The topic of sponsorship at the Men Among Men Conference in Reykjavik, Iceland

You should see him trying to explain what those are when we go through the metal detector at the airport. Very bizarre. I'd like to start off with a little announcement. I have here a pad, name, and email address. Now, we've used some materials here this weekend, the Akron manual and Gresham's law.

If you'd like to receive that from us, put your name, please print so I can read it, and your email address and I'd be happy to send it to you. I also send out, on a daily basis, three little quotes. Not all big book, generally spiritually related, but sometimes you'll get some weird stuff in there, you know. I promise no jokes, no chain letters. So and if you don't want the the daily thing, you can always just email me and tell me please take me off.

My and for the tape, if you're gonna play this, my email address is billc@craigtools, craigt0ols.com. And, I've got some cards if you'd like it, but if you'd like to receive this, please sign up on the email list. Thank you. Hi, Matthew. I'm an alcoholic.

Hi, Matthew. So were you starting off the habit? Okay. We're gonna talk to you the second workshop. This is officially the second workshop.

How was Jay's history workshop, you guys? Month. When we when we get to that point where where where Bob and Bill meet it in that all that whole build up, it's just it's thrilling to me. But, we're gonna talk about how the how of it. We started with the why of it, and the how of it is, has evolved for us.

It's changed over time. The program hasn't changed, but our understanding of how to of how to pass the program along more effectively. Our goal has always been to grow in maximum effectiveness to God and our fellows. And we're gonna start off with, we're gonna do the hierarchy in the room. We're gonna start off with Jay and then eventually lead to how he ended up sponsoring Bill and then down to me.

It's a sad saga. We could call it a sobriety saga. Jay alcoholic. I did it. And God's doing for me today what I couldn't do for myself because chimney, it's like 3:45 on a Saturday afternoon and no drinks all day, which is a big deal for a guy like me.

Anyway, as I've said on a number of occasions, I came to you on the 2nd day of May in 1979. And I'll tell my pathetic story tomorrow so you can hear all the, you know, the gory details. But, anyway, a nice guy I know I I know you can't believe this, but a nice guy like me ends up in Alcoholics Anonymous. And I'm sitting there, and I'm just going, oh my god. And and, so I I, I end up, almost drinking, and I get a sponsor.

And I'll tell that story tomorrow. And, and so I I asked this guy to be my sponsor. It's I came in on a Wednesday. It's Saturday. I've been, the night before I'd almost drank, I walk into the to the room.

The club opened at 10 o'clock for the noon meeting. I'm sweating on the Naugahyde couch. A little old woman with a bun in her hair and a black dress on and correct shoes, looks like she's been to mass 8,000 times, Comes in and she goes, oh young man, you knew, aren't you? She said, I can tell you the secret of Alcoholics Anonymous in 4 words. What are they?

She smiles at me and she says, find God or die. Not that. But the great news is we're an Alcoholics Anonymous. And, we will never presume to tell you what kind of god it is that you have to find. And so I'm at this meeting, and there's a guy with 4 years taking a cake for 4 years sobriety.

So I asked him to be my sponsor. And, I started to read the book book Unsupervised, and and we'd get together on Fridays. And we'd have dinner, he and I, and his wife, and our Al Anon friend. And he would talk to me, and they would laugh at us. And, and it was it was grand entertainment.

And, the AA that I got sober in was kinda went like this. Are you reading the book? Oh, yeah. I'm reading the book. Are you, have you done your 3rd step?

Oh, yeah. I've done my 3rd step. Are you, have you write your are you on your inventory? Oh, yeah. I'm writing my inventory.

Okay. Good. Good. Are you ready to do your 5th sale? Well, yeah.

We'll do it soon. And, and that was kind of the AA that I got sober. And the AA that I got sober in, it was a hub of activity. I mean, all you had to do was go down to the Ilano club and sit there, and the phone would ring, and there'd be some drunk to go and pick up. And so there were always there were always working with others, always working with others.

But the big book was not out. People were not, you know, pointing at the book and pointing their finger and pointing at the book and pointing their finger. They were just pointing their finger and talking. And my sponsor so I get I get, you know, I'm about 24 days sober. I'm reading the book without supervision.

I see if I don't do an inventory. I'm gonna drink. I go to my sponsor. He gives me the instructions. The instructions he gave me first, he gave me the 4th step prayer.

