The San Diego Spring Roundup

Hi, thanks for coming. Hate to throw a party. Nobody show up.

My name is Judy Frigoli, and I'm a grateful member of the Worldwide Fellowship of Al Anon and Alatine.

First of all, I'd like to thank Hester and Miguel and the committee for inviting me here. They've also allowed me the freedom to meet with some family members and friends because I had moved recently. That's part of my story. And so I was kind of able to have my cake and eat it too this week. And I would thank you guys for that.

I was talking to somebody the other day about reminding them I was going to be here this weekend to speak and they were making a big production. And I said, you know, God does to me what I cannot and sometimes will not do for myself. I had been asked to speak several years ago in Rio Dose in New Mexico. It's a beautiful area. And I got there and it was my first time to be, you know, asked to go somewhere to speak beyond, you know, city limits. And

I got there and they had me as Judy in from Las Vegas.

I lived in Reno and his DDF so

I was very humble when I spoke.

Thanks A but before I start I would like to know because I like to cover my base. Tell me members a do we have in here today? Who? OK,

Yeah. If I say something that upsets you, please call your sponsor after the meeting, OK?

I learned not to kill her. What I'm saying because who's in the room? I'd like to qualify

myself as an as a member of Al Anon. I'm not an Al Anon because I grew up in an alcoholic home. I'm not an Al Anon because I'm married in alcoholic. I'm not an Al Anon because she can't swing a dead cow out hidden for Alcoholics. I'm an Al Anon because I go to Al Anon meetings and I have a sponsor and I work the 12 steps with Al Anon. That's what qualifies me as an Al Anon.

Just real briefly, I did not grow up in alcoholic home. I certainly related to the other speakers I've heard today and thank you for sharing.

I'm one of the few and I just don't hear very often. I didn't grow up in an alcoholic home. And I'll tell you it was last night, You know, we we heard, we hear it say an A and we certainly hear it in in our own rooms that more will be revealed. I had this little moment of like, woo Hoo.

I came to realize last night that alcoholism touched me when I was about two weeks old. And that's great, a great deal part of my story. But aside from that, I there was no there was social drinking in my home growing up. It was not an issue. It didn't become an issue until I married into the disease.

I grew up in a stone's throw away from here, born and raised Imperial Pearl Valley, and we would come to San Diego for playing and school shopping. And you know, so when I Hester called me so just like to go to San Diego, I'm like, yes, you know, and so there's no, there's not a whole lot of excitement down in Imperial. You know, you go watch carrots grow in Hopeville and you know, things like that. But you know, it was a very quiet, what I would call semi normal childhood.

The way it started for me, however,

is I was actually born in Brawley. We had my parents and now we had two siblings were living in Imperial. For those of you that aren't familiar with territory down there, Raleigh is about a 20 minute drive. I have no idea which direction anymore have been there forever. And when I was two weeks old, they were on their way back to the hospital to make payment on me. The back thing you got to do that and the hospital, pioneer Hospital is right on a curve as you come out of Raleigh and they were going in. So they were making a left to go into the hospital. And the story has it a drunk driver T boned him.

My mother was holding me. No seatbelts back then. Brother and sister in the backseat. They're one and a half, 2 1/2 years old. They're bounce around. My mother and I were ejected from the vehicle and I got flung off in a ditch. She damn near died. She spent three months, three months in the hospital. My dad was 2425 years old. He already had three children. Couldn't find me. Finally found me about 300 feet away in a ditch.

I was scraped up but apparently OK. So yes I thought. Fell and buck my head

blonde. No, Gian, I got problems.

There were good family friends of ours that now live in Albuquerque, NM, that we're living in that same area at the time. So he called them and they picked up my brother and my sister that night. And then the next day they picked me up in the hospital, released me and my mother spent three months in the hospital, severe injuries, head injury, internal injuries, everything. When she got out and went got back home, it like I said, it'd been three months. My brother who was 2 1/2, he remembered my mother. But for those of you that are parents know that when your children are that small, their memory span is about equal to that of an Ant. They don't, I mean their memory, they don't remember

my sister had forgotten my mother. So the people that had kept us, that's who mom was, you know, to her. Now they had they already had five children of their own. They had each gotten married with their own their own kids and emerged family. So for three months they had eight children and all in the age of 7th grade down to newborn.

