Peter M. from Union, NJ speaking and Chris R. from Ingram, TX at the Willing to grow conferece in Vaud, Switzerland

Hi, everybody. I'm Peter. I'm a recovered alcoholic. And, God separated me from alcohol June 23, 1988. And I am a recovered alcoholic.

And if I didn't say that, I'd be falsely humble. It's where God has brought me to, a place called recovered. I don't say recovering, because then that'll excuse a lot of inappropriate behavior for someone who's supposed to be on this path. Right? And I don't say recovering because it's contrary to what my big book tells me and what God can do for me and has done for me.

And I won't say recovering because I deny the greatness of alcohol synonymous and, deny the great solution to a newcomer that we can get to a place called recovered. However, getting to a place called recovered is not just some exclusive club. It's open to all. The hook is we need to follow, as a book says, a few simple rules, the 12 steps in order to experience this power, in order to experience a place called recovered, free from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body, placed in a position of neutrality, safe and protected. The problem does not exist.

It has been removed, and we don't do anything to make that happen other than surrender to this work and follow the plan of recovery outlined in this book. And Chris alluded to this last night about, you know, how we tweak it for ourselves. In doctor's opinion, he talks about using the words plan of recovery. So I show up to a doctor. I I was really ill last night.

And if I went to a doctor's office, I would have done anything he told me to do to relieve me of the symptoms doctor with the flu or some other illness, and the doctor says, okay, Pete. Take this medicine 4 times a day. Just take a few days off from work, drink lots of fluids, and you'll the flu will be gone. I'm gonna follow exactly what the doctor says because I hurt so bad like I did last night. I would have done anything a doctor said.

And I followed our plan of recovery in a few days the doctor's promise to me has materialized because I'm back at work feeling better. The flu symptoms are gone, and away we go. Right? We have a life threatening illness called alcoholism, which is sometimes forgotten about in Alcoholics Anonymous. It's so watered down and gobbled by nonalcoholics sitting in here who forgot what it was like or don't know what it's like for the real alcoholic who walks in here.

And we forget about this this this seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. We forget about how alcohol wants me. Alcoholism wants me dead. We'll settle for me drunk. It becomes kind of this night to Columbus.

Let's hang out for an hour. So we have a solution for the real alcoholic who's dying of untreated alcoholism, whether you're in here for the first time or in here for the 100th time, whether you're subscribing to this work for the first time to get alcohol out of your life and get rid of the symptoms called alcoholism or are experiencing hitting a wall in here for a little while and running around off autonomous untreated. We we we subscribe to the plan of recovery. How come with a life threatening illness where we don't tweak the solution when we go to a doctor for the flu, we don't rewrite the prescription plan, how come it's rewritten in here? 4th steps, I'm not ready for that.

My sponsor says don't do a 4th step because that may make me drink. And the book is good, but I'm gonna do my program. It's an individual program. I work my program. Right?

And in the big book, it says there is a singular solution, not plural. It doesn't say there are a whole bunch of solutions. It says there is a solution. Right? And, again, again, back to the doctor's opinion, it says plan of recovery.

Why do we tweak it in Alcoholics Anonymous? Why is it changed? Why have we gotten so far away from what this thing looked like when it began that it really resembles nothing like Alcoholics Anonymous? I was sharing with Mark earlier. Some places look like bad group therapy.

Who has a problem they wanna share about today? We're already in serious trouble. Case in point, I go to a meeting, in my town in Jersey. My home group was called the Vision for You group in Union, New Jersey, and we talk about the solution to alcoholism, and most people in my town hate us. We're referred to as the elitist AA group, the big book Nazis, big book dumpers.

Don't go to that group. Don't hang around those people until they hit a bottom and then they come looking for us. Right? So I'm at a meeting in my town, and, it was who has a topic or a burning desire they like to share. That's how the meeting opened.

I said, okay. We're in trouble. But I was still and I listened. Maybe I I I came to get and I stayed to give. Right?