Step prayer goes like this. God, I don't know what the heck I'm doing. Help me, please. And then he said, get a get a get a notepad. And then he said, get really jacked up on coffee.

He says, sit down in the kitchen. Look at the kitchen door. Think about who you hate. Entire political parties are fine. Who you're afraid of, Your your afraid of.

Your family. He said, take a sit there and think about every place that you've lived in your life. And then kinda come up with a parade of like all the people that you went to school with, the jobs you had. And if somebody walked through the door and your stomach would go like that, write their name down, you get 3 sentences as to why. Nobody's life's that interesting.

And he said, write down the life forms that you've woke up with. And he said, no. It was it was the seventies. It was disco. It wasn't really a lifestyle choice.

They just kinda ended up there. Whose chaps are those anyway? And, and and he said, write down what you're afraid of and, money you owe. And he said, and so I did he said, shouldn't take you long. It took me about 3 and a half hours.

Was it a fearless and thorough moral inventory using all 4 columns? No. It was the greatest hits. I woke up with a yak. Yak again.

Yak. 2 yaks. I mean, come on. I mean, it was the greatest hits. The other, the other way that it was described to be is think of it like a, you know, those rotisserie chickens that have the spit in it that are just there cooking away?

What what we do in that first inventory is we write all that stuff that drips down into the heat. We want because that's the way our minds are. When we hit the pillow, you make sure that all that stuff that goes on around and around and around your mind, that's the stuff that you write down. So I did that. And he came over, and it took me a little while to read my inventory to him.

And silly prayers and we burned the, burned the inventory. Oh my God, what happened to your 8 step? You know, well, I you know, we wrote the list a little bit later. We said the silly prayers, and he sent me off to start making amends at 25 days sober. I'm a fully engaged vested member of Alcoholics Anonymous.

Now I know that there's a bunch of people in here who are going, how could he possibly have survived? Well, you know, that's the AA that I came into. And I'm busy with the activity, and I'm making amends, and I'm doing my stuff. And and, and so, I was really excited. You know?

I was on fire. I'm I'm picking liquor stores. I'm singing a a hymns. You know? I'm driving up and down.

The old timers would say you know, they got the call in at the Alano club. You know, I got my Pinto. It's kinda like his AMC card. It's a in America, it's a joke on wheels. And, I'd been living in the car before I came to AA.

I wasn't homeless. It was just my outdoorsman phase. And, anyway, I, you know, I'd be down at the lawn club and the guys would say, there's a call. Go pick them up at this address. Don't talk to them on the way back.

We'll talk to them when they get here. You just bring them here. Okay? But it I I got my first guy to sponsor when I was 28 days sober, you know? And like 3 or 4 weeks later, he got a real sponsor, but he was with me long enough.

Again, God used me long enough to get him to somebody that he could. And I was working with people left and right all the time. And since I did not have a complete kit of spiritual tools at my disposal, You know, I was staying sober myself, and I was helping people as best I could. And, that was the Alcoholics Anonymous that I came into. But the thing that was interesting to me over time was is that not a lot of folks were seem to be staying sober.

And it occurred to me that something might be a little askew. Now it didn't seem to be askew really with any of the folks that were around me either. I mean, we were all doing the same thing. In those days, I mean, people weren't even witnessing 3rd steps a lot. It wasn't the kind of spectator sport it is today that I helped make it.

And, I used to have a meal with me down on the beach on a busy day. You know? Lots of people roller skating by. But still is. So, anyway, what occurred to me is is the people that I was working with weren't as desperate as I was.

See, because if my sponsor even pretended that he might be doing something, I was there because I was afraid I was gonna drink. My first three months of sobriety, I was thirsty. I was really thirsty. Every third thought was about a drink, and I needed to drink. I'm, no.

We're not drinking. We're not. No. We need to drink. You know?

And I I'm during all this, I'm going to meetings and doing the stuff, you know, and I'm I'm, you know, stopping at the liquor store every morning to get 2 packs of cigarettes and a 6 pack of Coca Colas, because I don't know how to drive and not have a beer in my hand? Who knew you could use 2 hands to drive? Thank god we got lattes now because it's the same thing. Anyway, so I'm I'm I'm, you know, I'm busy doing everything that I can, then my sponsor vaporized. He moved off to another place real quick.

Little disturbance with his wife. And so I looked around AA for somebody who, was oh, and the other thing that my sponsor did for me was that he gave me this thing about the activities. You know, in other words, that old man now you have to remember this is 1979. Okay? You know, full tilt disco era.

