care how long they've been sober or what the hell they raised their hand for in the meeting. Because I don't know about you, but my big book says that we do loneliness a little bit differently than anybody else. That that aloneness is something else. It's a trip. Okay.

Ira? Ira. Hey, Ira. Ira. Doctor, what do you do when you're sponsoring a guy or a woman, your case of guest?

Who's wandering off the path. He's been around for a while and been wandering off the path and doing less meetings and not connected and just drifting. You just have to talk with him so many times. They just keep drifting. What do you do?

Do you? I'm just calling them. Do you just keep pointing out jets? It just depends. I mean, the question is, what do you do with somebody that's off the beam?

It just depends on the situation. I don't try to carbon copy it. It's not a robot. Each woman that has come and asked me for help, each guy, each young person, each old person. I mean, I've had guys ask me to sponsor them that have more sobriety than I have.

That's really weird. I don't understand that at all, but I would never ask anybody younger than me to be my spot dog. Just kidding. You never know what that pain that pain builds up. You never know what you'll do.

You'll ask a butt naked turtle for help. You know? So if you got alcoholic pain the way I have it and there's no alcohol around, there's no telling me. What do you do when they're off the path? You pray to God that they get back on it, and you and you and and earlier what I said about availability, I try as best as I can to make myself available.

That does not mean that I am not gonna deny them the truth. I'm a very assertive person, especially when it comes to sponsorship. Now I'll beat around the bush when it comes to anything because I have fears, and I wanna be liked. But when it comes to AA and that direct connection that you're talking about that you don't believe they're getting, I'm very clear, and I am I am I am not above suggesting that they find someone else to help them. And and the only reason why I do that is because a friend of mine, 19 year year old friend of mine, named Brian Bevan, I was in the store that I used to work at, up in Lancaster, and he smelled like booze.

He looked horrible, and I didn't tell him anything because in regards to the truth. I said, you look great. I I hope you come back. He died 5 days after that. And I still have pain and frustration over that death.

Not because God took him away or alcoholism killed him. It's because I probably had an opportunity to tell him the truth and I didn't. So I do not believe in stringing people along, in in in the sense that not that they'll get it, but that when they're right there with me at that moment, you said those talks, I tried to make sure that I'm not being dishonest with them about the true nature of their malady. But as far as, like, making them do AA and and and making them see it my way and all that stuff, I I've been accused of that. I I know that for me, my sponsor didn't screw around with this stuff, And he was not above or beneath telling people you need to find somebody else that can really help you because I think that's where the hiding really is.

It's not necessarily that he's hiding from you, but he's hiding from what he really has to do. And I believe that if he's been around here, a certain amount of time, the big book in the 4 to the second edition describes a substantial amount of sobriety as 2 years. There's these two paragraphs of information, and you have to use a little logic and you do the math, and it's 2 years. And I believe after 2 I mean, look at it. Drunk or sober, you pretty much hear about everything you're probably gonna hear.

So if he's doing that, he knows it, and you just telling him that is probably good enough. Maybe eventually he'll, you know, do the right thing, but, I've had to say goodbye to people, before. And I know that that seems a little harsh. I know people should people say that you should never turn down an AA. But am I really turning down AA if they continue to do it that way?

If they're really not doing AA, then how am I turning down AA? That makes sense. So I just try to stay available, and if and if they're willing, I'll be there. But if they're not, I'm not either because remember, I can drink real quick. The only thing that that newcomer offered Bill Wilson or excuse me.

The only thing Bill Wilson offered Abby when he went over to do the call was a drink. He offered he offered Abby a goddamn drink out of everything he coulda offered him. He was coming over there to save his life, And the only thing that Bill as a newcomer could do is say, have a drink, buddy. And I'm not gonna let any alcoholic put me in that position. I because I'll probably wind up taking it.

I I like drinking. You know? Anymore. Bill? Thank you.

That is not. I don't know. You know, mechanically, how do you work The question is, how do you walk them through the process mechanically? I do a couple of things. A lot of the stuff is intimate.

A lot of the stuff is personal. My sponsor started out with those biggest fears. What's going on? Why have you come to me? You know, the great Deandre.

What's really happening? So it's really not that mechanical at the beginning because I need to know what he or she is really dealing with. Most people that are new don't realize that they're dealing with alcoholism. They believe that they're dealing with a circumstance or a condition three dimensionally. My mom's a bitch.

You know? My job is you know? They won't let me whatever. And so once I listen to what they're saying, I can usually start off with a a self honesty assignment. Have them define self honesty in the dictionary and write about that.