And I was always dressed up, apparently looked like I was ready, got my picture taken. I was wonder why little fussy sometimes about clothes after that. So when my mother called and said, OK, bring me the kids. Now, the woman who had a woman named Judy, that's what I was named after, she said, Are you sure? She said, yeah. Now they already knew the whole story by this point. My mother had no memory of me because at that time she had no memory of having me, of going nine months of pregnancy, absolutely no memory. They told her she had a newborn.

So then when they hit, when she was handed me, you know, and I didn't even get the story till I was like

21 years old and which is just a few years ago,

there was number connection. Now I didn't know this for many, many years. I knew that there's something not right. I was never treated any different. Have there's a fourth child after me. There's four of us, two of each. I was never treated any different, but yet I was felt different. And looking back on it now, now knowing what I there just wasn't that mother, mother child bond, not her fault. That's just the way it was. Never could figure it out.

I remember saying to her, I was probably, you know, my memory of being young. I don't know. I apparently was there, but don't remember. I remember being mad at her for something and I just, I was and I remember stomping my little feet and I was probably, I'm going to guess 6-7. And I just remember saying you don't love me like you love the other kids. And I'm sure that just ripped the heart out of her because I'm sure part of it's like there's still no connection yet. It's still a child of hers. So she made me a shirt later that says mom loves Judy and I'm the only one got one. You know,

I have an older sister and it's always if she gets one, I get one kind of thing. So

that's how alcoholism, alcohol is. Merchant touched my life. It took me many, many, many, many, many years to find that out.

Once I grew up and got out of school, I couldn't wait to get out of the valley, you know, And I, I left my sister by that point had moved to Reno and my parents, my dad had been transferred to Edward Air Force Base in Lancaster from Hobby Desert. So when my job ran out after I got out of high school,

it was time to book it. So I'll move to Lancaster and I got lived there for several years. So I turned 21 and then it was time to make another move because my sister called me said what are you doing? I'm saying no, no, trying to figure what I want to do with my life. She said, once you come to Reno, I'm like, why not? Had no bills, had a set of wheels, Let's go. Took the caps and I hit the road and

I've never been to Reno, who my dad had to give me the map and say go north. And it was fun. I spent the next 21 years in Reno and I met him a year later after I moved there. And, you know, we did a little typical part in high school and that kind of stuff and never hung out with people who did drugs that they brought the drugs that I left had AI, saw too many things happen even at a young age. So I just had chosen for never to hang around that I didn't know what. I didn't know what to look for. I just knew that if it did look right, I left OK

once I moved to Reno, and I met him a little over a year later at the rodeo. Now in Imperial, there's a PRC rodeo that comes through Raleigh, but we never went because my dad always went as a kid. He got bored of it, so we never got to go. So rodeo was fun, those big Cowboys and got some leather things on and you know

chaps you guys chips.

So I went to the rodeo with a friend of mine. I got to know it works and she was a local Rep for black velvet. He was one of the reps, one of the sponsors of the local rodeo in this PR state circuit saw the big names were in and she had me stuck on a blind date with a doctor. I'm like cool, this works, you know. So I'm hanging out with all the local black velvet reps and for those of you that aren't aware of it, you must be blonde to be a black velvet Rep.

OK, since I had the prerequisite cowboy hat, got the boots, but I'm not a Rep. I'm just hanging out with them. I don't think anything about it. Now, I didn't know this story from my my soon to be husband until quite a few years in the sobriety because he wouldn't own up to it. I will tell you that when I met him, it started the Whirlwind Rd. What a what a trip. What a trip with this man. He saw us when they the Reno rodeo is a very big thing now, but at the time they're kind of working on a rinky dink budget. And they had, you know, one of those mobile trailers you set up for an office

Center for the hospitality Center for all the rodeo members, the rodeo participants and all the people that got to take advantage of the perks. And so they had them set up. You have like a four step or up and coming in one door. It's One Direction. Get your drinks out. It's all free booth, anything you want. And so I'm standing in the mud and the horse stuff and you know everything. And I'm just talking to these girls. I don't have a clue that somebody's pegging me to be a black velvet Rep. And he came and apparently he went through the