Sexual, addiction was not part of the lexicon in those days. We just slept with everybody, enjoyed it a lot. No problem there. Multiple partners. It's a good time.

My sponsor said to me, I'm 2 weeks sober. He goes, we have a Wednesday night speaker meeting at the club where everybody comes midweek to try and get laid. That mop was passed through people that I from me through people I sponsored, and then people that my wife sponsored for like 12 years. And it moved from the Alano Club to the to the sanctuary meeting. But I mean, you know, this thing about getting commitments.

Now why is it that we have the people mop the floor? It, but my sponsor was showing me how to cut myself off from the rest of the herd and demonstrate that I wanted to stay sober to my new community. I didn't realize that that's what I was doing. But what happened is is while I'm busy mopping, people that were active members of Alcoholics Anonymous would come up and go, hey, who are you? Pleased to meet you.

That kind of stuff. You know, it wasn't a hazing. It was a it was a way of of introducing myself to the community and allowing them to meet me. And it and it works really, really well. And it and it works really, really well.

So, I asked this guy who now I'm maybe a year and a half sober, and I ask a guy who's got the problems that I want. He's got the hammer wife. He's got the big house. He's got the beautiful kids. This is these are the problems that I want.

So I asked this guy to be my sponsor. You know, not I don't want you know, I don't want who you have, I don't think. And and Pat, taught me some really cool stuff. He he taught me that the purpose of being a sponsor is to kick somebody into the night step as quickly as possible. Absolutely as quickly as possible.

And that he gave me a couple other good things. He said, you can say to somebody, if they've said the same thing to you 2 or 3 times or they're they're talking to you all the time, he said, you can say to them, I will be happy to speak to you, but first, you have to go to an AA meeting and see somebody who's in worse condition than you are and speak to them for a little while. Ask them about themselves, then I'll be happy to talk to you. And he also gave me another really vicious sponsor trick, which is ask them to write about it and then call you with what it is they've written. That's really thermonuclear, man.

You know, I mean, it's when you're really gonna be mean to him, do that. So so that was good, but this man was having some problems in his home and and and in his family. And they were very, very serious problems, and they were consuming his life. And, he wasn't going to AA, and I didn't want that to be my experience, that if I had great problems, that I would not come to AA. I even invited him to come up to another meeting with me that was out at that area of town, and he just he just couldn't do it.

And so I went and I asked the man that I admired most in Alcoholics Anonymous to, to be my sponsor, a guy by the name of Fred. Now when Pat somewhere in this this period where where Pat's my sponsor, I'm still not really I don't feel like I'm being effective. I'm like, Bill, in the beginning, you know, I'm I'm I'm I'm sober. I'm staying sober myself, but it doesn't seem that people are what I did was is I said, well, I know. Because there were a lot of people who were but what I did was is I said, well, I know because there were a lot of guys that were wonderful examples of AA.

So this is trick number 1. If you ever wanna know anything from another alcoholic, take them to lunch and ask them about themselves. They will talk forever. And so what I did was there were there were 4 guys that I admired, and I I asked each of them to lunch separately, and I took a, a pad of paper, and I said, what did your sponsor do with you, and what do you do with your? And I wrote it down, and I found you know, I just compared the notes and all this stuff.

And and it was really, really interesting to me about all the different stuff that people were doing. But what really came to me was they were talking about the big book. They were talking about the steps. And what I've been doing along this time was I've been trying to be their friend. I've been trying to be their adviser.

I've been telling them what I thought. Really dangerous. And and so what I did was I started, you know, actually saying, I want you to read the big book before you come over to the house. I want you to read this part, and then I want you to read that part. And then when you come over, you know, we'll talk about it.

I want you to highlight stuff that you identify with, circle stuff that maybe you don't identify with. We'll talk about it. And, and so that's what I do. And then they'd come over and I'd pontificate about what it is that they they they read. And that worked really good.

I started to have guys that were staying sober, and they're they're and and I'm not I'm not counting really, but but, you know, it just seemed that my my sobriety family is starting to to grow a little bit. And it's but of course, the other thing is is that by now, I'm like 3 and a half years sober. And I'm starting to know some stuff and I'm I'm I'm actually growing in effectiveness. As you're growing in effectiveness, you're growing along spiritual lines. Don't worry about where you are on the path.