And, this one gentleman shared, and it went something like this. I don't know how I got to this meeting tonight. I was driving down this highway, and I looked at all my old watering holes. He says, I'm thinking about a drink. I've been in treatment so many times.

I've been in out of in and out of here. I'm gonna die. I know I'm gonna pick up a drink. I need help, and he went on and on and on. And he says, here's a guy who needs some help.

So I was thinking that the group would shift, would change their focus for the new person. Right before he shared, a gentleman shared about for about 2 days on how he's unemployed again. After this new guy shares, someone raises their hands, says I can identify with that guy, and he says great. He's gonna hook into that new person, and he went and he said this, I I remember what it was like when I lost my job and I was out of work. And the next person talked about getting laid off.

The next person talked about unemployment, and it went on and on and on. And that poor alcoholic who needed help needed a solution was forgotten about because their issues, their dramas of the day were more important than helping the real alcoholic, which made me think, if they're in AA talking about getting laid off from work, are they even alcoholics? Maybe the only real alcoholics in that room that night were me and that new person. And so I went over to make the approach and the powers that be there kept me away from that guy. And I had to really fight to get to him and talk to him about alcoholism and a solution, but they didn't wanna hear from me.

And when I tell you that maybe that guy and me were the only real alcohols in the room, take inventory of the groups you're going to. Because in a lot of groups, that's the real deal. If there's 20 people in the meeting, is it possible that all 20 are in alcoholics, That the majority are meeting, like most of AA, is top heavy in fellowship, and we have no clue what's going on with recovery and service? And service being one drunk worker with another offering them a solution so they could experience the glory of God and then go back into the fellowship and pull somebody else out. How many meetings how many meetings do we go to are filled with real alcoholics.

You can experience that, and you'll know right away because it's evidenced in what you see and what's being discussed before and after the meeting and certainly while the meeting is going on. You call pockets of enthusiasm And people are sharing about the solution and are excited about the solution. And when I need to talk to my when I need to talk about the divorce, I need to talk about the cat or the dog or my job or my boss, I have a sponsor, and I read him inventory about my problems with that stuff. And if I need to share some little dramas. Right?

And they'll listen to me. I've gotten to a place where I have my dramas and self gets in the way and I experience fear. I'll experience resentment. I'll experience anger, but I have a solution to work with it and I can share about it with someone and I'm not gonna take up 2 days in sharing about it. Because getting past it is more important to me than being in it.

Because if I'm in a place of fear, if I'm in a place of resentment, what kind of service can I be to someone else? And I have the road for me has narrowed and the amount of pain I can endure is very little, especially when I know there's a solution to it. Part of this topic I'm supposed to share is on carrying this message. What message is being carried by the home group? Does everyone need to work the steps?

And the the first consideration is this, is my recovery based in abstinence or is my recovery based in spirit? Am I clear that this is spiritual life or spiritual death? Is my recovery based in abstinence? Is my recovery based in, you know, just staying away from a drink? I didn't pick up a drink today, saw him a winner.

Right? My amends is that to my family is that I I'm not drinking anymore. That's enough for amends. I come to a and I can share about anything I want. I don't have to sponsor people.

I don't need to do the steps. Well, apparently, staying away from a drink is is the beginning and end of it all, and then then I question that person if they're real alcoholics or not. And what does their life look like? How how how are they how's their living condition? Are we taking these print are they taking these principles into their homes, occupations, and affairs, or are they AA angels for the 1 hour and then the rest of the 23, the house devils?

What does that look like? Right? You know, you walk in today, I mean, would you like some water? Sure. Have my seat.

How are you today? Let's talk about our feelings. They go home and they're they're cursing at the wife because she burned dinner. But for that 1 hour, they were spiritual gurus. If my recovery is based on abstinence, I don't have to really I'm not really concerned with much.

And trust me, if I or Chris are at the podium, you can't wait for the 2 of us to go home and back to the states. If my recovery is based in spirit, we're looking at something completely new. Because it's vital, life giving when I do and life threatening when I don't, vital for me to have a spiritual experience. It's vital to me to experience the revolution and to experience God. It's vital to me to go work with others, and it's just as vital to me to find out what's going on within my home group and my local AA meetings.