He's a six three was 63,

200 and 4050 lbs big guy, OK. And he went through, got his little drink and he came out. He's kind of surveying the crowd. He tells me and he sees me with all the other blondes and he knows all the other ones. They all got boyfriends, husbands, whatever. I'm a new one. So he just horned in right in there. And so he went to take a step out because he's just going to be Joe Cool. Well, the guy that's bigger than him, his name's Andy. Move the steps on him. And he didn't know it. So he went to take a step out of a four stepper put into the mud. He went

to this daddy gets given a year's worth of salary to see that. And so he picked you out. He and come along picked him up by his back belt loop, which just amazes me, and dusted him off and sent him on his way. OK, so he kind of horned in on the conversation. We were off and running from that moment on and it opened up a world that was so new and exciting to me.

You know, I'm just young dumb little country girl from Pearl, you know, and just didn't thought I knew something, just didn't have a clue. And rodeo became a very special time for us. We've been planned our wedding around the rodeo, OK, and we were engaged once, broke it off, got engaged again, got married. That became a pattern not to not realize at this time. Of course, I had a fairly decent job. I was in the real estate industry and moving up now. When I met him

now, somebody was talking again. I honestly don't remember which one it was. I think it was this morning

that once I heard his story, and I will never forget it, my conscious thought was this poor man didn't have a chance. He needs me

and was very conscious thought on my part. He did have a rough childhood growing up and that's his story, but he truly just started out with everything against him.

And I knew that he needed me because I had all the advantages growing up in a nice, you know, home that we had everything we needed. Sometimes what we wanted had our schooling, we had our parents support and loved best of their ability. You know, this poor man didn't have it when I met him at that weekend. His the mother of his son was staying with him and his girlfriend and all the kids,

you know, and I'm like and I didn't see anything wrong with that.

I'm still wondering that bump my head apparently affected me more. Not ever thought and I just thought we got to get these people out of his life, you know, just clean them out and took me a couple years, but I succeeded because once I set my once I set my side on a goal, I don't give up. That also has attribute has become a deficit and sometimes it's still an attribute. We finally did manage to get married and I got to tell you what happened with that

once. We were engaged the second time and my parents were very angry with me because they already met him by this point,

just knew that this was a huge mistake. But they wouldn't tell that to me. My dad did come to Reno for the wedding. My mother would not. It was a poor excuse she had. I thought, fine, whatever. I didn't again. Sometimes you know, what appears to be a bad thing turns out to be a good thing. That lack of connection wasn't that created. Not that big of a deal for me.

A week before now, what my husband would do when he would go drinking is he wouldn't drink at home where I could keep an eye on him. He'd have to be out in the sick of it. OK, right. Where all the reaction was. And there was one place in particular called Bishops. You know, it's kind of on a part of town. It was becoming questionable. And in the backroom, they did things that were highly illegal.

And I always knew I took great pride in going. I could find him if I want him, you know, I just refused to go look for him.

But when he would go drinking, he would be gone. He wouldn't go drinking and stumbling at 3:00 in the morning, he would be gone. In Reno you can drink 24 hours a day. And so it would always be two days, 3 days, whatever. So we went through numerous, you know, several years of this in and out and, and I'd been living at the Tahoe when I first met him and finally got to come back down to Reno and a week before the wedding had it out with him one more time. Same story, different thing, you know. And I remember going in and we were my apartment, and I remember going into my bath and I shut the door and I stood there with my fist,

which has often become a pattern, and said, God, if I'm supposed to marry this man, give me a sign he didn't drop dead. So apparently I was supposed to Miriam. So the wedding went through

now, so we had our family friends who had taken care of me when I was a newborn by this point had moved to Albuquerque. They were coming to Reno for the wedding. He had, if you guys ever done this ever to limit the alcoholic, like one thing, just do this one thing, you know, just one thing, you know, and I had, he had one thing to do. You know, first of all, he wanted to have his bachelor party the day before the wedding. I'm like, I don't think so. OK

'cause I already knew alcohol was a problem but I figured it was because he didn't want to behave

heard that term earlier today too and he was just being irresponsible so I could show him and so I said no. So we went round and round and round and round and I was like 3 days before and his best man I told him I said I hold you responsible okay? And I knew it was going to bring have a problem with that. I had no problem with him drinking it was just stop it at a reasonable hour. Well, ask an alcoholic to define reasonable. OK,

so I said, all I need you to do is to show up by 9:00

on this morning because the Albuquerque people will be in. That's all I need you to do. And he had one Troy, that afternoon. He didn't make it, you know, surprises, surprises. So of course, I want to hurt him. And then he had to still make it to the tux shop. And my dad was coming into town. I'm like, I'm going to kill him. You know, we're talking to this wedding. And I went to the tux shop to finish up the funnel business and have a friend with me. And I asked this poor girl who's running the cash register. Has by any chance the groom shown up?