And god bless each and every one of you that are here today because you're interested in growing along these spiritual lines. So I'm going along and, I've got this format kinda down and and things are going well. And and then I start having them read the book aloud to me, because I find that they're not reading the book. They're saying they are. They may highlight a couple places, but they're not really reading the book.

They're just coming over, and I'm pontificating. So now I start having them read the book to me. Now I'm about 6 years sober, and it's going great guns. We're actually reading the book aloud together. When we get to the step, we do it.

It's it's it's going it's going great. Bill shows up, and we start, and he'll he'll talk a bit about that. You know? I'm just there at the river watching people when Bill shows up. I want you guys to know that these are 2 of the most wonderful members of Alcoholics Anonymous I've ever met.

And if you have a chance tonight to come and he'll hear Bill talk in person, he's one of the best speakers, and his family's history is one of the most wonderful things. And I kid him a lot, and he kids me unmercifully. And we both deserve it. But, what happened is is I've got this guy who, was my my sponsor at the time. His name was Fred.

And Fred was one of the great members of Alcoholics Anonymous in the South Bay of Los Angeles. He was one of these guys, Joe Moats, who was a legend in AA, had been his sponsor, and Fred was like he was like a member of a group that was 2 and a half hours away on a Friday in awful Los Angeles traffic, and every other week, he would drive a speaker from Los Angeles down to that meeting to speak. That kind of a guy. People who did stuff. They went around and started meetings and supported meetings started, and and he was just he was a wonderful guy.

He was a marine. He and, and when I asked him to be my sponsor, I asked him to be my sponsor because of all the people that I knew in Alcoholics Anonymous, he was the man I admired most. If you're looking for a sponsor, go to somebody that you admire. Not that you want what they have, but that you admire. And I went up to this man, and I asked him to be my sponsor.

And he said, yeah. Sure, Jay. I'll I'll be your sponsor, but you gotta know something. I'm a busy guy, and I got a lot of stuff going on. And I'm active at Alcoholics Anonymous.

And he said that when you want me, you may not be able to get me. This is before pagers and cell phones. I mean, people stayed sober then, believe it or not. I know it's I know it's difficult without global positioning. We're thinking about putting chips in our sponsors, you know, so we can track them.

What's he doing over there with her? But he said, if you want me, you may not be able to find me, but I will always be there if you need me. And this has been true with him and with the guys that I've worked with is they can't get me all the time. But if they need me, they can always find me. So, Fred's my sponsor, and and and about this time, this is 1985, I'm 6 years sober, man, and I'm doing it.

I'm secretary of the big speaker meeting. I got a whole bunch of spawn seats. Life is on. I got the big job. I'm flying around.

I got a credit card with my name on it and a company and all that stuff, man. And, I mean, the promises are coming true. Anyway, so I'm a secretary of this big meeting and all these people that care about me are saying, Jay, you're too busy. You have too many. You've got this.

You've got that. My wife gets sober. Who knew? Who knew? And, Jacqueline gets sober, man, and I and and life is on, man.

We are just we are just on. It's it's and it's going great. And I'm standing there one day, and this guy at the Wednesday night meeting comes up. And his name was Kevin. Kevin's a tall guy, and he'd, he had a big tray call from when they put the tube when he had the accident, and he'd been a paraplegic.

He'd been to stuck in a wheelchair, and he'd actually gotten out. He was able to he was able to very difficultly get around. And he just gotten out of jail, and I think he was still in his orange jumpsuit because he didn't have any clothes when they picked him up. And he comes to the he comes up to me after the meeting with this court card slip, and, I mean, his glasses looked like they hadn't been cleaned since the Carter administration. And, and he was just dirty.

And he said, will you be my sponsor? And I said, I decided that this was the moment that I was gonna take care of myself, that I was gonna make a stand for my family, my friends. I was really gonna become an engaged member of society. And so I said, Kevin, no. I can't help you, but I'll be happy come with me to my Monday night meeting, and I will introduce you to the men who I would rely upon to save my life, and we'll find you a sponsor there.

And I was so pleased with myself that I called up my sponsor, Fred, and I said, Fred, guess what? I made a stand for me. There's a long pause, and Fred says, you did what? You? He said, go and find that man what was given to you.

Click. Fred had never hung up on me. Unfortunately, I was able to go and find Kevin. And Kevin had left school in the 4th grade, and he couldn't read. And I started just to try and get things moving a little faster, would have him read a page, and then I'd read a couple pages, and then he'd read a page, and then I'd read a couple pages, and then he'd read a page.