What message are we passing on? If you have a 3rd edition on the on the with a cover, you look at a 3rd edition, I'm not a fan of the 4th edition and I'll spend an hour talking about why, but I won't do it now. They had to correct a lot of things in that 4th edition. On the fly page in the 3rd edition, about the second paragraph down, it says, but the basic text, pages 1 to 164, have remained unchanged. This is the AA message, and they make reference to it as it was done in 1939 printed in 1939.

Pages 1 to 164 have remained unchanged. This is the AA message. So the question to consider is what kind of message is my group carrying? Is my group carrying the message from the first portion of this book? And more specifically and Chris is gonna talk a lot more about sponsorship.

As a sponsor, what message am I passing on to the person who comes to me? Do I stand at the door ready? Flip over to page 18 for a moment. Bottom of the page, squiggly writing. It says, but the ex problem drinker who has found a solution am I an alcoholic who has found a solution, who is probably armed with facts about himself, am I clear about my truth, Can generally win the entire confidence of another alcoholic in a few hours Bill and Bob did it to Bill Dodson, and Bill did it with doctor Bob.

Doctor Bob said about Bill, this guy's got 15 minutes, and I'm done. And 5 hours later, they were still going at it. They spoke each other's language. Bill and Bob emptied up, if you will, for Bill Dotson. Let's tell him what we were like, that we're not coming in as physicians, we're not coming in as mom and dad saying, you better not do this.

We're gonna get down to where he is and talk his language. Until such an understanding is reached, little or nothing can be accomplished. That the man or woman who is making the approach has already had the same difficulty, that he or she obviously knows what he's talking about, that his whole deportment shouts at the new prospect, he is a man with a real answer, that he has no attitude of holy than thou, nothing whatever except the sincere desire to be helpful, that there are no fees to pay, no access to grime. You know, it isn't like, well, you know, you're going for an hour therapy session. Why do they end at 50 minutes?

Right? And then they want their money. I'll sit with a drunk as long as it takes. And when they wanna walk out, they can. And when we're done, we're done.

But I come out the real alcoholic as a man with the real answer, who's clear about my truth, who offers a solution if they care to have it. If not, we'll go about our own way. You go your well, go mine. Am I carrying a message of depth and weight? In doctor's opinion, he talks about carrying a message of depth and weight if they are to recreate their life and have their, lives grounded in the power greater than themselves.

It's vital here. It's a huge responsibility to what sort of message we're carrying. That's why the numbers have fell off. That's why people in AA are dying. We're we're interested in going into the detoxes and the treatment centers to give meetings.

AA goes into all these places to save the alcoholics there, and so many of us are dying in here because we've become this contemporary middle of the road solution fellowship. What do I mean by middle of the road solution? What is that? Any kind of information that doesn't give me clear cut directions on how to have a spiritual experience. For example, 90 meetings in 90 days.

My group does not talk about 90 meetings in 90 days. My sponsor, you'll never hear him say 90 meetings in 90 days, no will Chris or or I. First of all, let's challenge that. When this thing first kicked off, you couldn't make 90 meetings in 90 There wasn't 90 meetings in the planet, yet the recovery rate was through the roof. Yet we've replaced 90 meetings in 90 days with God.

We use that instead of God. And our book is really clear. We had a quick play in God. Why? It didn't work.

Yet we'll play god with a simple statement, make 90 meetings in 90 days, we'll tell a newcomer. Like, that's the beginning and end of the law. Like, that is the solution rather than god. Yet aren't I playing god when I tell a newcomer who walks in here, whether it's after treatment or detox or walking in off the streets, who can't stop drinking? They cannot stop drinking.

They're living step 1. No power, choice, and control, and a blind man can see their life's unmanageable. And we'll tell that person, make 90 meetings in 90 days. Like we know we know they're gonna be able to stop drinking for 90 days without power. That's playing god.