You know, and I'm sure I was just a picture of, you know, wedded bliss to come.

And I hear this. Hi, honey. You know, and he's just reeking. You smell him before you see him and he's stumbling on like you're driving. He goes, it's okay, it's okay. You know, I had called his best man early that morning and said, where is he? The wife wouldn't get him out of bed for starters, because he was passed out. And I said, get him up.

She said he's asleep. I said, don't make me come over. You will regret that. Give him up. So he dragged himself to the to the phone. He said, you know, I said, where is he? Where to lead him? He said, spats, I'm like, I'll get you later, you know, because that was across the road from Bishops. And so he, he, he shows up. I don't know God, I don't have any clue. He only got 1 DUI in his drinking career. Absolutely astounds me with only one. And so I leave because I'm so disgusted. We're going to go get ready to get married. And I'm going around one corner. My dad is coming in the other corner around the other side

and I don't know this and they end up meeting and idiots drunk.

We still did it, we still got married. And The funny thing about it if he was such as it was sober for him. I am the one that got drunk after the wedding.

I hadn't eaten.

We we were off and running. We truly were. And it was still fun. There was a lot. There were a few good, good few, few good years in there and in a good friend of his, another one who's best man ended up moving back to Boston and he ended up hooking up with somebody else that he'd been drinking with a long time, got married and

that wedding was the end of the drinking career. That was the very that was the end. By this point, he had already been diagnosed with potential liver problems and he said all the doctor just has to come back and I'm like, OK, you know, I tried to control his drinking by limiting what he could drink when we were at functions. Now he knew that I was extremely naive, didn't have a clue about a lot of things. I didn't know about the extracurricular activities because I didn't know the signs. It explained a lot later, you know, like how can you stay up for four days? How do you do that?

You know, and he

there was already, we already had enough things going on. There was lots of signals, lots of bells and sirens and I ignored them all

because he can always explain his way out of it because he always found what I considered enough truth to the situation where I would bite the whole story. OK. And when it came time for this last wedding, we were I was, I was just about done. I just couldn't take it anymore. And I don't have going to detail you guys. We've all been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. OK so he of course disappeared after the Bachelor

party and he finally calls me and he says come get me. I said where are you now, mind you where he was

and he told me and I'm like, I need a guard to get over there. I'm not going there by myself. And I went and picked him up and he just, he was so bad by this point, he would just reek got him clean. He got himself cleaned up because I was already, I'd already punishing him. You know, I treated him like a petulant 2 year old, but I could always justify how I could treat him

and he didn't put up much fuzz because it wasn't worth it to him. So did the wedding. He ended up disappearing again. We had a big fight, he split, you know, whatever was going on and I thought I'm done. And this is about end of January. So I thought when he comes back, I'm throwing him out. I'm done. Now what I haven't told you because I forgot since I, I always forget this part. Middle of January, I'd been working in the escrow industry and my company had been sold. We did such a good job with the company and the office

LA sold us. So we went through the rehiring process and I decided to stay with company that was coming in. At that time, I could have written my ticket anywhere in town. So that was a year prior. So within that next year, everybody who had come in from the company that got sold was fired for one reason or another. Now I got fired also, OK, And I was an extremely lucrative job at the time. Now I blamed a manager for it. The real problem was I was so

twisted over what was happening in my life, not knowing which direction was coming from.

I stood in my office morning at 6:00 in the morning already at work and it was dark because it's January Sereno and it's snowing. And I just and I sit up, fists clenched and said, God, Get Me Out of here. What I forgot to say was give me another job.

Two weeks later I was fired. OK, two weeks later he's doing his what turns out to be the last drinking episode of his at that time career. And when he finally called me.