And what happened is is that every time Kevin left, I felt better, and it was because I was on the same level. Who knew? And so Kevin gave me the last piece that I didn't have, which was reading the book aloud, turning pages 1 on 1 with another person. And this is 1985. And from that really has sprung all the wonderful work.

I mean, there's all the stuff that that came before then, and and like I like to say, the best sponsors in the world are the people who are between 3 5 years sober. They're running Alcoholics Anonymous anyway. You know? But they really are. They've got the fire and all that stuff.

But but after I became 6 and 7, I really started to have an approach that seemed to work for me that seemed to work for me. And, and so that's what was my life was like when Bill came along. Hi. 1985, I had just gotten out of a hospital program. I had spent 35 days in there, and, it was a good program.

It was a place in Costa Mesa called Starting Point. And, tonight we'll talk about how I ended up there, but, I got out of there. And in that program, they work you up through a 5th step. They happy actually have you write out an inventory and do a 5th step, and they have some church people there that'll listen to your 5th step. And I I did my 5th step.

And then and then they turn us loose. And we end up in the world's aftercare program, AA. And, so I'm banging around Alcoholics Anonymous, and I don't feel good about it. I I'm standing in the back of the room judging you. And, finally, I see this guy, and he's around all the time.

He's at all the meetings, him and his wife. And, it looks like he knows everybody, like he's connected, and I needed a sponsor that was connected. I didn't want just like a regular sponsor. I wanted a hip cool sponsor. You know, I wanted the the right sponsor.

And so I walked up and I asked him to if he would help me. He said, be at my house Thursday at 5 o'clock. Read the doctor's opinion and make notes in the margin of what you agree with and what you don't, and we'll discuss it. So I showed up there and he did not trust me that I had read it. And he had me sit there and read it to him out loud.

And I fell into this thing. I mean, right after we started doing this is when the Kevin thing happened to him. And here's what happened when the Kevin thing happened. I was around when this geek walked in, and he would this guy was ugly. You know, he he wasn't you know, he was he this was an ugly man and he stunk and he was crippled and stupid.

And, and yeah. He had it all going for him. This is the guy that you say, oh, he'll never make it. He's too screwed up. You know?

I mean, some people are just too screwed up. And I was standing in the kitchen of Jay's kitchen of his house, and he started telling me about what happened to Kevin. He told me that he'd turned him down and that he'd called his sponsor. And his sponsor said, you can't do that. You gotta go find him.

And he told me that he went and found him, and then he begged his forgiveness, and asked him if he could please help him. And I remember that day standing in that kitchen, and I'm I'm 37, 38 years old. I've been around a little bit, I thought. And and I've never seen anything like this before. I mean, I started crying.

I mean, it did touched me in a place that I didn't even know that I had. And I remember leaving that day. And at some point later, I was going on a panel and I told this guy Clayton. I I told him what happened. I said, God, I'm standing in this kitchen.

I was just overwhelmed with this feeling of love for the guy. And Clayton says, well, did you tell him? And I go, hell no. You know? And, he says, well, you should tell him.

You know, we need to hear that. You know? You should tell him. So we were at Rocky Cola. It used to be Bob's big boy by the club and we had dinner one night and I sat across the table from him and I told him how much I loved him.

And he started crying and I'm crying. It was pathetic. It was pathetic. And I didn't know then but he cries at supermarket openings. And there was no restriction on his tear glands, you know.

He just and we're holding hands, you know? It was like I kinda like felt like Bill Wilson felt when he woke up the next morning and realized what he'd done, you know. And I might have been seen, you know. But that began the journey. So what he did, what happened to me in my upbringing in AA, what happened to me, is I sat there with this guy week after week after week.

And each week we read a chapter in the book, just the 2 of us alone in his house. And I got to where I really looked forward to that time together. Somebody was taking time with me, really teaching me what was going on. And I would I was good. I didn't know.

I figured all of you were doing this. How would I know any different? I thought this is how it was done. I thought there was a manual or something. And what you did is you found somebody and you sat and you went to class.

Just like if you were taking algebra. And he's standing at the board, you know, with the circles and arrows explaining the theory behind the textbook. Because you you can teach yourself algebra. You know what I mean? You could read the book and then work the problems at the end of each chapter and then keep doing it until you get the right answer.

But in the book, doesn't really explain in-depth the theory behind algebra. The fact that the math is a language. It speaks. It's a language. It's saying something.