And And then I ask them, what's the most honest thing they've done all day today? And if they tell me they made their bed or they they were able to pay their own way at lunch, then I tell them that they've got it backwards. That the most honest thing that you can do all day to day is not drink if you're an alcoholic. And that also lets me know that they're kinda, whacked off. They're they're kinda crazy.

You know? So I have a set of assignments that he gave me that I give my, but it it's I fit it around their life and what their needs are, but it's a set group of little things that he asked me to do that are out of the book. I mean, they don't tell you to look up self honesty in the big book, but if you don't know what it is, how would it hurt you to look it up in the dictionary. I think one of the most spiritual books in AA is a dictionary, quite frankly. Lot of words didn't make sense to me when I what the hell is a milady?

You know, like a so he gave me permission to allow the big book you know, the book was written, helped me in 1938, published in 1939. There's a lot of words in there that, you know, vestitude. Jugger knot. Jugger knot. Yeah.

This institute, is that how you say it? Okay. Thanks. We got a guy telling me how to say it. It's the lawyer.

Be careful. So in answer to your question, there are yes. There is a set of little things that I have been taught by my original sponsor to to do, but I always try to base it around what the what the guy or gal needs and not what I just want them to have. You know? Some people don't need to talk to me every single day, but I asked them to call me every day because I might drink.

They're calling to make sure they don't have a drunk guy because I've known people who've drank, lied about their sobriety, and they're running around in AA helping everybody. And, so I asked my to call me every day because I might be drunk. I I might take that first drink. There's a good chance that it could happen. Not because I'm off the beam, but because this disease has never left me.

Never. It's still here right now. So that's what I do. Any more? What about you, sir?

Yeah. Jimmy is my name. I'm a follow-up. Hi, Jimmy. He's about, going up and that didn't even know they were much sponsored, but they were back ordered.

I think they caught on eventually. Mhmm. And and I was wondering if you think that's alright. Right. Question is, should I have more than one sponsor?

Personally, I don't have that experience. And I think it'd be pretty judgmental of me to kinda comment on that. But an answer to your question, no. I I would not feel comfortable with more than one sponsor. I have spiritual adviser.

I have people that I talk to about Alan Watts and Joseph Campbell. But meanwhile, back at the ranch, I'm looking for a fan club, not a fellowship as an alcoholic. And actively in my sickness, I I just know how manipulative I am. I I, I just do not feel comfortable having more than one sponsor. I I don't suggest that to my sponsors.

In fact, if one of the people that I sponsor came up and told me, well, I have this other guy that's that's sponsoring me in addition to you, then I would probably not consider myself that person's sponsor anymore. I just, I don't have that experience. I don't know how to do that. Am I willing to learn that? No.

Because I believe that if it's not broke, I don't need to fix it. So I've never had more than one sponsor, and I seem to be doing a little okay. I mean, I got some stuff going on, but you didn't ask me about that. I'll take one more and then Steve's about to body slam me. That's awful.

Yeah. In about, the whole time you're talking, I was thinking about all the things I can do in 3 minutes. Not good. The the one thing that real quick quick answer is that I I just believe that that alcoholics are so full of shit that it is not and I'm not looking at you going, hey. You're full of shit.

I'm I know personally with my own, special brand of BS. It's easier to work to people than it is to work to program. It's a lot for me personally. I mean, I and and so what I believe is that page 96 in the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous covers a lot of these Coda type issues that I don't wanna break the 10th tradition. You know, you got a lot of undercover Ellingtons in AA.

They're sitting around here helping people to death. I don't believe that Karen accused me of that earlier, but I'm just saying that a lot of times, people are hanging out and you it's like, you know people that are from AA, but they're not in AA. And it's up to me to be honest with myself. And so an answer to your question, it's like, what is your stomach telling you and how's your sponsor feel about it? You know, that's who I would talk to because my sponsor knows my little Klingon issues with folk, and he knows whether I'm really trying to help somebody or if I'm trying to help myself or if I'm trying to, you know, he knows all that stuff.

And that's one of the reasons why I don't have more than one sponsor is because I need that red phone. There's an old Batman series that used to come on when we were kids, and they're the commissioner used to have a red phone. Whenever he needed Batman immediately, no no no caller ID or nothing. Just the red phone. And, if I don't have that kind of red phone metaphor going, there's no telling, you know, what I'm gonna be trying to do.

I'll be trying to 12 step somebody, that really doesn't want it. So I go by page 96 and answer to your question. I suggest you read that and talk to your sponsor. Steve, I'm done.