That's arrogant, and that's not taking responsibility for what we for what they ought to be doing, and that is having a spiritual experience as a result of these steps, then telling the new person who walks in the door, guess what? You never have to pick up a drink again, and I have a way to do that. Doctor Bob says, quit drinking for good and all. In our book, it says stopping altogether. These are the book's words, not mine.

Permanent sobriety. And that's something we ought to be like my home group is shouting from the rooftops, we have a solution for you. You never have to pick up a drink again. Not hang in there. Not do it a day at a time.

Now here's a quarter. Call me when you want drink. You can do your last drunk is done if you follow a few simple rules laid out in the book. And that's what a home group sort of be talking about. Not the dramas of life, not column 2 meetings.

You know what I mean by column 2? They did this to me, so let's talk about that for the hour. Rather than someone walking in the door saying, I can't stop drinking. Sit down. We have a solution for you.

Are you a real alcoholic? Obsession, the phenomenon of craving, spiritual mouth, okay, let's go to work. And then the whole group changes to talk about that person and what they can do to recover and recreate their life. And I just wanna kick this out about, carrying this message. We usually focus on the new person.

Most important member of any meeting is the newcomer. Right? So let's help that newcomer recreate their life, get reborn, get resurrected in Alcoholics Anonymous. We come here like they're dying, and we're reborn. We're given new lives.

We have great power. See, contemporary AA will tell you how I don't have power. We're given great power. We're just not the power. We're giving great power, and page 68 talks about that.

That God will demonstrate through demonstrate through us what he can do. That's great power. We get great power in alcoholics anonymous. Right? So we're focused in on the newcomer, the dying alcoholic as we ought to be.

But what about the person in AA who separated from alcohol per year, 5 years, 10 years, 25 years, and is an alcohol synonymous running around untreated. What we need to know is that that person can recreate their life and get reborn if they subscribe to this work Because what'll happen is we'll go through the work maybe once or twice, and we'll we'll stay away. We'll just live in 10, 11, and 12, and we may experience something called reemergence of ego, where the mind starts doing the thinking for us. Instead of being worshipers of this power called God, we start to worship our intellect because I know what the steps talk about. I know everyone in AA.

I know how to stay sober, and I start using my thinking mind where the main problem lies as god. The neat thing about it, we're gonna be 2 years old next week. We're gonna celebrate 2 years. Our our our first meeting was June 10th, which was pretty significant for us. We have our 2nd year anniversary next week, and we're really excited about that.

In just 2 years, we have this lineage, sponsor, prospect, another prospect, another prospect, and you'll go to our group and you'll see people sitting in the car before the meeting, not gossiping about others, not talking about dramas, but with a big book and a notepad going through the steps. There'll be someone else sitting in that car, and you go down to the kitchen, there's a few people sitting there. And we're hanging around after the meeting, looking for new prospects. That's why my home group isn't that popular, because we're not going to give someone an opportunity to just dump and share what they want about in our meeting. And we have people come down with other addictions, and we're in open discussion, and we invite other people from other fellowships to come down, but understand what we are about.

And we've had drug addicts come down and lovingly guide them to CA or NA. We have people with other addictions come down and lovely guide them to where they need to be. If that's my bartender on the phone, can you tell them I'm a little busy right now? It's okay. There's a little pamphlet that was floating around AA.

It was called An Introduction to AA. The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. Right? And that opens up the door for everyone to come down. And it doesn't give us the right to throw anyone out.

But our book also says that the most powerful desire to stop drinking is of absolutely no avail. So in order to stay stopped, just the desire is going to fall short. But having a desire to stop drinking allows me to walk in here. But does it really make me a member of Alcoholics Anonymous? Having a desire to stop drinking, is that enough to bring me to a place called recovery?