It isn't just solving problems. It isn't just checking this each thing off the list. It's a way to live. And there's discussion that goes along with it. It's not enough just to read the book.

Read the book. Well, after the 75th time that you read it, it has more meaning, doesn't it? I mean, Bill Wilson jumps out of that thing. The person Bill Wilson, comes out of the book. You suddenly realize this is a real guy.

This this actually happened to this guy. You you you watch the screen and you see, oh, Roland Hazard was the guy that went to talk. These are real live people whose lives completely changed. He said to me when I'm reading the book and the doctor's opinion, he said, in the doctor's opinion, it describes 4 or 5 different kinds of alcoholics. He stopped me and he said, which one are you?

And we talked about it and I said, well, I think I'm this one here. He says, well, circle it. Put a star next to it. You're in the book. Woah.

And he explained to me, he said, this book is about you. It isn't written to you. It's about you. And if you can't find yourself in there, there's a problem. But you've just told me you found yourself.

You're on the path. Here we go. Hang on. The doctor's opinion says that the only thing that's gonna save an alcoholic of that variety is a complete psychic change. He explained to me that his job as my sponsor was to guide me through this process that would bring about a psychic change in me, that would put me in touch with a power greater than myself that would solve my problems.

He said, I'd be happy to sit here and talk to you about what you think your problems are, not about how your day went. I didn't know any different. I I saw other people sharing about their day, but he told me not to do that. In essence, you know, that he would do that with me. What I understand now is that there are people in Alcoholics Anonymous all over the world that think that going to meetings is doing AA.

And when you hear them in the meetings sharing about the same problem over and over and over again, Or whenever they share, all they talk about is themselves and what's going on. They'll start they'll start their share off with, well, today was pretty good. I mean, they're like reporting in, you know. And you know why this and then and I'm not putting these people down. This is a reality in Alcoholics Anonymous.

They don't have a sponsor. The meeting is their sponsor. And it works. It's the medium. It's part of the medium AA.

I mean, you could come in and dump, and then you should clean it up. You know? I think that there should be a little cleanup action, you know? Maybe they have somebody they call sponsored, but they're not talking to them. Maybe they don't have a sponsor at all.

Process. You know, he he explained to me that that more as I understand it now that the first step is good news. It's not bad news. That I've been relieved of the job of managing my life. I'm power this is like freedom.

Some people say the first step is we're screwed. I don't think so. I think the first step is we're unemployed now. You know? Look at the wonderful job we've done up to this point.

My management skills are incredible. You know. I'm in AA. I mean, the evidence is stunning. I'm a newcomer in AA.

I'm a loser. Right? I'm a loser. The second step then becomes operable. I need a new manager.

Restore me to sanity. Keep me from drinking. 3rd step then become what do you do with the new manager? You turn your life and will over. What else is there to do?

Management job. I take my business portfolio and hand it off, you know? You run it. I'm done. You run it.

I'm done. You run it. So what life and will? The 4 step. Resentments, fears, broken relationships.

That's the life and will. 5th step is you physically, literally turn it over. You can't do 3 without 45. 6 and 7 are pretty obvious. The 4th column of faults and mistakes, there's my there's my character defects.

Right? Pick off my character defects. We're gonna make a list of amends to make and then get into the 9th step as he says, bang him into the 9th step as quickly as you can. The 4 step inventory is important enough to do poorly. Do a do a shitty job.

If you stay sober the rest of your life, you'll do many more. You know? But just get it done. Don't snivel and whine about it. And that's what he did for me.

He kept pushing. I showed up after we read the part in chapter 5 about the inventory. I showed up the next week prepared to read. And he sat there and looked at me. He goes, is your inventory done?

I said, well, no. And he says, what do you wanna do? Well, aren't we gonna read? No. You haven't caught up yet.

You gotta do the work, you know. Now, he also told me at the time I got on the 9th step, they were taking meetings to Russia. And I got on the mailing list for this. And I thought I went to him and I said, I'm gonna take I'm gonna carry the message to Russia. I'm going to Russia.

And he goes, why don't you go to Oregon and make your amends? It's amazing how we get things kind of tweaked, you know. So I went to Oregon and I made my amends, you know. I started showing up to people. I started showing up to people.

I started showing up to people you know. I started showing up to people. If the 4th step is important enough to do poorly, the 9th step is important enough to do correct the first time, so you don't screw it up and have to go back and do it again, which I've done. You know, I've screwed up a couple and had to go back and do them again. In this process of making the amends, he was a critical part of that.