And I was, I was hiding the ATM card. I was afraid he'd come in, I'd be asleep and I wouldn't know he'd get the ATM card and get the money out of the bank and you know that stuff. And he come and he said, and I hear fot machines, you know, the machines in the background. So he's obviously the casino. I've been hard to figure out, He said. As soon as I get the truck out of the impound yard, I'm going to go to the hospital.

Now the back of my mind is like, well, why is the Turk in the impaling yard, You know? And I didn't ask that question, though, because I'm like, OK. And he said, I think I'm an alcoholic. I'm like, really? You think

he says and then I said, do you want your insurance information? He's like, no, I'll call you later. I said, OK, we were worried be it been three days solid. I stayed right up with him through all that. So he went in the hospital and and I found out, you know, later on they talk about me in the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous because I found out that so many people

we get so focused in on the alcoholic that the family members get lost in the shuffle. It's so easy. People would ask me, well, how's my my new name for him? It's stupid. And they asked me how he was and I would just be happy to tell them. Oh, he's an alcohol drug rehab at fixed it up hospital. And, you know, I went through the whole thing and it sounded so cool rolling off my lips, you know, And nobody ever asked me how I was somebody,

you know, And because I, you know, I was always accused of having a strong personality. Well, that strong personality survived and it was my surviving tool.

So apparently it was never issued anybody that how I was. And when I went in the next morning to see him after he admitted himself and I dragged drugged the guy who hit hadn't left for his honeymoon yet. I'm like gone, you're going with me and we go down there and here's this huge man just kind of fetal position in this chair. And there was a there's a phrase in the big book that I just keyed in on because that's who seemed to me to describe him. That's that pitiful demoralized.

I'm going to get it wrong.

Incomplete, huh?

In comprehensible demoralization. Thank you. I never get that right. I just know what? I just know what it makes me feel like. And my heart just went out to him. I thought that poor baby, I couldn't throw him out, You know, poor guy. He's learned his lesson. And,

you know, so we were off and running. He did his 30 days in the hospital, actually did three weeks. The insurance made him day track the last week and

I was unemployed, totally unemployable. When I got fired, I lost any sense of Maine that I ever hoped have because I'd put so much into my work. Because you see, there was nothing at home. So therefore my entity became what I was at work. And I could push them around at work and I could kick a few cans at work, get away with it, you know, up until I couldn't get away with it anymore. And so he would come once he got home, got done with a 30 day hospital program,

he came home and he started getting on me about going down on and I'm like why? Well, he didn't know. He just knew the words.

OK, But he and I find out later. Again, I have to relate to Benji. I heard a lot listening to him talk at meetings, you know, and or at camp outs when he would do his little spiritual thing around the campfire and I would find out information, you know. So I didn't want to miss a meeting because I'm like misinformation because he wouldn't tell me.

And he actually want me to go to Al Anon because he started going to a meetings, but he didn't want to be in the same house with me. So he figured he give me, you know, get me to go to Al Anon. He's get an hour and a half off and you know, I went to all the families at the hospital and they told me to go to Al Anon. I'm like, why? And that's when was my first case of counselors that like to help people but don't really have a clue what Al Anon is.

So because they don't go themselves. And so I wouldn't go. And then when he starts telling me I'm like, God, that's going to motivate you to go, I dig in my heels and say, no, I'm not going. And he actually had about 60 days of quote recovery time before I finally stepped in the doors of Al Anon. And my first Al Anon meeting was April 5th, 1988.

And it took me a long time to remember how to go look that up because it didn't write it down. I forgot. I just remember what kind of a meeting it was. But I went because he was all over my back to go. And I was dutifully going to the family meetings at the rehab center at the hospital. And there was this one woman who would go and her husband was like retread and he had checked in the same day my husband had. And for his second go around and they would ask us, what do you do for yourself this week? And you know what? My mind went blank. I had no clue.

And

she'd sit there and she'd always talk and she'd talk about going down on me, and she'd always cry. And I'd think to myself, quit going. You keep crying. Quit going. This can't be good.