Having a desire to stop drinking, does that really allow me to say, I'm a member of Alcoholics Anonymous. And this is what this pamphlet talks about. It says, You may become a member of AA almost automatically, for the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There is no formal initiation or induction. If, however, after examining your record, you honestly and objectively admit to yourself that you're an alcoholic and that you sincerely want to stop drinking, then to become a member, you have to only attend the meetings, make an energetic and sincere effort to be guided by the advice and experience of those about you, and try with complete sincerity to live according to the AA program, not fellowship.

So there's some things we need to do here and one of them, that I love in here, is take to the advice from the elder statesmen And not work my program. And they used the word here, complete what's necessary to live according to the A program, not the fellowship. And we're just so top heavy in fellowship. And we forget about the other three sides of the triangle. So when I said earlier about recovery based in abstinence or in spirit, if my recovery is based in abstinence, am I living in all three sides of the triangle?

Is my group talking about living in all three sides of the triangle? Coming to the fellowship, and in the fellowship, we find the program. I'm not in the program. We don't come to the program. We experience the program within the fellowship.

And then we pass this message on, 1 drunk to another, in service. And when I live in all three sides of the triangle, I become part of the whole. I'm awake, oneness with this power, no beginning, no end. Are we talking about that? Because that's what our book talks about.

Chris, do you want to, Do you have anything? Any questions? Recovery on the bottom of the triangle, fellowship on one side of the triangle, and service on the other side of the triangle. Chris is writing it here. So we come to the fellowship, we don't come to the program.

And within the fellowship, we have a program called the 12 steps. And then we go back into the fellowship and pass the message on in service. Bless you. The basic service AA provides is carrying a message, 1 alcohol to another. Or in one of the four words.

Right at the beginning it says, To show other alcohols precisely how we have recovered is the main purpose of this book. To show other outflows precisely, and they use in our book the words precisely, clear cut, specific, and exactly. How we have recovered is the main purpose of this book. Am I passing that on? Am I giving that to other folks?

Show them precisely how we're covered, because that's a call for sponsorship. What do I do with a prospect? Show him or her precisely how I have recovered through this book. What message am I passing? When I work with others, most people come to me, I've seen them in the rooms, I have this thing for attracting chronic relapses.

My sponsor says, it's penance for my last life, but I get these chronic relapses. But I will still walk them through the book and qualify them. Are they clear on the phenomenon of craving? Are they clear on the mental obsession to alcohol? Do they understand what the spiritual malady is about?

And part of what I do in working with others, besides taking them through the steps, is give them some first step considerations. Go through Bill's story. That he identified with some of the information in doctor's opinion. I'll have them write out a history of their alcoholism. And not a novel, but a quick history of their first drink to their last drink.

And they write about the craving, the obsession, the unmanageability and the consequences. And what we'll do is, we'll talk about the first step. And this is what goes on in my group a lot, because we have step meetings each week. And we'll do the 12 steps in 8 week rotations, and our speakers are really clear on the steps. Not their opinions, but they come at it from experience, out of this book.

And I get them to understand that the insanity of alcohol, for an alcohol, precedes the first drink. That what is lack of power, choice, and control? That I have no input into the decision that's made for me by alcoholism, to go pick up a drink, that I can't safely think the drink through. I can't play the tape to the end. I can't think the drink through because I'm using a sick mind to overcome a sick mind.

Do they get that? That for me, if the main problem center is in the mind, not the body, and we don't tell them, Bring the body and the mind will follow, because that's the last thing we want showing up. Right? And I let them know, that the powerlessness and the lack of choice and control is in the mind before the first drink. And once they pick up the drink, it's in the body.

And to let them know, we talk about how we are going to drink, that's what step 1 tells us. And we have no idea what that day looks like. And then we bring them to step 2. Are they willing, yes or no, to believe in a power grid themselves? Any conception that works for them.

Group of drunks, good orderly direction, not concerned with that. Are you willing, yes or no? A spiritual experience begins with a mustard seed of willingness and we'll get them to step 2. Have them go through chapter 2, the agnostics. Chapter 2, the agnostics will open up all doors where someone has them closed and showing up with God.