The sponsor becomes really critical. One of the things that he did for me, he had no children at the time. I had 2 older boys up in Oregon that were in really bad shape, and I had 2 younger kids at home. And he sent me on a retreat, on a men's retreat, and he says, I want you to go talk to men that have made amends to their children. Before you go up there and do that, talk to these guys.

I talked to a man at the at the time named Byron who I I started asking. I said, have you made amends to your kids? He says, well, just before I came on this retreat, my grown son and I were at a family reunion. I was standing in line getting food. He was drunk.

We got into a fight and ended up rolling into the rose bushes. Right? I said, shit. That's not good. And he goes, yeah.

He said, I made amends to that kid years ago. And he says, I'll tell you something. Those scars don't go away just because you say you're sorry. And I went to Oregon with a completely different attitude because I talked to somebody that actually had that experience. Now he I would have never thought to do that.

He sent me to do that. The other thing that he did for me as I was showing up at his house every week is every once in a while we'd go on a field trip. And we'd end up in a hospital where somebody was having surgery, somebody he knew, somebody that had a disease or an illness of some sort. And we were we'd make house calls, and he would he showed me. He says, this is what we do.

We take care of each other, and we would go visit in hospitals. And I've been doing that ever since, and that's part of the program. Like, he left to say, it's not extra credit. You know? It's part of what we do.

We find out a brother or sister is in trouble. We go we call on them. We go find out what's up. What can is there anything I can do to help her? Just hang up.

We went to see this guy, Jean Jones, who's dying. This guy's dying. He's crippled. He's had several surgeries before. They're getting ready to remove one of his lungs.

And he's telling me this on the way to the hospital. We show up at the hospital, and I don't know this. I feel stupid. I don't know this man at all. I hardly know him.

You know? And we walk in there. He introduces me to this guy. Hey. I brought a newcomer for you, Jean.

And this guy just turns and he just focuses on me and starts talking to me. And I remember clearly having this weird this is like surreal. This is like an acid trip. Why is this man interested in me? Well, now I understand.

He brought me there so that Gene would quit thinking about his problems. And Gene was sober a long time. He knew exactly, oh, fresh meat. You know? So he taught me these things.

When I was 6 months sober, he said, you cannot be a member of Alcoholics Anonymous if your name is not on the 12 step list down at the central office. I rushed right down. I figured that's where they handed out the ID cards. You know? I didn't wanna lose my membership now.

And my name has been on that 12 step list now for 21 years. You know? On one of his birthdays, it was his 6th or 7th or 8th birthday. 1 of the guys he sponsors was answering the phones down at the central office. And we got him a 12 step call as a gift for his birthday.

And you and I and Bill Henzo loaded up in Henzo's van and went and got some loser down by the docks and threw him in the back of the van and laughed pointed and laughed and made fun of him for a while. You know? Took him to the Elano club and took him to some meetings and stuff, you know. This was a gift for his birthday. He called me up one night, middle of the night, middle of the night.

And he says, God is drunk in Wilmington, and he needs us. Now, tonight when I tell my story, you'll find I took a lot of LSD. And no one ever said anything that weird to me. And it's a middle of the night. Wilmington is not a nice place.

And he shows up and picks me up, and he's giggling. I'm scared to death. And he's talking about we're gonna go down and pick up Jesus and take him to the Alano Club, you know. God. You know?

And we get this guy and we load him in the car, you know, And we get this guy, and we load him in the car, you know? And it wasn't very long before I was doing that with some new guy with me. Because that's how I was raised in Alcoholics Anonymous. Now I wanna give Matthew some time here, but I've been with this guy. I've had the same sponsor for 22 years.

And when he says and we joke about this, that it's the longest relationship either one of us have had. And I live in the town that I was raised in, that I went to high school in, and I don't know anybody I went to high school with. I have no relationship with any of those people. I don't think that's their fault. You know, I don't connect real well.

You know? I have a tendency to move on when stuff gets stinky and you know? We've had conflict in 22 years. We've had conflict several times. One time he said something to me that I didn't feel that I deserved.

It really pissed me off, really made me angry. And I found another guy that he sponsored. We were at a meeting and we were having a great time taking his inventory and talking about what an arrogant pompous ass he is, and and we're just we're just having fun. We're both grinning. It's really cool, you know.