And so so then she kind of got on me, you know, about going. I'm like, I don't want to go cry, cry. If I cried today, I'm going to get mad, you know, and you know, so far I wouldn't just shut him up. And so the first thing I went to, I'm going to tell you real briefly was the Ilana Club in Sparks, NV. And it was the most the best dive a could have ever had a meeting in, you know, an Al Anon stuck in the little bunk room

and

you know, the folding dope balls, you know, real lots of privacy and went to this meeting. And the only reason I was because I found out we had books because somebody came into one of the family meetings with a book and there was a 12 step book, our first one. And I said, you have books. I'm a very avid reader and to me that's a very tangible instrument that I can use. Naomi told me I had books. OK, I'll go, you know. So I went to the meeting and there was this little guy that was in the wrong meeting

and he was God,

he was talking about his whatever he was saying and all I keyed in on was the next day he was going to find out if he was going to get more shock treatments. I'm like, whoa, whoa, man, I am in the wrong room. He scared me and besides, I'm not going back to that. But now this woman who's been all over my back that kept crying about going down Anon we left because she she took me and she apologized for the meeting. She qualifies for our program very nicely also.

So I said OK, not going back to that one. I don't even like the area. So we went to the next. The next week I went to the what became my Home group Wednesday night. By the way, my new Home group is a Lake Norman AL Anon family group in Mooresville, NC.

OK, best meeting because it's the only meeting.

So the next week I went to the Windsor night meeting which became the Wednesday night of winners in Reno, NV court and Rainbow. And the topic that night was the phone list, you know, and down how you guys do it here. But on the back of the meeting list you have a little phone list and people that are, you know, have no problem receiving phone calls. And they talked about that as a tool of recovery, which takes about 5 minutes, but they drug it out for an hour.

We left, she apologized again.

Like all right, you guys get three, that's all you get a three times very better next go around.

Have no idea what they said the next meeting, but apparently enough to keep me coming. But this point now we're in April now my husband's not happy now he's quite now he can tell me about it. He says I'm not happy. I want a separation. I said no, Now

I'm 57, shrinking a little bit apparently over the last couple years, but I'm 5-7 and he's 62. And I never hesitated to go toe to toe, eye to eye with him. Never even occurred to me he could go and flick me across street. OK, I'm not too great pride in that. And I heard Sue D talking several times and I related to a lot of what she has to say. And it occurred to me, Oh, my God,

I was putting myself right in the path of freight train. Never even occurred to me. And so when he told me he wanted separation one more time, never occurred to me, I'm going to get in trouble here. Or I could. And I said no, because I'm still unemployed. I can't find a job that's going to pay me anything. And but this point, nobody in industry would touch me because now I had a reputation. It didn't matter that what my skills were. It mattered what my attitude was. And so I had no way to pay the rent. He was at least working some little crummy job. And then he

he copped an attitude

and then he got hurt in the job. And this is about after a month after he said he wanted separation. I said no. So we just suffered. And then he didn't work for a week. There's absolutely not a nickel coming in. You know, I'm thinking I'm going to have to share the dogs food pretty quick, you know, and I just said, you know what, get out.

He was like what? I said get out and he did out of anger. I didn't think it out and I just did it out of anger. I said you're not even, you know, you're not even bringing any money in and you treat me like this, Get out again. A pattern was established in our lives. So he moved, but then I gave him the rules of the separation.

How many Alcoholics follow rules? OK, haven't met one yet. OK,

that's just really sad. And so I went to I went to my meeting and they let me cry about it. And this woman who would soon become my sponsor, he came up to me and she's a very, very dangerous thing. She said, are you going to keep coming? I looked, I went, I guess I hadn't really thought about it yet, she said. Because, you know, if you don't,

you're going to find another one like him, but he's going to be worse. I'm like, that is not happening, man. So she scared me into coming. OK.