It blows the doors wide open. Work with someone through Chapter 10 Diagnostics, and any contempt, prior investigation will be removed because of the considerations in that chapter. Step 3, are you willing to get to this power? Decision. Contemporary A will tell you work the first three steps.

Chris said it before, 1, 2, 3, drink. 1, 2, 3, drink. Step 3 is just a decision to get to the power that I'm willing to grow to and to. And then we walk them through step 4. And we get to look at, we get to look at all the manifestations of self that are killing the alcoholic.

All the contempt, the prejudices, the belief systems, the resentment, fears, we get to look at sex inventory. All those things that are in here that don't want to come out. The wedge that blocks us from this power, got to get removed. One of the disturbing things, why people don't like my group too much and a lot of big book groups, is because we don't talk about what we need to acquire to get better and all our issues and triggers and dramas. We talk about the removal of things in order to get better, and that is not pleasant.

Walking someone through the work is about removal, subtraction, not addition. We don't need to acquire anything. I can't stress enough. I need more tolerance. You don't need to go out there to acquire it.

I need more patience. I need more a loving spirit towards others. I don't need to acquire that. It's been given to me. The reason why I'm not experiencing it is because other things have gotten in the way.

Calamity, palm, worship of other things, and a whole truckload of other areas. And when we go through the work, it feels like we're dying. That's why the work is not popular, and groups that talk about the work are not that popular. We will lose people during inventory because it feels like we're dying, and we are. We're experiencing the death of self.

And ego and the alcoholic mind is fighting for its life. It's about removal. We are when we do this work, by the way, way, going home. God gave us everything we need to walk this journey, when we got here. Everything.

And little by slowly, it has gotten blocked, and other things have become more important, and other things have gotten in the way, and belief systems, we worship. Our thinking mind, we worship. We worship our money, we worship our job, we worship our cause, we worship him, we worship her, we forgot about the simple worship of the power. And what the work does is remove all of that. It doesn't feel comfortable.

Going through the archway is our drastic and revolutionary proposals, and it's uncomfortable. But when we get to the other side, we experience bliss, so things get removed. And go to the Well, I'm going to the sponsor, told me, put the plug in the jug. It's easier. Right?

But when we're experiencing the bitter end, and the back is against the wall, guess what? We'll look for people, groups of people like this, and we'll look for the groups that are talking about the message, because we know it's the last house on the block. And then, we'll revisit the work over and over and over again. And we'll sit down with other people in 5 and talk about this stuff. And that, really, is evidence of God, because if you're anything like me, you came in here and no one's going to know know anything.

Yeah, I'm an alcoholic, but I ain't, I'm not giving up anything. And then we sit with another drunk or do personal purses the multiple 5 steps, like I've experienced recently, and share with groups of people about everything. Everything. All our resentment, all our fears, the sex inventory, our belief systems, all of it. And the wedge that's blocking us from God starts to get removed.

Power of God sees one drunk work with another, and that drunk sharing everything with a group of drunks. That's God at work. The drunk wakes up to that, usually, later. And after some 6 and 7 considerations, you see that same alcoholic, who was consumed with self on the way in here, is now going out and making amends for the harms he or she has caused to others, because they've gotten clear on that. I love my home group and a few other home groups, few other groups that I visit, because they talk about amends, about actively going out and making amends.

Financial restitution, making amends for the harms that they're clear they caused, and getting freer. Talk about amends, other people, other amends that you're not aware of will show up. Contemporary AA, middle of the road solution, does not want to talk about amends. Or if they do, it will go something like this, I stopped drinking, that's enough amends. No, it is not.

Go ask the people you harm, if that's enough. I've annoyed more people than I've harmed. Go knock on the door to Joe's house and say, Joe, did I annoy you or did I harm you? And let's hear it from Joe. Right?

We have to quit playing God. And then we enter the world with a spirit intent, as we clean up our amends. Is my recovery base and absence over a spirit, and what is my group carrying? Am I talking about the promises in step 10? Am I talking about prayer meditative life?

And working with others? Because we can get stuck on the second half or the first step. My life was unmanageable. I couldn't stop the drunk. I had no control of the stopping and the starting.

Treatment center after treatment center. Stopped drinking, come around here a little while, wrinkles get out of my belly, and suddenly my external world looks manageable. She's letting me back in the bedroom, I got a job, I got a pocket full of money, Took a shower to have new clothes on. My life appears to be manageable. I'm cured.

And I get stuck on that. And I forget that alcoholism is a very patient illness also. It'll wait. And I get stuck on the second half of the first step and start to worship external conditions or the feeling good stuff. I feel good today, start to worship my emotions, right?

I feel good today, so I don't need to do anything else. My group, you're going to get called on that. Who are you working with? Who's your sponsor? Where are you in the steps?

That disturbs a lot of people. But you walk into that group, and you're looking for a solution, we'll offer it to anyone. We have people who show up, who just hang around, have a cup of coffee, a few pieces of cake, and don't even put a dollar in a basket and leave. That's okay. Welcome back next time.

Maybe you need to go drink some more. And then you're not consumed with coffee and biscuits, you're consumed with, how do I get better? So, that's all I've got for this morning. Thanks. Just to reiterate something that Peter was alluding to, this is this is this is what happened to me for 7 years around the program.

I was up in the fellowship. The Catholic finally 12 stepped me, set me down and qualified me. He started asking some specific questions. He said, Chris, you know, we got a 3 part program built to to defeat a 3 part illness. And so if you're in all 3 of these parts equally, you'll get well, you'll stay well, you'll stay you'll stay content in your skin, but if you get a little top heavy on some of these other areas, you you won't.

I mean, and he asked me point blank about the recovery piece. He said, Chris, did you start on the title page and do everything I asked you to do in those first 100 pages? Did you work all 12 steps? I will I work them to the best of my ability, you know, blah blah blah. Chris, it's a yes or no.

Come on, Bubba. Did you work them or not? Well, no. Okay. They exit out.

Says, what about this unity? What is that? You know, it's it's meeting. You go into meetings? Yes.

I'll give you that one. What about service? Well, I empty ashtray but she's the book is specifically clear. What's our service is to carry the message to the newcomer. Oh, but I remember you didn't work the 12 steps so you've got no message to carry.

So that's 2. He was pretty direct with me. That's 2 out of 3, you know. I mean, it's like a 3 legged stool, you know. You start cutting legs off and pretty soon you're on pretty precarious balance here, you know.

So once he's got to see that, Chris, you've been living in the fellowship, but you're just not doing the program. Finish the work, then you'll have something to carry with a newcomer. Last night, we were talking, I got talk to some of y'all in break. The spotter for about 3 workshops on the stuff that I was talking about on break. It's just a lot of asking great questions.

In a publication called Doctor. Bob and the Good Old Timers, some of y'all read that one. It's a story of Doctor. Bob and the good old timers. AA published it.

It's a conference approved literature. It's he wrote this in 1940. He says, we did not tell our drinking histories in meetings back then. We didn't need to. A man's sponsor already knew the details.

Frankly, we didn't think it was anybody's business. We all knew how to drink. What we wanted and needed to know was how to get sober and stay sober. Some somebody jam me, you know, I said, well Chris, but you need to understand it's our stories that helps me. I understand that in a 12 step call, if I need to reel you in with my story.

Everybody did that. Evie did it to Bill Wilson. Bill Wilson did it to doctor Bob. Doctor Bob to Bill d and on down the road. That's everybody did that.

But guys, if you got them reeled in, it's like fishing, you know. If you got them reeled in with your story, when are you gonna set the damn hook? When are you gonna reel him in? Start talking about the solution. We just sit around and think that we're gonna get everybody in here.

We have a story, we gotta stop. And this business about sharing our dumping in our meeting, the big book says in the chapter working with others, he says it's not when and how to give, it's in question. He says it's not giving that's in question, it's just when and how to give. Because once we start letting the newcomer depend on us rather than God, we're in trouble. Makes sense?