Then they gave me a job because somebody saw that I needed to have. It wasn't enough to be there for me. I hadn't gotten there yet. I needed a job. I needed a reason to be there that was tangible. So I became a literature chair. Three months later, they promoted me to alternate GR. Another month later, promoted me to GR, sent me to an area assembly. OK, six months being into the program and

we, you know, we were still, we were still going through the separation and, and that was first time I ever became jealous of anything he, that he did or where he was and never gave a thought before. Because frankly, they talk about me and understanding ourselves, alcoholism. I didn't come in here crying and just a victim. I came in here with an attitude and with an ego to match. Okay, there's a few other words in there I hate to use. So they still send me shivers. I won't use them. And so I needed to have a reason to go and I needed to be in service because, and service is a truly big part of my recovery. That's when I kept coming

because I made a promise and most, most members of Al Anon will die completing that promise. OK. And so, but I knew I was trying to find, I knew where he lived. He ended up getting this little apartment about this big OK and he was a studio over in downtown Reno. And I would call him

and if the phone rang more than twice, I was extremely angry. I was outraged because it doesn't take that long to cross the room to answer the phone. So I know he was out. OK. And we just, we, we just did the alcohol two step. You know, he's sober the whole time, apparently. And by the end of that year, he said, you know, he he came to me and he always figured out because I wasn't paying attention, he could two step me into making a decision, taking an action.

And later I figure out because that means he didn't have to take responsibility. He goes, hey, Judy did it.

So he was trying to maneuver me into a corner and I was messing around, going down alone every week, you know, and he tried to maneuver me in the corner where I said I wouldn't. I didn't want to be married to him anymore. I enjoyed being married. I really did. Aside from all the alcoholic stuff. I mean, I liked it, you know, And I like to have that back one day if God deems it appropriate.

And

he said, he said, well, OK, let me ask you this. If I follow the papers, will you sign them?

I'm like, I don't know.

He said, OK, mommy let me ask this. And he tried. He took a run at it like three times. And I wouldn't give him a concrete answer because I'd learned in Al Anon, don't do that. If you really want a frustrating alcoholic, don't give him a straight answer.

Try it.

But more importantly was for me because I wasn't about to make that decision because frankly, I didn't want the divorce. I wanted to see if we could find a way to create a new relationship. And I wasn't going to say yes. I wasn't going to say no because I was tired of being the one of calling the shots. I took that job on voluntarily, but I wasn't going to do it anymore.

And I thought, you don't want this. You're going to have to be the man with the waybos to take care of it. I'm not doing it for you. So he finally got to that point where he said I'm done. I said fine, you know, do what you got to do and also what I got to do. And we were at a or not we, but we were both at the same function. It was a

there's a gratitude dinner and they always have a dance. I hate dances. Never had good luck at them things. And I saw him acting in such a way that was so disrespectful to me. I damn, you're killed in that night. I remember I went up to the dance floor and got him by his earlobe and drag him off that floor 63. I'm 57, OK, he's got a few pounds on me. And I just said, I can't believe you're doing this. And I just read him the right act And I, I stomped off and I tried a lot of things with him to, to shock him into awareness because you see, these things would have worked

me. So it only made sense that it should work for him. OK, he does speak English. He does know how to communicate. But you know, I never could get through that. And I found that I spent a lot of time prior to sobriety and definitely after sobriety came into our home of trying to get him to feel the way I felt. So he would understand. Because you see, if he would, could understand how I felt, he wouldn't do that anymore. I now know that that is an impossible tour because I, I will never act and think the way alcoholic does. And for that, sometimes I'm grateful

and sometimes I'm not. By the way, I love alcohol. It's you guys are fun people, OK, sometimes in smaller doses than others, but you know, you're, you know, so I, I mean, I love alcoholic, you know, that's why I was attracted to one. The, the personality is wonderful, but I can't think like you, you know, and, and it will just never be. And so,

you know, he finally filed the papers I signed and said we're done. Now through all of this, his first year, serious financial devastation hit us. Oh, pardon me, it hit me. Did you see? I put everything in my name because he wasn't responsible. So he wasn't going to get anything in his name. So when it hit the fan, I'm the one on the ship that went down. And it took me a lot of years to do a lot of repair on that

and umm,

which I'm through all that now. And you know, so I start, I got very heavily involved in service because there was nothing else left to do. I was finally working some of the crummy job, feeding the dogs and trying to move along. So we were first time keynote, keyword first time. We were divorced December 1988, the year that he had gotten sober.

After that, then I don't say like six months or so, he decided that Gene, maybe the grass wasn't so greener out there and he wanted to reconciliation. I made him work for it. OK. I said it's going to be a few carrots this time, the cost to get in the door. And we did reconcile and we remarried and he put the pressure on me to see. I also heard in my meetings that I went to that