I need to go to a meeting and talk about what's going on today. Well, did you talk to God about it? Oh, well, no. Well, how does It always kills me when you guys You come into our AA meeting who has historically a poor record with relationships. Right?

And then you come in and say, Well, me and my boyfriend are having some problems and I need to talk about that. Why would you come into this room to talk about your damn Why don't you go to God and talk about that relationship and get some clarity on about what you need to do? Should I stay? Should I go? What?

Should I take that job? What? Should I take that job? Should I not? Who ultimately knows?

Creator of the universe has been my experience. Do I come before the meeting in the fellowship and talk to people about that? Absolutely. During an hour, both, Jim and me, why can't we just talk about the program? On the off chance that there may be a newcomer sitting in here miserable, what Peter referred to earlier, and I just mentioned this and then shut up, In in this hospital where I worked for 13 years, we used to get 1 or 2 old timers in there.

Cats that would have a few years of sobriety and relapse and now they're back in treatment, you know. But mostly what we would get was new people who had never had any quality sobriety. I wanna tell you something, guys. In the last 3 or 4 years, we've noticed this unbelievable change of people that had 7 years, 15 years, 20 years who relapsed. 20 years away from a dream and picked up.

Absolutely tragic to lose that kind of sobriety. And why did they? Because spiritually, they got disconnected. Spiritually, the spiritual malady, the internal condition that we were talking about earlier started to return and they got irritable, restless and discontent. Guys, I introduce myself because the book tells me as a recovered alcoholic.

Introduce yourself as a man who has recovered. What my book said, but I could get sick again if I stop doing the things necessary to stay connected to that power. I will get sick again. Alcoholism will return with a vengeance and I'll use again. And I don't wanna do that, folks.

1987, when I got back to this program, I didn't have anything to lose. Nothing, guys. I had a $600 pickup and a and a couple of pairs of Levi's and a drawer full of t shirts and that was it. Today, I've got a lot of stuff that God has given me and I got a lot to lose. I don't wanna lose that.

So I'm gonna keep working the steps and I'm gonna make sure that I pay attention, that I belong to a group where we focus on this literature. I don't wanna live off the experience I had 18 years ago. I wanna have an experience that I had sitting at that little cafe over where we're staying by the lake talking to God. It takes my breath away. Current experience.

Good can be the enemy of the best. Is this all there is? I mentioned it last night when I talked. My sponsor says, Chris, how free do you wanna be? Do you just wanna not drink one long painful day at a time?

Is that what you want? You can have that. Or do you wanna be absolutely free in your skin to start doing the cool things God wants you to do? Because every one of you got stuff that you're supposed to be doing. And I don't know what that is.

God does. We need more people out playing music, painting pictures, starting businesses, going to school, instead of sitting in meetings and pissing and moaning while their life is so is so boring. Freaks me out. That's not my experience on the spiritual path. It is not boring.

Not boring at all. Our book talks about how we can shield the alcoholic. We can try shielding the alcoholic and working with others. And that doesn't work because he winds up with a bigger explosion than ever. Right?

Bigger drunk. Don't go with his drinking. Watch your issues. Watch my triggers. Things like that.

Can't go to a wedding, can't go to a party because there's liquor being served, I can't be around Frank and Joe because they drink, can't be around my aunt and my grandparents because they drink, and that's that's living in bondage. That's walking on a minefield. And a book promises just the opposite, if we're spiritually fit, we can go anywhere. Right? What about the shield?

What about the shield, you know, the people who use AA as a shield? The shield right in here. And you you can know those people, I'm not talking about newcomers now, because we're encouraging newcomers to make lots of meetings and obviously get involved with our program. But how I've seen too many of our elder statesmen, as I lovingly call them, the old timers, Make the 9 o'clock meeting, the 12 o'clock meeting, the 3 o'clock meeting, the 6 o'clock meeting, the 9 o'clock meeting, hold on till next morning when you get to the 9 o'clock meeting. I've made 4 meetings today in in this over 30 years.